Snake's LED build

S

siptang

Guest
Seth, maybe you can look into this for me. I currently have power cord per driver can we combine several drivers into one? For example I have 2 cords for blue and I would prefer it in 1 power cord to save some clutter and make room in my apex power brick.
 
snakeblitz33

snakeblitz33

Well-Known Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by novahobbies http:///t/393132/snakes-led-build/20#post_3495320
That IS a good price!
I know... I don't know if I can pass it up, to be honest. I mean, Yes, I like Crees... but heck, they are so expensive. The thing about LEDs is that they are highly efficient - and even though CREE LEDs are the most efficient out there so far - you still have to turn them down to keep them from burning your corals... so why not use an LED that is not as "efficient" but is 1/4 the cost and able to be ran at max and be just fine?
 
2quills

2quills

Well-Known Member
You dont always have to turn them down Seth. A lot of it really comes down to planning. Usually qjen using optics is where you might have to be careful. You could use a few less leds if you went with crees. Or spend around the same and use more of another brand. But that means more wiring and soldering pluss a few more leds that have the potential to burn out and need to get replaced down the road. In my eyes its really a wash. Theres no reason why you cant build something just as cheap using the more efficient stuff.
 
snakeblitz33

snakeblitz33

Well-Known Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2Quills http:///t/393132/snakes-led-build/20#post_3495352
You dont always have to turn them down Seth. A lot of it really comes down to planning. Usually qjen using optics is where you might have to be careful. You could use a few less leds if you went with crees. Or spend around the same and use more of another brand. But that means more wiring and soldering pluss a few more leds that have the potential to burn out and need to get replaced down the road. In my eyes its really a wash. Theres no reason why you cant build something just as cheap using the more efficient stuff.
Less LEDs may cause spotlighting - which is what I have heard is a major problem with DIY Cree units. Bridgelux leds - yes, you use more of them, but then you have more coverage. At about $0.50 an led for Bridgelux, replacing an LED isn't that bad. Soldering isn't a problem - that's just lazyness. Sure, you can build something cheap using Crees...
By the way, the Bridgelux leds can also use Meanwell drivers (I'll be getting a couple of meanwell drivers with my kit.) ... so if I wanted to switch over to CREE leds, I have the dimmable drivers for them already.
I'll be ordering a kit from aquastyleonline this afternoon. :D
 
snakeblitz33

snakeblitz33

Well-Known Member
This whole thing is still under $275 so far. Aside from the canopy, this is actually a pretty good and pretty cheap alternative if you want to get into some easy LED lighting... $40 from China isn't that bad, IMHO.
 
2quills

2quills

Well-Known Member
You know there are cheaper places to get cree leds than rapid and some of those other guys right? FWIW though rapid does free priority mail shipping on orders of $200 or more.
 
S

siptang

Guest
True but still. This day and age? Whew.
I got 30 more lights. (20 whites and 10 extreme royal blues) that I will eventually add on.
Corey - I'm looking online and maybe I'm not putting it together in right words but can you tell me how I will be able to put the wires together for 2-3 drivers into a 1 power cord ? I'm trying to grasp the concept lol.
 
2quills

2quills

Well-Known Member
Cree should be paying me royalties. Really im just trying to break it down for ya to see that there are clear differences. Not all crees are the same but it seems as though we sometimes talk about em like they are.
Think about it this way...if you have to drive less efficient lets at a higher rate of current to get the same par as crees then you're going to burn them ou t faster in the long run. So innitial up front cost doesnt always work out the cheapest in the long run.
I'll just leave it at that and let the build progress as planned.
Sip, you have two wires on each driver for the 120v hookups. Take your black wires from the blue drivers and connect them with the black wire on the power cord. Same thing with the white wires. Thats all there is to it. Repeat process for the white drivers.
 
snakeblitz33

snakeblitz33

Well-Known Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by Siptang http:///t/393132/snakes-led-build/20#post_3495382
True but still. This day and age? Whew.
I got 30 more lights. (20 whites and 10 extreme royal blues) that I will eventually add on.
Corey - I'm looking online and maybe I'm not putting it together in right words but can you tell me how I will be able to put the wires together for 2-3 drivers into a 1 power cord ? I'm trying to grasp the concept lol.
Eh, considering that a package has to travel half way around the world in less than 20 days to be delivered to my doorstep for $40.... yeah, I think it's a good price. lol. That's good to know that you had to order more. I was thinking about that yesterday - thinking about how you probably need to order more to get the PAR that you need - especially since you went with Bridgelux. That's probably what I will have to do as well if I go with Bridgelux too... the 72 stars...
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2Quills http:///t/393132/snakes-led-build/20#post_3495385
Cree should be paying me royalties. Really im just trying to break it down for ya to see that there are clear differences. Not all crees are the same but it seems as though we sometimes talk about em like they are.
Think about it this way...if you have to drive less efficient lets at a higher rate of current to get the same par as crees then you're going to burn them ou t faster in the long run. So innitial up front cost doesnt always work out the cheapest in the long run.
I'll just leave it at that and let the build progress as planned.
Sip, you have two wires on each driver for the 120v hookups. Take your black wires from the blue drivers and connect them with the black wire on the power cord. Same thing with the white wires. Thats all there is to it. Repeat process for the white drivers.
LOL! I know that if you have to run the LEDs at max, they won't last as long - and that's the point of these little units - is the time that it takes to burn out and the what heat that they don't produce... Otherwise people would still be using T5s and Halides for all their lighting needs and never consider LEDs as a viable option. The reason I want to go with LEDs is because of the heat and the control options...
I still want you to contribute to the thread. You make me think - that is why I still haven't ordered anything. I'm kinda on the fence when it comes to this decision to go with either Bridgelux or Cree. I know what you are saying about CREE LEDs, but dang, for that price? If you know somewhere to order them for cheaper, let me know... I'll go that route. I have been trying to find them cheaper - anywhere other than China, and can't.
what I might do is order a couple of drivers and some LEDs and a potentiometer this week and then every two weeks or so order a driver and some more LEDs etc. etc. until it's all here.
Corey - have you ever heard of Cree LEDs making a "disco" in the tank?
 
snakeblitz33

snakeblitz33

Well-Known Member
I'm tempted to just do a driver and string at a time as money comes in. I'm not really in a hurry to get anything done on this tank. I'm just ready to get some lights over it so that I can start adding a few corals.
But, I have to swap out the sand I got in my tank right now for something a little more coarse. This oolitic sand that I have is blowing all over the place!
 
2quills

2quills

Well-Known Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by SnakeBlitz33 http:///t/393132/snakes-led-build/20#post_3495395
LOL! I know that if you have to run the LEDs at max, they won't last as long - and that's the point of these little units - is the time that it takes to burn out and the what heat that they don't produce... Otherwise people would still be using T5s and Halides for all their lighting needs and never consider LEDs as a viable option. The reason I want to go with LEDs is because of the heat and the control options...
I still want you to contribute to the thread. You make me think - that is why I still haven't ordered anything. I'm kinda on the fence when it comes to this decision to go with either Bridgelux or Cree. I know what you are saying about CREE LEDs, but dang, for that price? If you know somewhere to order them for cheaper, let me know... I'll go that route. I have been trying to find them cheaper - anywhere other than China, and can't.
Corey - have you ever heard of Cree LEDs making a "disco" in the tank?
The disco effect could be referred to as the spotlighting effect generated when the broadcast angle of light is too narrow when it hits the surface of the water. The result is witnessing something to the effect of numerous (small) spotlights over the tank which is very noticeable and possibly irritating for some. This can come as a result of the optics being too narrow and or the fixture is too close to the waters surface. And if you have different colors spread out across the fixture it can make your tank look crazy. Keeping things tightly grouped is key. The disco effect could also be refering to having a tricked out fixture that plays all kinds of random display modes and programmed thunder storms. Making your fish go crazy. You know fish have no eye lids and that leds are BRIGHT?
Seth, have you looked over at the led group buy site? You can get cree or bridglux leds at near wholesale prices. XPG's and XPE's for like $3.50, or even bridglux for $2.00 and maybe even a few cheapies. What it is, is that you get in on big orders placed to the suppliers and everybody gets a good rate. You generally get your stuff within a couple of weeks. May wanna check it out if you haven't already.
Heat is the nemesis of all light emitting diods. Though these things are small they produce a tremendous amount of heat at a very small point which is why they need to be kept cool in order to last. This is why I'm of the mindset that I would prefer to over-build things a little bet so that I don't have to run them so high. But you know that already. :)
Heatsinks and good thermal transferring properties are important when it comes to these things.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SnakeBlitz33 http:///t/393132/snakes-led-build/20#post_3495396
Corey - Ever hear of Luxeon Rebels?
Yep! U? 484936334_1524" src="https://forums.saltwaterfish.com/data/smilies/bigg.gif" />
Quote:
Originally Posted by Siptang http:///t/393132/snakes-led-build/20#post_3495382
Corey - I'm looking online and maybe I'm not putting it together in right words but can you tell me how I will be able to put the wires together for 2-3 drivers into a 1 power cord ? I'm trying to grasp the concept lol.
Sorry, Bud. I should clarify something. Not all brands of drivers use the same colors for their electrical wires. My meanwell LPF's for instance utilize a blue and brown wire for the 110v hook up. Blue wire connects to the HOT (black) wire on the power cord...then Brown connects to the white wire on the power cord. There is no ground wire on the power supply. All you're doing here my man is taking the cord off one of the drivers and then taking that driver and hooking it up along with the other driver that's already connected to the other power cord. You connect them all at the same place. Make sense?
 
snakeblitz33

snakeblitz33

Well-Known Member
I am looking at that ... and they have some pretty good deals. Some are only .50 cheaper than other sites, but still... multiply that times 18 - 20 and you're saving a little bit. Also! I see an inventronics driver that is dimmable that doesn't need any additional "power source" for it to work... I'm guessing that it doesn't need some kind of POT or controller to run it? I see that it actually has a built in POT... and it's cheaper than a meanwell driver...
"

Inventronics 40w driver - 700mA

Product Description
Inventronics drivers are some of the best in the industry for lighting LEDs. They have been used to light the Beijing Olympics
These drivers can handle LEDs without any additional power source. No need to buy anything extra, LEDs can be wired directly into the driver similar to meanwells.
The 40w versions have several key feature including:
Total Power: 40 Watts
Active Power Factor Correction
IP66 Compliant
Lightning Protection
Dimmable
------
I just don't know what it means by "without any additional power source."
 
2quills

2quills

Well-Known Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by SnakeBlitz33 http:///t/393132/snakes-led-build/20#post_3495430
I am looking at that ... and they have some pretty good deals. Some are only .50 cheaper than other sites, but still... multiply that times 18 - 20 and you're saving a little bit. Also! I see an inventronics driver that is dimmable that doesn't need any additional "power source" for it to work... I'm guessing that it doesn't need some kind of POT or controller to run it? I see that it actually has a built in POT... and it's cheaper than a meanwell driver...
"

Inventronics 40w driver - 700mA

Product Description
Inventronics drivers are some of the best in the industry for lighting LEDs. They have been used to light the Beijing Olympics
These drivers can handle LEDs without any additional power source. No need to buy anything extra, LEDs can be wired directly into the driver similar to meanwells.
The 40w versions have several key feature including:
Total Power: 40 Watts
Active Power Factor Correction
IP66 Compliant
Lightning Protection
Dimmable
------
I just don't know what it means by "without any additional power source."
Yep, some of them you can save a pretty good chunk vs the other guys if you need a lot of leds.
What it means when they say "without any addition power source" is that the inventronics has a second 10v power supply built-in to it. Traditionally on the older school meanwell ELN60-48D drivers you needed a separate 10v power supply in order to operate a potentiometer in order to dim the lights. Think of it like an old cell phone charger that plugs into the wall.
With the inventronics you don't need that separate supply to operate a potentiometer. You still need a potentiometer or some other type of variable voltage regulator like a digital controller. Just not the supply.
But last I checked the inventronics only did analog dimming. Meaning you couldn't use them if you wanted to have programmable timing and dimming abilities or simulations if you wished to upgrade in the future.
The meanwell LPF's, like I got for my scrubber lights can do any type of dimming and also don't require a separate 10v power supply in order to operate potentiometers. And the price is comparible between the two brands. Actually, most of the newer drives these guys are making have 3 in 1 dimming abilities already. Or least the meanwells do that I know of.
Sometimes, when guys are looking to build efficiently they will run the led string/circuits in parallel strings. Meaning, doubling the amount of leds from say 12 to 24 on one driver. So instead of two drivers for instance running 24 leds, you have one slightly larger driver running 24 leds and just dividing the amperage in half to run both strings. So there's a small cash savings right there but this adds a little more complexity and ability to trouble shoot and take electrical measurements as well as some addition components for protection. But really, it's pretty simple when it comes down to it.
 
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