What must the Republican party do?

saw wave analo

saw wave analo

New Member
the problem with the gop is that right now the democrats seem more conservative than the republicans. it doesnt matter what is said, we have had 8 years to watch the conservatives ---- the constitution with the patriot act, ---- the idea of fiscal conservativism with their absolutely out of control spending, and ---- the ideal of individual freedoms.. in a completely shameless, pandering way.. with the whole terri schiavo thing. that one in particular just absolutely disgusted myself and a lot of people
the gop is going to have to completely, utterly reconfigure, or they are never going to win another election. i am in indiana as well, and in 06 my district went dem in a big way, and this year the state went dem by a decent margain.. indiana.. i dont know haw many of you have been through here, but the fact that this state decisively elected a black democrat as president should serve as a lead weighted punch in the face to anyone who thinks the gop can still continue to function as it has been.
the bush administration was a catastrophic failure, neoconservativism could just as easily be called bigoted ultra liberalism. i expect obama to be far more conservative than bush was, because as far as i can tell, the last 8 years were the most liberal this country has ever seen, there was just a thin veil of religious pandering draped over it all to fool the braindead "values" voting bloc into thinking they were supporting the will of god.
its horseshit.
and to whoever above said something about bush being too center minded.. he tried too hard to appeal to the left.. are you absolutely out of your mind? the bush administration was the most rigidly partisan we have had in modern history. i have no idea what you mean by what you said, but the absolute opposite is true, that rigidity is what has been costing them so dearly lately.
it is a fluke bush was elected to a second term, it would have been a landslide in 04 as well, but the war was still fresh so people i think were still willing to give him the benefit of the doubt. by 06, the true colors of what the modern gop has degraded into were exposed, and unless there is a drastic shift away from the ultra partisan mud slinging holier than thou stuff, the gop will be irrelevant by 2016
the gop must either cast off the church, or be replaced. there is no third option.
i would love to vote for a true conservative. there has only been one that has attempted a run in the past 15 years, ron paul.
 
1journeyman

1journeyman

Active Member
To consider Obama and the Democrats more Conservative than President Bush means 1 or more of the following things;
1. You haven't been sober in 3 days
2. Someone is playing a horrible joke on you since birth and didn't teach you the true definitions of liberal and conservative.
3. You hate Christians so much you will say anything to try to discredit them.
You complain about spending.. Obama will spend more.
You complain about the Patriot Act. Yet the Democrats want to pass the "fairness doctrine".
You complain about the church; Ever heard one of the sermons Obama was a part of?
Please; While long your post was long it was full of absolute silly contradictions.
 
1journeyman

1journeyman

Active Member
Originally Posted by zman1
http:///forum/post/2829243
You know, you an I have been over this many times. I was lied to and cheated by the party when I supported them. I see them for what they are. Shall I repost the National Debt numbers with the rebublican timesframes again or link the posts here? You PLEASE....
When having to pick between two evils, pick one you haven't tried before....
Again.. do you think Obama will spend less?
McCain ran on cutting the deficit. Obama ran on spending....
You liberals trying to give advice on what the Republican Party needs is like taking military advice from a German regarding appeasement.
 
1journeyman

1journeyman

Active Member
Originally Posted by sickboy
http:///forum/post/2829315
This brings me to a question seeing that you are always quoting the constitution: What are your thoughts on the patriot act?
I'll play your game; provided you quote to me and link to the specific part of the bill you wish to discuss.
I'm not going to waste time discussing a Bill based on what left wing blogs hace said about it.
 
stdreb27

stdreb27

Active Member
Originally Posted by zman1
http:///forum/post/2829243
When having to pick between two evils, pick one you haven't tried before....
umm
who do you think controlled the country from FDR till Carter? It wasn't republicans.
Even nixon was a keynesian (a liberal view on economics)
 
stdreb27

stdreb27

Active Member
Originally Posted by saw wave analo
http:///forum/post/2829295
and to whoever above said something about bush being too center minded.. he tried too hard to appeal to the left.. are you absolutely out of your mind? the bush administration was the most rigidly partisan we have had in modern history. i have no idea what you mean by what you said, but the absolute opposite is true, that rigidity is what has been costing them so dearly lately.
it is a fluke bush was elected to a second term, it would have been a landslide in 04 as well, but the war was still fresh so people i think were still willing to give him the benefit of the doubt. by 06, the true colors of what the modern gop has degraded into were exposed, and unless there is a drastic shift away from the ultra partisan mud slinging holier than thou stuff, the gop will be irrelevant by 2016
the gop must either cast off the church, or be replaced. there is no third option.
i would love to vote for a true conservative. there has only been one that has attempted a run in the past 15 years, ron paul.
Do me a favor name me one issue Bush didn't bend over backwards to incorporate democrats in with the plan.
Quite frankly your post contradicts itself. You get done saying Obama is going to govern more conservatively that Bush. Then say I'm off the charts because I think Bush was governing from the center. Think about that for a little bit, does that make any sense.
 
zman1

zman1

Active Member
Originally Posted by stdreb27
http:///forum/post/2829389
umm
who do you think controlled the country from FDR till Carter? It wasn't republicans.
Even nixon was a keynesian (a liberal view on economics)
So you know were the money comes from, where it goes and again the budgets and debts. Stop IT... National debt booming is associated to Republican presidents.
This is where you and I have been lied to....

Remember that Soviet threat, was killed by Reagan's debt spending. Wait, maybe that threat isn't over, hummm. Debt money not well spent if that is the case. I believe I have been seeing the Soviet treat being rekindled on here by Journey, Bush looking into the EYEs of ????... Please stop



 
zman1

zman1

Active Member
When looking at the spending long-line titled Department of Treasury, that number is the INTEREST DEBT being paid for the Reagan and Bush National Debt.
 
stdreb27

stdreb27

Active Member
Originally Posted by zman1
http:///forum/post/2829440
So you know were the money comes from, where it goes and again the budgets and debts. Stop IT... National debt booming is associated to Republican presidents.
This is where you and I have been lied to....

Remember that Soviet threat, was killed by Reagan's debt spending. Wait, maybe that threat isn't over, hummm. Debt money not well spent if that is the case. I believe I have been seeing the Soviet treat being rekindled on here by Journey, Bush looking into the EYEs of ????... Please stop

So let me get this straight, you sit there and say that we've never tried democrat ideas before. (which is all obama is with shiny brown wrapping) Then turn around and post numbers of 2 presidents and how the national debt increased while they were in office. When I simply point out we've been down that road for 50 years and it didn't get us anywhere.
If you've taken the time to read some previous posts. I don't think the republican party embraces the conservative/ free market views I hold. So I don't think pointing at the increase of debt over the last 4 years as proof my ideas don't work.
This is where I reach a conclusion. I don't believe you were ever a conservative, nor are you the least bit interested in your "pet issue." You're simply trying to play the argument that "I saw the light" and am not a conservative anymore. Because there is NO LOGICAL WAY (assuming you are logical) that you can conclude that a president that ran on a platform of government expansion is going to be good for the national debt.
If you follow his ideas out, he's proposing TRILLIONS of dollars of new social programs. He's proposing continuing paying into failed government programs.
Quite frankly if you really believed in your supposed national debt problem you'd not support either candidate and have voted for Barr.
 
zman1

zman1

Active Member
I posted current numbers for revenues and spending! Then I posted budgets and debts from 1970 to present. You can assign who the presidents were during this period of time:
1969-74 Nixon, Richard
1974-77 Ford, Gerald
1977-81 Carter, Jimmy
1981-89 Reagan, Ronald
1989-93 Bush, George H.W.
1993-2001 Clinton, William J.
2001-2008 Bush, George W.
Corrected dates -
 
zman1

zman1

Active Member
Originally Posted by stdreb27
http:///forum/post/2829445
simply trying to play the argument that "I saw the light" and am not a conservative anymore..
I saw the light and I am not buying rebublicans anymore....
I will give the NEW democrat a chance rather than the NEW republican.
 
stdreb27

stdreb27

Active Member
Originally Posted by zman1
http:///forum/post/2829449
I posted current numbers for revenues and spending! Then I posted budgets and debts from 1970 to present. You can assign who the presidents were during this period of time:
1969-74 Nixon, Richard
1974-77 Ford, Gerald
1977-81 Carter, Jimmy
1981-89 Reagan, Ronald
1989-93 Bush, George H.W.
1993-2001 Clinton, William J.
2001-2008 Bush, George W.
Corrected dates -
You really have to go farther back. to get to the founding fathers of our problems. FDR and LBJ. These democrats simply protected and expanded the root cause.
Originally Posted by zman1
http:///forum/post/2829452
I saw the light and I am not buying rebublicans anymore....
I will give the NEW democrat a chance rather than the NEW republican.
There is nothing new about Obama's policies or arguments. You can go back and listen to FDR and Obama is saying the same things.
You and your pet problem is like my friends saying, I was leaning towards obama, then voted for Barr. That is like saying I was going to vote for jesus then picked the devil. (in the sense of opposites not assigning good or bad to one or the other)
 
zman1

zman1

Active Member
Originally Posted by stdreb27
http:///forum/post/2829470
You really have to go farther back.
There is nothing new about Obama's policies or arguments.
You and your pet problem is like my friends saying, I was leaning towards obama, then voted for Barr.
No, not really. It's like driving to the end of the same dead end street thinking it will go to some other place and then deciding to take a different path. Not absolutely sure were this street one will go but the last one went nowhere. So I am willing to take a different direction as were 8 other states..
if this hurts, try something NEW...
 
sangria

sangria

Member
Originally Posted by zman1
http:///forum/post/2829452
I saw the light and I am not buying rebublicans anymore....
I will give the NEW democrat a chance rather than the NEW republican.
That statement alone clearly shows you are not open-minded to NEW anything. You are liberal, which is fine, but don't pretend you at one time embraced Republicans.
As hard as it would be for me to swallow, if Obama can cut my taxes, keep the military strong, and leave me alone, he will have my full support.
 
stdreb27

stdreb27

Active Member
Originally Posted by zman1
http:///forum/post/2829484
No, not really. It's like driving to the end of the same dead end street thinking it will go to some other place and then deciding to take a different path. Not absolutely sure were this street one will go but the last one went nowhere. So I am willing to take a different direction as were 8 other states..
if this hurts, try something NEW...
Do you just not believe that Obama is going to try and expand the government. Remember the I think it is better for everyone if we spread the wealth. How much do you think tree hugging policies are going to cost. Then you have his healthcare plans that will cost big bucks. He certainly isn't going to change social security. To bail that out in similar form is going to cost billions. This just doesn't make any sense.
 
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