The I Hate Cheaters (Barry Bonds) Thread

[ruaround]

Originally Posted by skipperdz
for lightheavy weigh in yes he is...then come fight time hes not 205 anymore.
i think youre missing my point... at walking weight he is NOT 30lbs heavier... when he has gone down a class he has cut... when you do HGH or anabolic steriods you dont lose weight... perhaps fat weight, but his physic has always been the same...

 

[skipperdz]

right...which has always been big and ripped...and hes 43. which is my point he hasnt lost anything but hair. lol

 

[ruaround]

Originally Posted by skipperdz
right...which has always been big and ripped...and hes 43. which is my point he hasnt lost anything but hair. lol
with the training these guys go through to compete he couldnt afford to lose!!! and male pattern baldness just sux...

 

[redinator]

Originally Posted by ruaround
steriods and ANY other performance inhancing drug have ALWAYS been banned from baseball (and any sport for that matter)...
756*...
Not professional bodybuilding (IFBB).

 

[ruaround]

Originally Posted by redinator
Not professional bodybuilding (IFBB).
i digres... mainstream sports that are governed by the world antidoping agency...

 

[clown boy]

so no one has answered my question... who is this Barry Bonds?

 

[vpotts28]

Originally Posted by skipperdz
how do you expain randy couture beating silvia in the ufc...randy couture 43,whooping up on silvia more than 10yrs younger and becoming the heavyweight champ? hes older/stronger/faster hmmm he must be juiced..wait he didnt test positive...doh
also how do we know Arod isnt juiced? we dont do we?

Let this sink into everybodies head. Human Growth Hormone is UNDETECTABLE. There isn't a test that the MLB provides that will ever show up as positive for HGH.

 

[ruaround]

Originally Posted by Vpotts28
Let this sink into everybodies head. Human Growth Hormone is UNDETECTABLE. There isn't a test that the MLB provides that will ever show up as positive for HGH.
there is testing for HGH but it is expensive and time consuming... it is not detectable in urine tests...

 

[tangwhispr]

Originally Posted by skipperdz
i know gracie still is going...didnt reallize ken was still fighting...grant it hes been embarassed several times in the last 2 years as well
Gracie, Royce that is tested positive this year for juice

 

[vpotts28]

Originally Posted by ruaround
there is testing for HGH but it is expensive and time consuming... it is not detectable in urine tests...

The only committees that test for HGH if I am not mistaken is the IOC and whatever the name of the bicycle competition. Baseball doesn't have it because their testing is a joke and 1/2 of their players would be suspended..

 

[rylan1]

Originally Posted by rbaldino
I find it interesting that many think it's okay that Bonds used steroids because allegedly so did a lot of other players, in particular pitchers. Isn't this condemning most of the league without evidence, something many of Bonds' supporters say is lacking in his case, despite the fact that he actually admitted to it in front of a grand jury? Until you can actually prove that a significant number of his home runs came off of pitchers who were on steroids at the time, this is a lame excuse.
I'm not making an excuse, what I am saying is that use of steroids is prevelant in baseball. Your comments are similar to the arguement of how many extra HR's did Barry hit as a result of using them. This is an answer that we do not know. But my point is that we want to put a * next to his name because people say he had an added advantage, but if pitchers are doing it too, then what is the advantage?

 

[rylan1]

Originally Posted by ruaround
there have never been aligations of those athletes juicing up... no has there been... neither one of them admitted to taking substances from Mr. Anderson from BALCO... now have they...
as far as couture goes he is a very talented individual and if youve watched the UFC youd know that he hasnt put on any weight... he is still ripped but not as toned as he was 10 years ago...
as far as Arod... youre just grasping at straws... until he puts on 30 lbs miraculously over the off season i for one would not think he is juicing up...
when bonds entered the league he was around 180 lbs... now is is weighing in around 260 lbs...
then and now...

now and then...

then and now...

Another aspect that people are not looking at is this.... When Barry was with the Pirates he was a lead off hitter that stole bases and his job was not really to hit home runs. It was decided later that he had power and could move to 4 or 5th in the line up as the big bat... this explains the jump in HR's
2nd- I do not know why people think he should be the same size as in 1983. He was a kid then who probably trained very little in the weight room and his game was about speed. But as an athlete who trains for a living I would expect him to get bigger over the years.
Other players do it in other sports.
Take Karl Malone for example

 

[crimzy]

Originally Posted by Rylan1
2nd- I do not know why people think he should be the same size as in 1983. He was a kid then who probably trained very little in the weight room and his game was about speed. But as an athlete who trains for a living I would expect him to get bigger over the years.
Other players do it in other sports.
Take Karl Malone for example
Not sure I understand your argument here. For a while it appeared that you were arguing that everyone was on roids so we shouldn't single out Bonds (possibly a legitimate point). But are you now suggesting that his size increase was natural and that he never juiced up? Do you really believe that?

 

[natemd]

The very nature of profesional sports encourages players to use whatever they can to get bigger, faster and stronger. The multi-million dollar paychecks and shows such as "jacked up" and various top ten shows all encourage it. So until something is done to get the focus back on just raw talent and skill, performence enhancing supplements will always be an issue.

 

[rylan1]

Originally Posted by crimzy
Not sure I understand your argument here. For a while it appeared that you were arguing that everyone was on roids so we shouldn't single out Bonds (possibly a legitimate point). But are you now suggesting that his size increase was natural and that he never juiced up? Do you really believe that?
No I do believe he used roids or HGH, but I do think that some of his growth is due to his physical training regiment. I think the roids were used more for muscle recovery/rejuvination then for bulk or muscle mass, although there is some correlation b/w the two.
As far as pitchers go...I could see them using roids more than big hitters because of the stress placed on their arms and the greater likelihood of them tearing muscle fibers and ligiments. They are also being asked to pitch more with less time off.

 

[crimzy]

Originally Posted by Rylan1
As far as pitchers go...I could see them using roids more than big hitters because of the stress placed on their arms and the greater likelihood of them tearing muscle fibers and ligiments. They are also being asked to pitch more with less time off.
I would probably agree with this. We've all heard the rumors about Clemens. But I don't think that pitchers would get any additional power from roids. May be, as you say, for recovery than performance enhancement. But Bonds definitely did enjoy enhanced performance from his substance use. Combine this with his general bad attitude and the fact that he just broke the greatest record in sport and you get a large target for criticism.

 

[sudc]

I saw him the other day and was thinking that Clemens head looked as big as a stop sign

Anyone with photo skills want to post comparison photos of clemens from say 86, 96 and 07?

 

[ruaround]

Originally Posted by Rylan1
Another aspect that people are not looking at is this.... When Barry was with the Pirates he was a lead off hitter that stole bases and his job was not really to hit home runs. It was decided later that he had power and could move to 4 or 5th in the line up as the big bat... this explains the jump in HR's
2nd- I do not know why people think he should be the same size as in 1983. He was a kid then who probably trained very little in the weight room and his game was about speed. But as an athlete who trains for a living I would expect him to get bigger over the years.
Other players do it in other sports.
Take Karl Malone for example
very few lead off hittter go to clean up/power hitters...
i have yet to know a person whos head grows 2" and foot size goes up 2 sizes in their mid 30's...
Karl Malone rookie season 6'9" 240... Last season 6'9" 256...

 

[adroitmind]

Training and getting bigger over the years is what athletes do. Their muscles get bigger their waistlines get bigger, it's all part of decades of training and the aging process. However Barry's head and feet also grew. No amount of training can make your shoe size increase 3 sizes, or your hat size increase by 2 after your 30th birthday.

 

[rbaldino]

Originally Posted by Rylan1
I'm not making an excuse, what I am saying is that use of steroids is prevelant in baseball. Your comments are similar to the arguement of how many extra HR's did Barry hit as a result of using them.
Here's something to consider... Even with all those Home Runs, Bonds still has about 800 fewer base hits than Aaron. One could reasonably assume that many of the balls Bonds hit should have landed in the field of play and didn't because he overpowered them with drugs and the parks are a lot smaller. Considering he had so many more hits than Bonds, one wonders how many HRs Aaron would have had if he played in this era.