Back to the Draft?

[wrassecal]

ALL wars throughout history have been fought for one reason and one reason only - POWER
Resources = power
Religion = power
Politics = power
European countries as well as the US in "recent" history has had power. Wonder why they hate US now? - we are the only "superpower" left. Doesn't matter what we are like, what our politics are, or anything. Only that we have the "power". Everyone believes that everyone else is abusing their power. Terrorists don't want us to have the power over their resources or their religion. They want the power. European nations and their tag alongs in the UN want the power. Everyone wants the power. Goes all the way back in recorded time. The problem for us now is that it's globalized. No longer are we protected by our oceans and friendly neighbors to the the north and south. If we do not learn to play by the new rules then it will be our downfall as the last superpower in the world. Countries always have and always will align themselves with the group that they believe will give them the most power at the time and the circumstance. There is absolutely nothing we can do about it.
So, the question becomes who do want to have the power?

 

[krowleey]

we are the only superpower? what about China? how about Russia? when did the other superpowers lose thier power and left just us? and how did it happen? how did we get the super power status? and how is our superpower more super than other countries with nukes and tech?

 

[wrassecal]

I'm a bit surprised you ask about Russia but, the answers to your questions are long so you might want to google it. China however is an interesting question. Pre 9/11 conventional wisdom had it that the next big "threat" would be China. I somehow doubt that they are just sitting around while the middle eastern terrorism thing is going on. I attended a lecture last year given by the President of PetroChina. He spoke about the changes in government control of the oil and gas industry in China and how they were moving to more of a western system of "corporations" with plenty of powerpoint slides showing the "new" corporate structure of PetroChina and how it benefits the employees. Yeah, right. Here is something to think about. GRE testing in other countries especially China is down 50%. The new VISA regulations post 9/11 and other considerations like American professors have many more alliances and teach in foreign countries (making lots of $$ as consultants) shows that we are now more than ever exporting one of our most valuable resources and that is education. Professors from my department teach in Russia, China, Kuwait, Angola, Nigeria, Algeria and we are putting together a plan with the University of Baghdad. Since things are so bad in Iraq they will meet this summer in Jordan to put a plan together for the program. Education=power. By the way, I work in the petroleum engineering school and petroleum/natural gas = resources = power.

 

[daniel411]

Originally posted by krowleey
we are the only superpower? what about China? how about Russia? when did the other superpowers lose thier power and left just us? and how did it happen? how did we get the super power status? and how is our superpower more super than other countries with nukes and tech?
Chinas status of being a super power will in a short amount of time, not yet though. Personally I think a super power conglomorate will come from the European Union or a fraction of it first though.
Russia/USSR lost its super power status with the crumbling of its might military, economy, and its "break-away republics"(as is the term of the moment). Although its currently down, remember... Germany was in the same position after WW1. It came back as a lion while everyone slept. The same is likely to happen again, IMO.
While other nations have tech, no nation has (in general) as advanced tech as we do. Again, that may change very soon. Look at how many research institutes are being created around the world. Not all are american research centers that are being transferred overseas/mostly the funding. Much of americas research/economy is funded with other nations money. As its been a safe prosperous harbor for them to invest.
While other nations have nukes, only Vladimir Putin has nearly as many as we do. However "his" stockpile is very questionable in capability. I can't recall the latest estimate of China's nukes, but they have hardly enough to decimate the US like Russian could. Unfortunately, they do have nukes as advanced as we do now thanks to a bit of espionage on their part. That went unpunished.

 

[wrassecal]

It came back as a lion while everyone slept.
:yes:
Chinas status of being a super power will in a short amount of time, not yet though. Personally I think a super power conglomorate will come from the European Union or a fraction of it first though.
:yes:
Countries always have and always will align themselves with the group that they believe will give them the most power at the time and the circumstance.
Could it be that while we turn our attention to "faction" fighting and the new abilities of small groups to breach our nation and attack us that there are new alignments and/or realignments of powerful nations going on for the purpose of power?
:yes:
Will we as a nation be able to protect our country in the future without instituting a draft? IMO we can only expect the unexpected.

 

[daniel411]

Originally posted by Wrassecal
Education=power.
Woo hoo! Starting freshman courses after this outage at work. My gap year well.... was more than a year!

 

[tony detroit]

Originally posted by krowleey
And Tony im willing to bet most iraqis work as or more hard that you could even imagine.
Well, I'll be jackhammering a #6 oil sludge oil tanker next week, with about 15pounds of ppe on and sweating like a slave, so I kinda doubt that. Nice try

 

[dicemanj]

For poeple that have nothing good to say about our country, leave, there is nothing keeping you from starting a better life somewhere else. There is a reason people are illegally trying to enter our country.
Tony- I don't doubt that you work hard, but so do alot of people.

 

[blackomne]

You want to know superpowers look and see which countries have an active space program. And Nukes.
US
RUSSIA
EUROPEAN SPACE AGENCY
CHINA
INDIA

 

[redwinger]

Originally posted by tony detroit
Ok, well then tell me, why do you think this war is necessary?
When the diplomatic route doesn't work.
It must be total anhilation too. That is all crack pots and extremists understand. It 's the only way to "bring what's left of them to the table".
Letting them hang around, doing things half ass, only lets thme regroup for years later.
So far, so good with the PHs.

 

[krowleey]

Originally posted by tony detroit
Well, I'll be jackhammering a #6 oil sludge oil tanker next week, with about 15pounds of ppe on and sweating like a slave, so I kinda doubt that. Nice try

thats the difference between you and them, you sweat like a slave, they sweat and are slaves.

 

[tony detroit]

Redwinger-while I respect your opinions and they are good, I feel a little different, I think every effort must be exhausted before considering war and war to be considered as the very last measure to be taken.

 

[fishman830]

i'm bringing this back because of the "new" news, word is that the change in the draft law is they're pretty much widening the people who are "elidgable" to be drafted.. and instead of going ot the post office to fill out your registration, you can do it online..
if this doesn't say that a draft is imminent or in the near future.. i don't know what does

 

[simm]

they aint gonna draft. and yes they have wided it. Because of the stunts pulled in the vietnam war, college is not a deferment any more. Neither is marriage or having kids. Canada has even signed a bill with the US to keep draft dodgers out. There are a few deferments thought. Like being a Preacher. check out their site www.sss.gov. its even posted they are not.

 

[fishman830]

Originally posted by simm
they aint gonna draft. and yes they have wided it. Because of the stunts pulled in the vietnam war, college is not a deferment any more. Neither is marriage or having kids. Canada has even signed a bill with the US to keep draft dodgers out. There are a few deferments thought. Like being a Preacher. check out their site www.sss.gov. its even posted they are not.

Time shall tell...

 

[jlem]

Originally posted by tony detroit
I think every effort must be exhausted before considering war and war to be considered as the very last measure to be taken.
WW2 was a last measure and it cost MILLIONS of lives and most of them where innocent. If Hitler would have been taken care of immediately then hardly any lives would have been lost.
MILLIONS OF DEAD ooooooooorrrrrrrrr HARDLY ANY DEAD, Sounds like the last resort was a terrible decision.

 

[fishman830]

do you realise.. war can be good for an economy.. ww2.. because of hitler... there w as aneed for tanks guns airplanes bombs ammunition and ships.. clothing food.. etc. to build all of that there was a need for jobs.. jobs meant workers.. workers meant money.. money meant wealth.. so perhaps this war will strengthen the economy

 

[ty_05_f]

Y2K scares also help economy and it doesn't put anyones life in danger.

 

[fishman830]

Freedom is a precious.. expensive thing.. grasped only by those who know it's meaning.. those who have given blood.. watched buddies die.. they then pass it on to their country. i say if you can't help your country in a time of its need.. get the hell out. DO NOT expect ANYTHING fromt his country. DO NOT mooch off of it DO NOT expect to get ANY freedom from it

 

[benrock]

Fishman, your freedom is being slowly taken away by the passing of executive orders and these anti terrorism acts. Once our liberties and constitution are gone; there will be noway to get them back. The war on Iraq really doesn't have anything to do with our Freedom. Our founding fathers and other historians warned us of these days. If we open our eyes we can see it happening.
Here are some quotes from famous historians.
Executive orders are laws established by United States presidents. These laws are not passed by the Congress and create an end-run around the Constitution.
They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety."
Benjamin Franklin
When even one American - who has done nothing wrong - is forced by fear to shut his mind and close his mouth-then all Americans are in peril:
President Harry S. Truman
"Government is not reason; it is not eloquence; it is force! Like fire, it a dangerous servant and a fearful master." George Washington.
"No free man shall ever be de-barred the use of arms. The strongest reason for the people to retain their right to keep and bear arms is as a last resort to protect themselves against tyranny in government." Thomas Jefferson
"The spirit of the times may alter, will alter. Our rulers will become corrupt, our people careless. A single zealot may commence persecution, and better men be his victims. It can never be too often repeated, that the time for fixing every essential right on a legal basis is while our rulers are honest and ourselves united. From the conclusion of this war (Revolutionary War) we shall be going downhill. It will not then be necessary to resort every moment to the people for support. They will be forgotten, therefore, and their rights disregarded. They will forget themselves, but in the sole faculty of making money, and will never think of uniting to effect a due respect for their rights. The shackles, therefore, which shall not be knocked off at the conclusion of this war, will remain on us long, will be made heavier and heavier, till our rights shall revive or expire in a convulsion." Thomas Jefferson,
Do not fear the enemy, for your enemy can only take your life. It is far better that you fear the media, for they will steal your Honor. That awful power, the public opinion of a nation, is created in America by a horde of ignorant, self-complacent simpletons who failed at ditching and shoemaking and fetched up in journalism on their way to the poorhouse:
Mark Twain