So we get free money from the IRS!!!!!!!

salty blues

Active Member
Originally Posted by peef
Me? Send the billions and billions of dollars that are just disappearing into the war into something that would help the economy and the US public. What exactly you might ask? I don't know and that is why I am just a citizen and not the President.
If people had whined about WW II the way you and others have whined about Iraq, we might all be saluting swastikas today.
 

1journeyman

Active Member
Originally Posted by peef
The way he let people rot and die and did basically nothing to help...yes!
Hehe, one more to add to the growing list:

President Bush didn't make people live in a city, built below sea level, surrounded on three sides by water, in an area prone to get hit by hurricanes. Nor did President Bush design the levy system.
The people of New Orleans had days to evacuate. Those that stayed choice not to.
The Mayor did not inact his own evacuation plan that would have removed many of the people that would later die.
The Governor did not ask for Federal Assistance in a timely manner.
 

peef

Active Member
Originally Posted by 1journeyman
If you look at attacks and casualties in the past several months you can see it dramatically cut violence.
It's not a Civil War. The insurgents (al Qaeda) and Iran tried to make it one. That said, it's far from a civil war. If it was a civil war you'd see fighting spread across the entire country.
I agree about the cut in violence. And I know its not a civil war by definition but the way I see it is that if they want to fight and kill each other that is not our fight and in sorts a civil war. Yes when they brought it to us it was our fight. We went over and have disposed of thousands of them....but thousands more step right up. It will never end and Americans will just keep dieing and being taking from their families.
 

1journeyman

Active Member
Originally Posted by peef
The president could have sent military (reserve or otherwise) units to help clean and give medicine....yeah he did but come on.
Not until after the Governor asked for Federal Assistance...
 

salty blues

Active Member
Originally Posted by peef
I agree about the cut in violence. And I know its not a civil war by definition but the way I see it is that if they want to fight and kill each other that is not our fight and in sorts a civil war. Yes when they brought it to us it was our fight. We went over and have disposed of thousands of them....but thousands more step right up. It will never end and Americans will just keep dieing and being taking from their families.
As they say, "War is hell".
 

peef

Active Member
Originally Posted by 1journeyman
Hehe, one more to add to the growing list:

President Bush didn't make people live in a city, built below sea level, surrounded on three sides by water, in an area prone to get hit by hurricanes. Nor did President Bush design the levy system.
The people of New Orleans had days to evacuate. Those that stayed choice not to.
The Mayor did not inact his own evacuation plan that would have removed many of the people that would later die.
The Governor did not ask for Federal Assistance in a timely manner.

I know this, BUT just a visit by the president and a speach didn't help anything. He should have taken matters into his own hand. After the fact of course. And I know its not the pres's fault of what happened or having people stay.....actually I just remembered that when the military was coming to help NO the residents were actually shooting at the choppers bringing food and medicine.....hmmmmm my point is lost on this one
.....
 

1journeyman

Active Member
Originally Posted by peef
I agree about the cut in violence. And I know its not a civil war by definition but the way I see it is that if they want to fight and kill each other that is not our fight and in sorts a civil war. Yes when they brought it to us it was our fight. We went over and have disposed of thousands of them....but thousands more step right up. It will never end and Americans will just keep dieing and being taking from their families.
So is the alternative to leave Afghanistan and Iraq?
Don't forget, "they" came over here and took thousands of Americans away from their families on 9-11.
 

salty blues

Active Member
Originally Posted by 1journeyman
Hehe, one more to add to the growing list:

President Bush didn't make people live in a city, built below sea level, surrounded on three sides by water, in an area prone to get hit by hurricanes. Nor did President Bush design the levy system.
The people of New Orleans had days to evacuate. Those that stayed choice not to.
The Mayor did not inact his own evacuation plan that would have removed many of the people that would later die.
The Governor did not ask for Federal Assistance in a timely manner.

Thank you!
 

1journeyman

Active Member
Originally Posted by peef
I know this, BUT just a visit by the president and a speach didn't help anything. He should have taken matters into his own hand. After the fact of course. And I know its not the pres's fault of what happened or having people stay.....actually I just remembered that when the military was coming to help NO the residents were actually shooting at the choppers bringing food and medicine.....hmmmmm my point is lost on this one
.....

Glad I was able to help ya work through that one!
We're making real progress
 

peef

Active Member
Originally Posted by 1journeyman
So is the alternative to leave Afghanistan and Iraq?
Don't forget, "they" came over here and took thousands of Americans away from their families on 9-11.

Oh I know this but I think that if we are going to react and attack (like we did) we shouldn't mess around. Five years later its still going on....the positives lately are IMO outweighed by the deaths, of them and us.
Hey I have an idea.....instead of cutting military budgets lets pay every professional athlete a max sum of 120,000 a year and put the rest of their salaries into national programs! That would solve EVERYTHING....he he he
 

peef

Active Member
Originally Posted by 1journeyman
Glad I was able to help ya work through that one!
We're making real progress



Hey I feel strongly about what I feel, BUT I am quick to admit when I am wrong!
WHICH IS NEVER! tee hee hee JK
 

jerthunter

Active Member
Originally Posted by peef
Yeah but it is pretty much and expected pass. At least that is my understanding of it. The IRS is already preparing for it and tuning up the CPU's to handle it. I don't know if it has to do with getting more of your current taxes back because it comes as a seperate check after taxe returns are all sent out.
It is expected, however there are certain people in the Senate that are trying to add money for their own pet projects and such onto the bill. If that happens it could easily fall apart. I do hope it passes since I already have a trip to Sizzler planned for the money I get....
 

1journeyman

Active Member
Originally Posted by peef
Oh I know this but I think that if we are going to react and attack (like we did) we shouldn't mess around. Five years later its still going on....the positives lately are IMO outweighed by the deaths, of them and us.
Hey I have an idea.....instead of cutting military budgets lets pay every professional athlete a max sum of 120,000 a year and put the rest of their salaries into national programs! That would solve EVERYTHING....he he he
We're in a war unlike any the world has ever seen before. It's going to be fought on our homeland, on the web, in cryptologist and intel offices, in 3rd world countries you've never heard of, in the UN General Assembly, in alleyways of Nations' capitals, and in the mountains and deserts of tribesmen. It's not ever going to be over. Think of it like a football game, however. As long as you are on offense the opponent has a much more difficult time scoring any points.... As long as our military is fighting the enemy our police officers, our pilots and flight attendants, our emergency responders, and citizens like you and me aren't.
I'm all for that idea... I would love to see salary caps on every major sporting event with the bulk of the profit going to our military.
 

mfp1016

Member
Originally Posted by peef
Oh I know this but I think that if we are going to react and attack (like we did) we shouldn't mess around. Five years later its still going on....the positives lately are IMO outweighed by the deaths, of them and us.
Hey I have an idea.....instead of cutting military budgets lets pay every professional athlete a max sum of 120,000 a year and put the rest of their salaries into national programs! That would solve EVERYTHING....he he he
I agree, if you're going to go to war, you should do it right. The problem is that the media and most dems would poo a brick if we went in there with everything we have.
 

scubadoo

Active Member
Originally Posted by peef
Clinton had the national gross debt lower than it has been in YEARS! What would it have accomplished if Clinton had attacked and killed everyone? Nothing, more people would have stepped up and attacked again when they wanted to.
Probably, the second attack on the WTC may no have happened. The cut and run in Somalia also sent a message. Do you know what was going on in Somalia and who was there at that time?
What stories/reposts are you referring too? Can you bring them here where it states 50% do not know what theya re doing in Iraq?
Have you read any of the repots since we strted the Surge strategy?
The techonolgy sold/given to CHina was far from outdated.
GAO Critical of Computer Export Policy
In 1999, the General Accounting Office released a scathing report critical of Clinton's high-tech export policy. According to the GAO, "the President's July 1999 report to Congress did not fully satisfy the reporting requirements of the Defense Authorization act."
Overall, only 3 percent of all computer licenses were for "sensitive" end-users such as foreign military units. The GAO noted that the Clinton administration issued more than 1,900 licenses for high-speed computers to communist China between November 1997 and August 1999. Of the 1,924 computers licensed for China, 48 computers were to "sensitive end-users or uses," or nearly 2.5 percent of all sales to China.
"The [president's] report did address two of the three requirements," wrote the GAO. "To determine the availability of high performance computers in foreign countries and the potential use of the newly decontrolled computers for significant military use. These applications include advanced aircraft design, anti-submarine warfare sensor development, and radar applications."
Clinton's report "did not, however, assess the impact of such military use on the national security interests of the United States," wrote the GAO. "Instead, the report discussed the economic importance of a strong U.S. computer industry to U.S. national security. The President's report concluded that failure to adjust U.S. export requirements for computers and processors would have a significant negative effect on the U.S. computer industry."
"The [Clinton] report implied that high-performance computers are readily available for foreign sources," states the GAO. "A 1998 study sponsored by DOD [Department of Defense] and Commerce found that the United States dominates the international computer market."
U.S. Computers Designed New Chinese Atomic Bombs
Sun Microsystems says it is now in settlement talks. The Bush administration has given the computer maker until Nov. 1 to respond to the accusations. Sun said it would defend itself against the charges if the settlement talks fail.
"We expect to reach a resolution on this, and it will not have a materially adverse effect on Sun," stated company spokesman Andy Lark.
If Sun is found to have violated the regulations, it could face financial penalties or the loss of its export privileges. America and its allies will not be so lucky as to pay a price in mere money. The Chinese army used U.S.-made computers such as those sold by Sun to help design a new family of lightweight nuclear weapons.
One such newly developed weapon, the Dong Feng 31 (DF-31) missile, is capable of showering U.S. cities with accurate and very powerful atomic bombs. The People's Liberation Army recently announced that it would be testing a DF-31 in the next few weeks. The U.S. military expects the DF-31 to be actively deployed by the end of 2003.
The economic impact of losing sales was far more important to Clinton and his Big Business backers than U.S. national security. As a result, Beijing is deploying nuclear weapons designed and built using American supercomputers.
 

peef

Active Member
Honestly you could find just as technical data argueing my side if you looked also.
And talking about the soldiers who don't agree with the current war....one of my best friends who is here right now reading all this served for 10 years. If you want grounds to all of the nonsense that the govt has been feeding us I would be happy to tear apart all of the civilian points of view you can throw up.
 

mfp1016

Member
Originally Posted by peef
Honestly you could find just as technical data argueing my side if you looked also.
And talking about the soldiers who don't agree with the current war....one of my best friends who is here right now reading all this served for 10 years. If you want grounds to all of the nonsense that the govt has been feeding us I would be happy to tear apart all of the civilian points of view you can throw up.
My experience from talking to soldiers on a bi-weekly+ basis contradicts your experiences. I suppose WE are at a stalemate.
 

1journeyman

Active Member
Originally Posted by peef
Honestly you could find just as technical data argueing my side if you looked also.
And talking about the soldiers who don't agree with the current war....one of my best friends who is here right now reading all this served for 10 years. If you want grounds to all of the nonsense that the govt has been feeding us I would be happy to tear apart all of the civilian points of view you can throw up.
I'd like to see a link stating the Tech sold to China was obsolete. Seriously, I've never seen that argued before and would be interested in reading another point of view.
For the record I have multiple friends over there right now as well.
 

scgator

Member
The economic stimulus package could have a positive effect on our economy if 1) the money is spent, 2) the money is spent on domestically produced products. What I mean by the second point is this: Spending the money will stimulate the economy by a factor of 1. Spending it on a product that was made and SUPPLIED within the U.S. will stimulate the economy by a factor of 1.5 0r possible 2.
Every dollar that is spent here creates revenue for the government. This includes local government as well as state and federal. This revenue is in the form of taxes (sales tax specifically). If the products that are bought are produced in the US then the revenue stream also includes the income tax of the manufaturer (the 1.5). If the product that was purchased was bought made here AND made from domestic resources (ie shirts made from cotton grown here) then the revenue stream would include the income tax of the supplier as well. Each step of the supply chain and manufacturing process that is contained in the US addeds more to the revenue stream of the governments. The effect is actually more exponential than I've illustrated, but for simplicity said I only used 3 varieables. In real economic sense the variables would also include worker's wages, inflation, etc.
The flip side is that for every step in the chain that is located over-seas then that portion of the dollar spent will go to aid that countries economy.
It's the same basic theory that explains how a weak dollar con benefit our economy.
 

nel621

Member
Originally Posted by peef
So if say I quit my job in a week. I get like 2 dollars tax return next year. I will have to pay back the 1200 dollar extra rebate I get this year? That would ummmm suck.
First if you quit your job,I don't think you will get unemployment insurance.I believe you have to be laid off or fired not voluntarily [sp] leave.
Second, nobody is getting any money yet!
Third if the IRS determines you OWE them money look out!
Just a trhought,I don't really know.I do remember here in New York, that we got some state money , or was it city,one year in advance,and when it came time to file your taxes your refund affected [less] by the amount advanced.Trust me by next year there will be a new guy/gal in office,you will thinking about your new fish whether to QT or not,you'll have a bunch of other distractions and when tax time comes around you won't feel it when they pick your pocket,again.
 
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