deejeff442
Active Member
yea what flower said
Another new guy to the hobby. Need suggesstions.
- Thread starter mmyuki
- Start date
2quills
Well-Known Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by marinebiofreak http:///forum/thread/382927/another-new-guy-to-the-hobby-need-suggesstions/260#post_3387569
Ok I know that you're totally set on the whole live rock thing - but before you go out and spend hundreds of dollars of rock read this:
Live rock is one of the major contributers to chemical imballances (high nitrates etc). If you're a beginner with a small tank (30 gal and under) I would stick to regular rock - not live. I have both a live and not live tank and I've had alot of problems with the live.
I am inclined to agree and disagree.
Live rock can pose some unique issues when introducing it into a system. One is the unwanted pest factor. Two is the idea that introducing too much live rock to fast and or improperly curred rock during the initial cycling process can over load the system and cause massive die off of your expensive brand new rock. Three would be either using too much rock which could create a lot of dead zones in terms of low flow or not having enough flow to begin with. This can lead to an excessive build up of organics in the rock over time and ultimately lead to poor water quality issues and uncontrollable nitrate and even algae problems. But this isn't the rock "itself's" fault. Bad flow, inadequate filtration, over feeding, etc...can all contribute to this whether you start out with live rock or dead base rock, it doesn't matter.
Any rock that you put into an aquarium will become live to one extent or another eventually.
Originally Posted by marinebiofreak http:///forum/thread/382927/another-new-guy-to-the-hobby-need-suggesstions/260#post_3387569
Ok I know that you're totally set on the whole live rock thing - but before you go out and spend hundreds of dollars of rock read this:
Live rock is one of the major contributers to chemical imballances (high nitrates etc). If you're a beginner with a small tank (30 gal and under) I would stick to regular rock - not live. I have both a live and not live tank and I've had alot of problems with the live.
I am inclined to agree and disagree.
Live rock can pose some unique issues when introducing it into a system. One is the unwanted pest factor. Two is the idea that introducing too much live rock to fast and or improperly curred rock during the initial cycling process can over load the system and cause massive die off of your expensive brand new rock. Three would be either using too much rock which could create a lot of dead zones in terms of low flow or not having enough flow to begin with. This can lead to an excessive build up of organics in the rock over time and ultimately lead to poor water quality issues and uncontrollable nitrate and even algae problems. But this isn't the rock "itself's" fault. Bad flow, inadequate filtration, over feeding, etc...can all contribute to this whether you start out with live rock or dead base rock, it doesn't matter.
Any rock that you put into an aquarium will become live to one extent or another eventually.
travelerjp98
Active Member
marinebiofreak,
Please tell me how live rock and sand can be bad if introduced and cured properly.
I am very interested in your explanation.
Please tell me how live rock and sand can be bad if introduced and cured properly.
I am very interested in your explanation.
deejeff442
Active Member
the poster said nitrates not hitchers.if someone does the work and then knows the amount of rock then the amount of flow will be right.seems the poster just said lr is a nitrate factory which is wrong.over the 27 years i have been at this i have had alot of tanks with no mechanical filtration.never have i had a nitrate problem.
gemmy
Active Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by deejeff442 http:///forum/thread/382927/another-new-guy-to-the-hobby-need-suggesstions/280#post_3387691
the poster said nitrates not hitchers.if someone does the work and then knows the amount of rock then the amount of flow will be right.seems the poster just said lr is a nitrate factory which is wrong.over the 27 years i have been at this i have had alot of tanks with no mechanical filtration.never have i had a nitrate problem.
Exactly. I am inclined to think that the issues with the live rock evolving into a nitrate factory is due to poor husbandry. This means what Corey said inadequate flow, overfeeding, and a host of other issues.
I personally think if someone is going to post why they do not believe in using live rock and use dry rock (which really does become live), that they should elaborate as to why.
I apologize to the OP for steering the thread in this direction. I'm liking your build thus far.
Originally Posted by deejeff442 http:///forum/thread/382927/another-new-guy-to-the-hobby-need-suggesstions/280#post_3387691
the poster said nitrates not hitchers.if someone does the work and then knows the amount of rock then the amount of flow will be right.seems the poster just said lr is a nitrate factory which is wrong.over the 27 years i have been at this i have had alot of tanks with no mechanical filtration.never have i had a nitrate problem.
Exactly. I am inclined to think that the issues with the live rock evolving into a nitrate factory is due to poor husbandry. This means what Corey said inadequate flow, overfeeding, and a host of other issues.
I personally think if someone is going to post why they do not believe in using live rock and use dry rock (which really does become live), that they should elaborate as to why.
I apologize to the OP for steering the thread in this direction. I'm liking your build thus far.
travelerjp98
Active Member
I was saying that if the lr was cured, there would be no dead organisms to produce nitrates.
I'm thinking that "marinebiofreak" had a lot of dead organisms on the lr to produce nitrates.
I'm thinking that "marinebiofreak" had a lot of dead organisms on the lr to produce nitrates.
2quills
Well-Known Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by deejeff442 http:///forum/thread/382927/another-new-guy-to-the-hobby-need-suggesstions/280#post_3387691
the poster said nitrates not hitchers.if someone does the work and then knows the amount of rock then the amount of flow will be right.seems the poster just said lr is a nitrate factory which is wrong.over the 27 years i have been at this i have had alot of tanks with no mechanical filtration.never have i had a nitrate problem.
He/she did say nitrates etc. And then at the end said they had a lot of problems with live rock which I think is actually a quote from someone else.
Some people do end up with bad nitrates problems that are associated with their rock over time. The term "old tank syndrome" comes to mind when I think of this. Again I don't think it's the rock itself fault but rather the lack of good maintenance, flow, clean up crew...etc that can lead to the eventual uncontrolable issues with nitrates. I'm sure many people here have had their battles with nitrates that no matter what they seem to do can never get them down.
Jeff...you mean to tell me that after 27 years you've never once had to battle high nitrates? You should be teaching a class my friend.
Originally Posted by deejeff442 http:///forum/thread/382927/another-new-guy-to-the-hobby-need-suggesstions/280#post_3387691
the poster said nitrates not hitchers.if someone does the work and then knows the amount of rock then the amount of flow will be right.seems the poster just said lr is a nitrate factory which is wrong.over the 27 years i have been at this i have had alot of tanks with no mechanical filtration.never have i had a nitrate problem.
He/she did say nitrates etc. And then at the end said they had a lot of problems with live rock which I think is actually a quote from someone else.
Some people do end up with bad nitrates problems that are associated with their rock over time. The term "old tank syndrome" comes to mind when I think of this. Again I don't think it's the rock itself fault but rather the lack of good maintenance, flow, clean up crew...etc that can lead to the eventual uncontrolable issues with nitrates. I'm sure many people here have had their battles with nitrates that no matter what they seem to do can never get them down.
Jeff...you mean to tell me that after 27 years you've never once had to battle high nitrates? You should be teaching a class my friend.
deejeff442
Active Member
i sure aint an expert.i dont think anyone can ever be in this hobby.too many variables trying to take the ocean and cram it into a cube.but over the years i have learned if you want to cram alot of fish into a tank it dont work no matter what equipment you have.light bioload and you will be good.sure you can put 10 fish in a 55 gallon.but no matter what filtration you have over time it will turn on you.just my opinion.i have always had 10-20 nitrates but i dont think that is anything.i have never had a tank over 40.as most of you know nature takes time to mature and patience is key here.
if you want 10 fish in your tank in 6 months better buy a 250 gallon.
if you want 10 fish in your tank in 6 months better buy a 250 gallon.
2quills
Well-Known Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by deejeff442 http:///forum/thread/382927/another-new-guy-to-the-hobby-need-suggesstions/280#post_3387705
i sure aint an expert.i dont think anyone can ever be in this hobby.too many variables trying to take the ocean and cram it into a cube.but over the years i have learned if you want to cram alot of fish into a tank it dont work no matter what equipment you have.light bioload and you will be good.sure you can put 10 fish in a 55 gallon.but no matter what filtration you have over time it will turn on you.just my opinion.i have always had 10-20 nitrates but i dont think that is anything.i have never had a tank over 40.as most of you know nature takes time to mature and patience is key here.
if you want 10 fish in your tank in 6 months better buy a 250 gallon.
Absolutely right. There are so many variables that to blame it all on the rock would be to ignore the bigger picture of what is going on in ones system.
Originally Posted by deejeff442 http:///forum/thread/382927/another-new-guy-to-the-hobby-need-suggesstions/280#post_3387705
i sure aint an expert.i dont think anyone can ever be in this hobby.too many variables trying to take the ocean and cram it into a cube.but over the years i have learned if you want to cram alot of fish into a tank it dont work no matter what equipment you have.light bioload and you will be good.sure you can put 10 fish in a 55 gallon.but no matter what filtration you have over time it will turn on you.just my opinion.i have always had 10-20 nitrates but i dont think that is anything.i have never had a tank over 40.as most of you know nature takes time to mature and patience is key here.
if you want 10 fish in your tank in 6 months better buy a 250 gallon.
Absolutely right. There are so many variables that to blame it all on the rock would be to ignore the bigger picture of what is going on in ones system.
travelerjp98
Active Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by deejeff442 http:///forum/thread/382927/another-new-guy-to-the-hobby-need-suggesstions/280#post_3387705
i sure aint an expert.i dont think anyone can ever be in this hobby.too many variables trying to take the ocean and cram it into a cube.but over the years i have learned if you want to cram alot of fish into a tank it dont work no matter what equipment you have.light bioload and you will be good.sure you can put 10 fish in a 55 gallon.but no matter what filtration you have over time it will turn on you.just my opinion.i have always had 10-20 nitrates but i dont think that is anything.i have never had a tank over 40.as most of you know nature takes time to mature and patience is key here.
if you want 10 fish in your tank in 6 months better buy a 250 gallon.
+1
Originally Posted by deejeff442 http:///forum/thread/382927/another-new-guy-to-the-hobby-need-suggesstions/280#post_3387705
i sure aint an expert.i dont think anyone can ever be in this hobby.too many variables trying to take the ocean and cram it into a cube.but over the years i have learned if you want to cram alot of fish into a tank it dont work no matter what equipment you have.light bioload and you will be good.sure you can put 10 fish in a 55 gallon.but no matter what filtration you have over time it will turn on you.just my opinion.i have always had 10-20 nitrates but i dont think that is anything.i have never had a tank over 40.as most of you know nature takes time to mature and patience is key here.
if you want 10 fish in your tank in 6 months better buy a 250 gallon.
+1
travelerjp98
Active Member
MMyuki, how's progress on the tank going?
+1 again to deejeff442 for such a true statement.
+1 again to deejeff442 for such a true statement.
marinebiofreak
New Member
You guys are really nice *sarcastic*. Thanks for making me look like an idiot.
2quills
Well-Known Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by marinebiofreak http:///forum/thread/382927/another-new-guy-to-the-hobby-need-suggesstions/280#post_3388181
You guys are really nice *sarcastic*. Thanks for making me look like an idiot.
Don't stress it man. People just typically don't tend to take well to advice offered without specific information given to back up claims such as this. Without knowing what is going on in a given situation it's hard to blame problems on just one thing or another, especially when it comes to nitrates when it could be a combination of factors.
Originally Posted by marinebiofreak http:///forum/thread/382927/another-new-guy-to-the-hobby-need-suggesstions/280#post_3388181
You guys are really nice *sarcastic*. Thanks for making me look like an idiot.
Don't stress it man. People just typically don't tend to take well to advice offered without specific information given to back up claims such as this. Without knowing what is going on in a given situation it's hard to blame problems on just one thing or another, especially when it comes to nitrates when it could be a combination of factors.
marinebiofreak
New Member
Ok thanks 
Feeling better...the whole live rock thing was just something I picked up from an intern at a fish store... :/
Feeling better...the whole live rock thing was just something I picked up from an intern at a fish store... :/
deejeff442
Active Member
info from a fish store.well that explains it.
flower
Well-Known Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by deejeff442 http:///forum/thread/382927/another-new-guy-to-the-hobby-need-suggesstions/280#post_3388210
info from a fish store.well that explains it.
I wonder what the fish store guy was trying to sell instead of live rock. I overheard a store guy tell a fellow to keep his tank cold (70 or below) for his tropical SW fish because they come from the deep ocean and it's cold down there.
Then there was the guy who asked if I ever used windex on my outside tank glass...he said I needed a new tank if I have ever cleaned the glass. I told him then my fish were doomed because of the spaghetti the kids smeared on it the year before, and no I didn't need a new tank.
Originally Posted by deejeff442 http:///forum/thread/382927/another-new-guy-to-the-hobby-need-suggesstions/280#post_3388210
info from a fish store.well that explains it.
Then there was the guy who asked if I ever used windex on my outside tank glass...he said I needed a new tank if I have ever cleaned the glass. I told him then my fish were doomed because of the spaghetti the kids smeared on it the year before, and no I didn't need a new tank.
travelerjp98
Active Member
Yep, I can remember some advice I got from a fish store a couple years ago: "Yeah, you can definitely keep Goniopora lobata in a tank with low light. These corals are super easy to care for and are great for beginners."
What do you know, I was still really stupid when it came to aquariums, so I went ahead and purchased it.
It died within a month.
What do you know, I was still really stupid when it came to aquariums, so I went ahead and purchased it.
It died within a month.