Soldier doubts eligibility, defies president's orders

[theclemsonkid]

Doesn't it say somewhere in that constitution you speak of, that the Executive branch is supposed to have a limited amount of power... and that the whole "checks and balances" thing applies?
Not pointing any fingers, but I think we all know who violated that. And I would say that's a little worse than this whole argument...

 

[darthtang aw]

Originally Posted by TheClemsonKid
http:///forum/post/2967692
Doesn't it say somewhere in that constitution you speak of, that the Executive branch is supposed to have a limited amount of power... and that the whole "checks and balances" thing applies?
Not pointing any fingers, but I think we all know who violated that. And I would say that's a little worse than this whole argument...
Not pointing any fingers, but I guess we all know who hasn't changed it back yet either. Nothing like a deflection however from the topic at hand.....lol

 

[veni vidi vici]

Originally Posted by TheClemsonKid
http:///forum/post/2967692
Doesn't it say somewhere in that constitution you speak of, that the Executive branch is supposed to have a limited amount of power... and that the whole "checks and balances" thing applies?
Not pointing any fingers, but I think we all know who violated that. And I would say that's a little worse than this whole argument...
If you want to talk about it start a new thread.

 

[stdreb27]

Originally Posted by GeriDoc
http:///forum/post/2967589
As any malpractice lawyer will tell you, of the two, hospital paperwork is most likely to be falsified.
And thus you basically echo the argument by the Obama isn't a citizen group...
Originally Posted by GeriDoc
http:///forum/post/2967597
It doesn't make any argument, except that the poster asserted that since Mcain had offered his hospital records, that "proved" his citizenship. Malpractice lawyers learned many years ago not to trust hospital paperwork since it is easily and frequently changed after the fact to cya.

Originally Posted by TheClemsonKid
http:///forum/post/2967692
Doesn't it say somewhere in that constitution you speak of, that the Executive branch is supposed to have a limited amount of power... and that the whole "checks and balances" thing applies?
Not pointing any fingers, but I think we all know who violated that. And I would say that's a little worse than this whole argument...
Got to love people out in left field. That was squidwardesque right there.

 

[darthtang aw]

Originally Posted by stdreb27
http:///forum/post/2967704
Got to love people out in left field. That was squidwardesque right there.
Especially coming from the person that quoted this first
"That's why this country is a mess. Instead of actually doing something to help this country, some nut job (or group of nut jobs) spends time, effort, and money building and maintaining a site that questions the citizenship of the president.
How sad."
Instead of actually doing something to help this country, someone is still living in the past and not asking the present administration to correct this issue.

 

[bionicarm]

As someone has stated, what else does he have to do to correct the issue? An official with the State of Hawaii has confirmed he has an authentic birth certificate on file with the state. They showed an example of it to the media. People are dispelling that copy simply because it doesn't look 'official' in their minds. When's the last time you got a copy of your birth certificate? I have my original from the hospital I was born in. It has both my parent's signatures on it, and even my footprints inked on the back. Before I got that from my mother, I needed a copy of my birth certificate to renew my passport. I contacted Harris County in Houston and requested a new copy. They mailed me this simplistic printout version that came off a dot matrix printer. The only reason it looks 'official' is because it has the stamped seal on the front.
Which brings up a good point. Does Obama have a passport? Does he have a driver's license? Can't get either of those documents without submitting an official birth certificate.

 

[crimzy]

Just so you know, the higher courts would likely not even hear this type of nonsense. To make the outrageous claim that has been made, without any proof whatsoever of its accuracy, and in the face of an alleged birth certificate, is not a legitimate dispute. While the mere speculation that this "may" be a false birth certificate is entertaining fodder for conspiracy theorists, it is not a real controversy. Anybody can make claims... without any evidence to support the claim, this issue would likely be deemed virtually uncontested.
And Geridoc makes an excellent point here... this soldier's orders do not come from the President. What basis would he have to ignore the orders from his direct superior officer?

 

[bionicarm]

I read Obama is tired of the rhetoric over the controversy about his birth certificate. So tonight during his State Of The Union address, he's going to hold up a copy of his official birth certificate. He's gonna say, "Here. Apparently you people don't think I was born in this country, this is proof. Pass it around, make some copies if you like. Just don't go selling it on ----, or giving it to some Al-Qaeda operative to be used to make a new driver's or pilot's license."

 

[darthtang aw]

Originally Posted by bionicarm
http:///forum/post/2967753
Which brings up a good point. Does Obama have a passport? Does he have a driver's license? Can't get either of those documents without submitting an official birth certificate.
Tell that to Juan from the Mexican Drug Cartel...lol....not exactly the best argument.

 

[oscardeuce]

Originally Posted by bionicarm
http:///forum/post/2967469
Sounds to me like they're nothing but a bunch of SORE LOSERS. Lose the election, find a loophole to change it. Let's say he isn't a legal citizen. What's the protocol? Does he get impeached? If so, guess who gets the Presidency - Joe Biden. Whatever happens, you're not going to get a 'do-over' on the election. There's nothing in the Constitution that says that if an elected official can't provide the documentation that shows he was legally allowed to run for the office of POTUS, that his opponent is then put in his place. Does everyone honestly think that Obama would even fathom the thought of running for President, if there was any doubt whatsoever he wasn't a legal citizen of the US? With today's technology, and the recording of all pertinent documents of every American citizen, do you think he's arrogant enough to believe he would have so much power to circumvent every legal system known to this country, to keep someone from finding out the truth? I thought I read an article a month or so ago, that stated that someone in Hawaii has provided his actual birth certificate per the Open Records Act. This 'officer' needs to quit relying on Internet Fodder and Grassy Knoll Theories, and perform the duties he took an oath to adhere. If not, drop his commission and move on.
So... the Constitution is a "loophole".
Obama's birth is not totally clear. There is enough fact out there to put a reasonable doubt in someone's mind. He should pony up the certificate... if he can.
Funny they calls conservative "Nazi". Obama looks to socialize medicine and nationalize banks and the auto industry.
Nationalism+ Socialism = National Socialism= Nazi

 

[veni vidi vici]

Originally Posted by bionicarm
http:///forum/post/2967753
As someone has stated, what else does he have to do to correct the issue? An official with the State of Hawaii has confirmed he has an authentic birth certificate on file with the state. They showed an example of it to the media. People are dispelling that copy simply because it doesn't look 'official' in their minds. When's the last time you got a copy of your birth certificate? I have my original from the hospital I was born in. It has both my parent's signatures on it, and even my footprints inked on the back. Before I got that from my mother, I needed a copy of my birth certificate to renew my passport. I contacted Harris County in Houston and requested a new copy. They mailed me this simplistic printout version that came off a dot matrix printer. The only reason it looks 'official' is because it has the stamped seal on the front.
Which brings up a good point. Does Obama have a passport? Does he have a driver's license? Can't get either of those documents without submitting an official birth certificate.
Show me the original that was given to his mother when he was born and ill be happy.Ill so you Juaun Valdez who has a drivers license and hes not a citizen.

 

[oscardeuce]

Originally Posted by crimzy
http:///forum/post/2967758
And Geridoc makes an excellent point here... this soldier's orders do not come from the President. What basis would he have to ignore the orders from his direct superior officer?
Commander in Chief

 

[veni vidi vici]

Originally Posted by crimzy
http:///forum/post/2967758
Just so you know, the higher courts would likely not even hear this type of nonsense. To make the outrageous claim that has been made, without any proof whatsoever of its accuracy, and in the face of an alleged birth certificate, is not a legitimate dispute. While the mere speculation that this "may" be a false birth certificate is entertaining fodder for conspiracy theorists, it is not a real controversy. Anybody can make claims... without any evidence to support the claim, this issue would likely be deemed virtually uncontested.
This argument would carry weight if we where talking about an average American Citizen, but we are not.And you would be correct in assuming this allegation isnt a legitimate dispute if President Obama would have not fought tooth and nail to show the public or some of his colleagues his friggin original birth certificate.
Originally Posted by crimzy
http:///forum/post/2967758
And Geridoc makes an excellent point here... this soldier's orders do not come from the President. What basis would he have to ignore the orders from his direct superior officer?
The President is Commander in Chief just like the Supreme Court is the end of the line for all other court below it.

 

[bionicarm]

Originally Posted by Veni Vidi Vici
http:///forum/post/2967770
Show me the original that was given to his mother when he was born and ill be happy.Ill so you Juaun Valdez who has a drivers license and hes not a citizen.
Juan may have a drivers license, but if he has a passport, you might as well tear down the fences and gates along the Mexico border and let them all in.
Why don't you go ask Bush, Clinton, Carter, Reagan, and every other previous president for theirs? Last time I looked, Hawaii was a state just like Georgia, Arkansas, Texas, and California. Does the hospital have proof his mother was admitted to the Honolulu hospital where he was born? Is there some magical birthing center in Hawaii that isn't part of the United States? That's how ridculous your Grassy Knoll theory is. To my knowledge, no one has disputed he was born in Hawaii. No one disputes his mother is an American citizen. He could have been born in Kenya, and if his mother is an American citizen, he would be considered one as well. Depending on the laws of the country, he could have dual citizenship. But he would be an American either way.
Through birth abroad to two United States citizens
See also: jus sanguinis
In most cases, one is a U.S. citizen if both of the following are true:
Both parents were U.S. citizens at the time of the child's birth
At least one parent lived in the United States prior to the child's birth.
INA 301(c) and INA 301(a)(3) state, "and one of whom has had a residence." The FAM (Foreign Affairs Manual) states "no amount of time specified."
A person's record of birth abroad, if registered with a U.S. consulate or embassy, is proof of his or her citizenship. He or she may also apply for a passport or a Certificate of Citizenship to have his or her citizenship recognized.
Through birth abroad to one United States citizen
For persons born on or after November 14, 1986, a person is a U.S. citizen if all of the following are true:[4]
One of the person's parents was a U.S. citizen when the person in question was born;
The citizen parent lived at least 5 years in the United States before his or her child's birth;
A minimum of 2 of these 5 years in the United States were after the citizen parent's 14th birthday.
A person's record of birth abroad, if registered with a U.S. consulate or embassy, is proof of his or her citizenship. Such a person may also apply for a passport or a Certificate of Citizenship to have a record of his or her citizenship. Such documentation is often useful to prove citizenship in lieu of the availability of an American birth certificate.
Different rules apply for persons born abroad to one U.S. citizen before November 14, 1986. United States law on this subject changed multiple times throughout the twentieth century, and the law is applicable as it existed at the time of the individual's birth.

 

[aquaknight]

This whole thing is absolutely friggin mind-bottling... (You know, when things are so crazy it gets your thoughts all trapped, like in a bottle?)
How can someone be elected to the highest position in all the land, and there's actually questions like this? It would seem like standard protocol that Obama, or any President before him, would have to submit all of the necessary paperwork to someone (not some random, apparently leftist website). It says right in the Consitition that only cizitens can be elected. Well, when Obama signed on the bottom line, they would have checked that beforehand?

Honestly, it's hurts the brain a little....

 

[crimzy]

Originally Posted by AquaKnight
http:///forum/post/2967795
This whole thing is absolutely friggin mind-bottling (You know, what happens when your thoughts get all trapped up like in a bottle). How can someone be elected to the high position on all the land, and there's actually questions about this? It would seem like standard protocol that Obama, or any President before him, would have to submit all of the necessary paperwork to someone (not some random, apparently leftist website). It says right in the Consitition that only cizitens can be elected. Well, when Obama signed on the bottom line, they would have checked that?
Honestly, it's hurts the brain a little....
You are right that it is mind-boggling. However what is annoying about this issue is that there is no geniune question about this. The birth certificate has been released and there is no geniune challenge to it.
On the other side, there is no evidence whatsoever to support a claim that the he is not a citizen.
All this really shows is that if you throw a bunch of crap against the wall, in the minds of some stupid, ignorant and/or prejudice people, it will stick.

 

[veni vidi vici]

Originally Posted by bionicarm
http:///forum/post/2967792
Juan may have a drivers license, but if he has a passport, you might as well tear down the fences and gates along the Mexico border and let them all in.
They can enter and leave as they wish...Hellooooo arent you paying attention.They swap SS# at the boarder coming and going.
Originally Posted by bionicarm
http:///forum/post/2967792
Why don't you go ask Bush, Clinton, Carter, Reagan, and every other previous president for theirs?
It wasnt necessary and if it where i would think they would not hesitate to produce proof.
Originally Posted by bionicarm
http:///forum/post/2967792
Last time I looked, Hawaii was a state just like Georgia, Arkansas, Texas, and California. Does the hospital have proof his mother was admitted to the Honolulu hospital where he was born? Is there some magical birthing center in Hawaii that isn't part of the United States? That's how ridculous your Grassy Knoll theory is. To my knowledge, no one has disputed he was born in Hawaii.
Helloooo again, havent you been paying attention.President Obamas own party questions his status, until he became President anyway.
Originally Posted by bionicarm
http:///forum/post/2967792
No one disputes his mother is an American citizen. He could have been born in Kenya, and if his mother is an American citizen, he would be considered one as well. Depending on the laws of the country, he could have dual citizenship. But he would be an American either way.
Age and Citizenship requirements - US Constitution, Article II, Section 1
"No person except a natural born citizen, or a citizen of the United States, at the time of the adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the office of President; neither shall any person be eligible to that office who shall not have attained to the age of thirty-five years, and been fourteen years a resident within the United States."
So it dosent matter what the nationality of his mother or father is.
Im not even going to read or respond to WIKI

 

[veni vidi vici]

Originally Posted by crimzy
http:///forum/post/2967798
All this really shows is that if you throw a bunch of crap against the wall, in the minds of some stupid, ignorant and/or prejudice people, it will stick.

Crimzy i thought you would have learned your lesson after almost being torn apart from some insanely angry women a week or two ago.

Asking serious questions isnt stupid,ignorant and/or prejudice.Its people who really care about this country making sure it dosent get rearranged permanently by Socialist and /or Marxist

 

[crimzy]

Originally Posted by Veni Vidi Vici
http:///forum/post/2967809
Crimzy i thought you would have learned your lesson after almost being torn apart from some insanely angry women a week or two ago.

Asking serious questions isnt stupid,ignorant and/or prejudice.Its people who really care about this country making sure it dosent get rearranged permanently by Socialist and /or Marxist
Then feel free to argue against his politics. But this baseless claim that he is deemed an imposter until he proves otherwise... this moron soldier may as well claim that he is a child molester, KKK member, or in a street gang until he proves otherwise.
I think that this soldier is either a coward or a racist... JMO
It's just funny to me that the Obama opposition rarely talks about his politics... remember those clips of people calling him a terrorist, or the press misspelling his name to be "Osama"... or our dear friend Oscardeuce implying that he is a Nazi...

I don't care if people like Obama or not, but please, please people... MAKE AN INTELLIGENT ARGUMENT ABOUT THE MAN OR HIS POLICIES!! That would be quite a refreshing change.

 

[aquaknight]

Originally Posted by crimzy
http:///forum/post/2967798
You are right that it is mind-boggling. However what is annoying about this issue is that there is no geniune question about this. The birth certificate has been released and there is no geniune challenge to it.
On the other side, there is no evidence whatsoever to support a claim that the he is not a citizen.
All this really shows is that if you throw a bunch of crap against the wall, in the minds of some stupid, ignorant and/or prejudice people, it will stick.

That's what I mean, there shouldn't even be a chance to fling poo. I would have expected every president to have to go through the same thing. If Tiger Woods or Dale Earnhardt Jr. or Drew Barrymore were elected, I'd expect that they would have had to submit their birth certificates to someone before they were sworn in. And that 'someone' should have already confirmed Obama is a citizen. Not Obama releasing whatever he did to the general public/that website....
(I just picked celebrities that we know 'grew up' in front of America. No personal feelings on any of them are necessary

)