Conservatives vs. Liberals

[slice]

Originally Posted by bionicarm
http:///forum/post/3273375
I would think that if the power consumption went down by half, the power company could also reduce their output to accomodate that reduction, thereby reducing their production costs. Would they charge you less per kilowatt, or provide you with a credit because of the savings? We're talking electric companies here. You tell me.
I wouldn't be so sure. The example I am about to cite is a municipal utility, but the thought process may apply.
Here in Cary NC, we went through a rough drought a few years ago. Water restrictions were imposed and everyone was urged to conserve as much as possible. The citizens conserved SO WELL that the utilities dept. had to increase water rates to cover the revenue shortfall.
I would be willing to bet that an electricity company could make a winning case to the utilities commission that they could not cut production capability and risk future shortfalls, and be granted a rate increase to support continued capability.

 

[stdreb27]

Originally Posted by bionicarm
http:///forum/post/3273350
Yes, if a person uses more, they are charged more. However, let's say every person in your city were to crank up a hugh saltwater tank system all at once. Are you telling me the electric company wouldn't need to produce more electricity to provide the power required to run all those tanks? And if they do, you don't think they wouldn't raise that standard price per kilowatt to circumvent what it'll cost them to produce that extra required power? Of course this is an extreme example. And yes, the difference in power requirements between a incandescent and a "green" bulb is negligible to an extent. However, if you added up that difference over time, and multiplied it by the hundreds of thousands bulbs in a major metropolis like New York or LA, I think you would see a major cost savings if every home went "green" with just their light bulbs.
lol and you run a company... Yeah selling less, will lower costs. Brilliant...
Originally Posted by reefraff
http:///forum/post/3273360
Our power company does tiered rates during the summer. First x killowatts are at one rate and those over y or a higher rate. Seems like a pretty good idea. They also offer a service where they install a remote switch on your ac where they can remotely kill your compressor motor for up to 20 minutes on a heavy use day. I never noticed it going off because the blower keeps running. If you were sitting right in front of a vent you might notice the air not being as cool but it isn't going to make a difference in the temp of the house. We got a 25.00 rebate once a year for allowing them to install that thing. Thats the right way to do this stuff.
yeah, so now when the government tells the power company they can hit the button and shut off your AC... That isn't the right way to go...

 

[bionicarm]

Originally Posted by stdreb27
http:///forum/post/3273384
lol and you run a company... Yeah selling less, will lower costs. Brilliant...
yeah, so now when the government tells the power company they can hit the button and shut off your AC... That isn't the right way to go...
Depends on how you run the business. Believe it or not, but some businesses do actually provide credits to their customers if it costs them less to produce the product they are selling. How about gasoline? Do they lower how much they charge for a gallon of gas strictly on how much they pay for a barrel of oil, or do they also adjust their cost based on how much it cost them to refine the oil?
As far as my business mijo, it's all fee based. But I do reduce my 'per person' fees based on the amount of work that comes with the job. For example, if a project only requires one individual, I would charge a rate of $100/hr for thier services. But if the project is big enough, and it requires three or four individuals, I'd only charge $50 - $75/hr for each person.

 

[bang guy]

If by "they" you mean the retail gas station, their price is usually based on their most recent purchase from the refinery and has nothing to do with the price of oil.

 

[reefraff]

Originally Posted by stdreb27
http:///forum/post/3273384
lol and you run a company... Yeah selling less, will lower costs. Brilliant...
yeah, so now when the government tells the power company they can hit the button and shut off your AC... That isn't the right way to go...
Government doesn't tell them and it is a voluntary program on our part so it isn't a big government kinda thing.

 

[stdreb27]

Originally Posted by bionicarm
http:///forum/post/3273421
Depends on how you run the business. Believe it or not, but some businesses do actually provide credits to their customers if it costs them less to produce the product they are selling. How about gasoline? Do they lower how much they charge for a gallon of gas strictly on how much they pay for a barrel of oil, or do they also adjust their cost based on how much it cost them to refine the oil?
As far as my business mijo, it's all fee based. But I do reduce my 'per person' fees based on the amount of work that comes with the job. For example, if a project only requires one individual, I would charge a rate of $100/hr for thier services. But if the project is big enough, and it requires three or four individuals, I'd only charge $50 - $75/hr for each person.
Think about what you said, it is only half true, if that, considering the overhead of power transmission...

 

[scottnlisa]

I am the OTHER owner of this account Lisa, I read all the posts I feel everyone has a right to an opinion. It was hard not to laugh at one point but mostly just shake my head at a bunch of folks on a saltwater fish forum filled with so much hate towards people they don't know or have ever met. all in all I think the majority of the republicans, Oh I'm sorry must be politically correct "conservatives" in this thread watch WAAAAAY too much Fox News and you take yourselves and your extremeist rhetoric way too seriously.
I strongly feel these types of threads in forums should be discouraged. if it's a fish forum then talk about fish take your politics to political forums if they don't chew you up and spit you out first.
My parents never encouraged one political party over another growing up, when I turned 18 and registered to vote my mother always told me vote for the person not the party a view I still hold today. I am along with my husband Scott a registered Democrat and a strong supporter of the Obama administration. When he won; It was bittersweet because I knew he deserved the chance to run this country but I knew what he would be up against the sore losers would put him through the ringer and blame him for everything; how right I was.
It's very sad that the unity all americans showed in the days after 9/11 no longer exists and how divided our country has become. I don't place blame on anyone for that just sad that it happened. This is not the world I want my son to grow up in.
I recently had an experience on Facebook where I was reunited with some of my old high school friends, I had one tell me that I had no morals because I was a democrat and then went on to tell me that I hate guns, the troops, god and just about anything else I could think of... I was shocked to say the least. I had to finally block the person, didn't want to but couldn't take the harassment anymore on my OWN facebook page I was left with no choice.
I did my best to stay open minded when President Bush was in office. I try to give everyone the benefit of the doubt my political party does not define me as a human being but I've been simplified and minimized by so many people who don't know me I've had it with people telling me what my beliefs are... NO MORE!
I am a Democrat, I am a liberal, I don't push my beliefs on anyone else, I am pro gun and I eat meat, I'm pro-choice, and pro-death penalty, I'm a baptized christian along with my husband and I do have morals. The president I most admire is Lincoln, a republican and one of my favorite politicians is Tom Ridge a republican. Do I think everything President Obama does is right ? No, but I agree with his vision and I think he's a great man desperately trying to do right by all of us. Will he make mistakes? yes everyone does. Should he be blamed for everything under the sun? No but he is. conservatives want us to "Drill baby Drill" but now we are faced with a disasterous oil leak in the gulf and yeah it's Obama's fault too, everything is his fault isn't it? The Tea Party, The Birthers, I don't get it. If your lucky enough to live in the US you should pay taxes otherwise the government won't be able to run and we need structure. I was a democrat with a republican president for 8 years I never questioned his beliefs or where he was born to try to get him thrown out of office and I never disrespected the man I called him by his real name Mr. RiffRaff, Oh I'm sorry it's Reef Raff my mistake. I wouldn't be so immature. President Obama hasn't been in office long enough for us to know yet how his presidentcy is going serve this country, I do know that if the President, the House and Senate don't get on the same page nothing is going to be accomplished and we're just going to go around the same negative circles. I don't like to be judged by my political party unless you know me personally you can't tell me what my beliefs are so stop trying. Talk about fish on this forum and when offline watch your Fox News, Glenn Beck and Rush Limbaugh and leave us folks who just want to live and let live have our hobbies and try to be happy alone. I don't back extremists on either side. I also won't respond to personal attacks, but if you attack me and it's real offensive I won't stand for it. it's more important for me to be Happy than to be right.... it seems that the only way a conservative can be happy is to be right 100% of the time, that's way to much pressure for me. I'll settle for Happy and not to be Hateful of others.
Carry On...

 

[slf125]

This ^
I hate being defined by the fact that I identify myself as a democrat. Just because I like an idea doesn't mean I subscribe to the entire ideology and would support this being ideology bein taken to 1984 like extremes.

 

[stdreb27]

***scratches head****
why would A person willingly be wrong?

 

[aquaknight]

Originally Posted by scottnlisa
http:///forum/post/3273455
I strongly feel these types of threads in forums should be discouraged. if it's a fish forum then talk about fish take your politics to political forums if they don't chew you up and spit you out first. Talk about fish on this forum and when offline watch your Fox News, Glenn Beck and Rush Limbaugh and leave us folks who just want to live and let live have our hobbies and try to be happy alone.
That's sort of one of the good qualities of an "Off-Topic" section of a forum... That there's room for "Off-Topic," in this case political, discussions.
Originally Posted by scottnlisa
http:///forum/post/3273455
I am a Democrat, I am a liberal, I don't push my beliefs on anyone else, I am pro gun and I eat meat, I'm pro-choice, and pro-death penalty, I'm a baptized christian along with my husband and I do have morals. The president I most admire is Lincoln, a republican and one of my favorite politicians is Tom Ridge a republican.
Then what are the attributes of being a Democrat/Liberal that cause you to consider yourself one?
Originally Posted by scottnlisa
http:///forum/post/3273455
II was a democrat with a republican president for 8 years I never questioned his beliefs or where he was born to try to get him thrown out of office and I never disrespected the man I called him by his real name Mr. RiffRaff, Oh I'm sorry it's Reef Raff my mistake. I wouldn't be so immature.
It is noble that you didn't partake insulting Bush, but you can't honestly believe there was never derogatory comments made when he was in office. Nor the stuff thrown at Obama, is anything close to what Bush put up with. I think every week there was an SNL skit making fun of him. Even Google got in on it.... Not saying the 2 wrongs bit, but there has to be a certain level of expectations...

 

[reefraff]

I guess if we were praising Obama the point of an off topic forum would be more favorable to some.

 

[scottnlisa]

I'm just merely chiming in with everyone else. I wasn't praising Obama I said I support him and agree with his vision. I believe that the second Bush administration was one of the worst and corrupt I've seen in my lifetime. that's my opinion. I know that he was made fun of just as Obama is slammed. is it right in my opinion? no. but that's me I don't write the skits for SNL.
I am Lisa, a Female, Individual and also a democrat/liberal... but not all liberals agree on certain things Yes, I vote for the person not the party, pro-gun, eat meat, pro-death penalty, am a christian, have morals, but I also am Pro-choice, Pro-universal health care, Pro-Gay Marriage, Pro-abolishing don't ask don't tell. I believe that Immigrants who come here to work take the jobs we don't want and get paid very little but still get paid better than in Mexico... if we sent them all back then gave the jobs to the americans (Farm working jobs) mostly we'd have to pay benefits and minimum wage then a head of lettuce would be about $8 a pint of strawberries would be $12 I don't want to pay those prices but I guess I would but conservatives would generally complain about the high prices. Migrant farm workers take the jobs Americans Don't want!
that is what makes me a liberal to others out there... personally I don't walk around labeling myself all day I am just me with my set of beliefs. I feel that they should not cross the boarder illegally they should get the proper paperwork and then work here. the ones already living here should live her legally and learn the english language that's all I think about that. I'm not extremist to say shoot them as they cross over... that's to Iran/Iraq Palestinian/isreali to me.

 

[scottnlisa]

Originally Posted by stdreb27
http:///forum/post/3273493
***scratches head****
why would A person willingly be wrong?
I have no idea what you mean't by this... unless your just stating that an opinion outside of your own is automatically wrong then I call that an attack. No one is willingly wrong but everyone makes mistakes that's why we are human. We are all flawed but do our best to be right as much as we can.

 

[scottnlisa]

Originally Posted by SLF125
http:///forum/post/3273464
This ^
I hate being defined by the fact that I identify myself as a democrat. Just because I like an idea doesn't mean I subscribe to the entire ideology and would support this being ideology bein taken to 1984 like extremes.
I hate labels too and I don't subscribe to all the liberal ideologies... do I walk around daily calling myself a liberal democrat no but it seems that's the only thing Republican/conservative/right understand there is no grey area for them... and Yes, I've met people who actually along with thier name introduce themselves as conservative/right wing.... could have knocked me over with a feather....

 

[mantisman51]

I was going to comment on how non-personal this thread had been and how nice it was to debate ideas without personal attacks. ScottnLisa, I am often told I am wrong. That is a risk I take when I give my opinion. I certainly have not attacked anyone and have not read an attack on anyone, until your post attacking "conservatives and rightwingers", accusing them of being all that is bad in society but not once seeing the irony in you doing the very thing your denouncing. This is The Aquarium, it is for non-aquarium stuff, you want to generalize and criticize, this is the place for it. But don't expect every post to agree with your ideology either. Time for some big boy and big girl pants.

 

[stdreb27]

Originally Posted by scottnlisa
http:///forum/post/3273557
I have no idea what you mean't by this... unless your just stating that an opinion outside of your own is automatically wrong then I call that an attack. No one is willingly wrong but everyone makes mistakes that's why we are human. We are all flawed but do our best to be right as much as we can.
I"m just responding to what you said, but if you can't remember what you wrote, I won't bother quoting it for you...

 

[reefraff]

Originally Posted by scottnlisa
http:///forum/post/3273559
I hate labels too and I don't subscribe to all the liberal ideologies... do I walk around daily calling myself a liberal democrat no but it seems that's the only thing Republican/conservative/right understand there is no grey area for them... and Yes, I've met people who actually along with thier name introduce themselves as conservative/right wing.... could have knocked me over with a feather....
You pretty much identify yourself as a idealog when you claim "the only thing Republican/conservative/right understand there is no grey area for them..." So no liberals have that same attitude? Yeah right. You are pretty quick to label anyone who doesn't hold your ideals as extremists.

 

[darthtang aw]

Originally Posted by scottnlisa
http:///forum/post/3273455
I am the OTHER owner of this account Lisa, I read all the posts I feel everyone has a right to an opinion. It was hard not to laugh at one point but mostly just shake my head at a bunch of folks on a saltwater fish forum filled with so much hate towards people they don't know or have ever met. all in all I think the majority of the republicans, Oh I'm sorry must be politically correct "conservatives" in this thread watch WAAAAAY too much Fox News and you take yourselves and your extremeist rhetoric way too seriously.
Haven't watched any fox new in about 3 months. Bu,t way to stereotype and label a bunch of people. No, you democrats NEVER do that.
Originally Posted by scottnlisa
http:///forum/post/3273455
I strongly feel these types of threads in forums should be discouraged. if it's a fish forum then talk about fish take your politics to political forums if they don't chew you up and spit you out first.
This is the off-topic area of the ENTIRE forum. I find it amusing someone that believes these discussions should be discouraged (meaning not allowed) would willingly shirk their beliefs and interject themself into the discussion. But then again, You just proved another stereotype....
Originally Posted by scottnlisa
http:///forum/post/3273455
My parents never encouraged one political party over another growing up, when I turned 18 and registered to vote my mother always told me vote for the person not the party a view I still hold today. I am along with my husband Scott a registered Democrat and a strong supporter of the Obama administration. When he won; It was bittersweet because I knew he deserved the chance to run this country but I knew what he would be up against the sore losers would put him through the ringer and blame him for everything; how right I was.
Oh, as oppossed to how little bush was blamed and put through the ringer for everything. Hell even almost two years after his administration, the current President is still placing blame on Bush.....2 years later the blame Bush card is a bit over played. BUt You defend your guy...by the way...how is our unemployment rate? How long do tyou think the dow will be below 10,000 again? How many Eurpopean countries will we bail out and give money to? I find it amusing, it is OK to give a country that can't manage their finances and economy money, but god forbid we give money to assist a country start a new democratic government and assist in defense.
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Originally Posted by scottnlisa
http:///forum/post/3273455
I
Do I think everything President Obama does is right ? No, but I agree with his vision and I think he's a great man desperately trying to do right by all of us. Will he make mistakes? yes everyone does.
What mistakes do you believe he has made. What exactly do you believe his vision to be?
Originally Posted by scottnlisa
http:///forum/post/3273455
Should he be blamed for everything under the sun? No but he is. conservatives want us to "Drill baby Drill" but now we are faced with a disasterous oil leak in the gulf and yeah it's Obama's fault too, everything is his fault isn't it?.
He Isn't being blamed for the leak. He is receiving a little criticism about the lack of response by the fed. Congress and the whitehouse immediately went on the blame game instead of immediately going on the fix it game. This Accident would never have happenned had the oil companies not been forced to try experimental drilling...instead of drilling in places with what we know works.
He isn't being blamed for the economy or anything else that has happenned ...he is receiving critisism because the policies and bills he has pushed have not bore any fruit......None....Oh wait, I am wrong, wall street is back to getting rich again. But other than that he is not being blamed, he is being graded on how effective of a response we are seeing. The problem is not his fault,, most of us Conservative realize that. But where we part ways is we aren't seeing any results and in fact seeing things become worse, either by his actions or inactions depending the topic.

 

[bionicarm]

That's the problem Darth. You want immediate results from the guy. Obama spent the first year of his term catching up with all the crap Bush left him. And PLEASE don't tell me Bush left this country in some perfect world in the last two years of his second term. That's why the liberals still blame Bush. Oh wait, it wasn't Bush, it was the Democrat-led Congress.

Yet you go on saying Obama doesn't do anything but criticize Congress instead of working with them. Why didn't Bush do the same? I don't care who you would've stuck in that position in 2008. Nothing would be where you and all the other Conservatives in this country would want it. McCain, Romney, Clinton, whoever wouldn't be any further than where Obama is now. That's the reality of it. But instead of giving the guy at least some benefit of the doubt, you just want to lay the hammer down on the guy to try and run him out of office so we can have yet another Bush clone, or god forbid another Reagan.

 

[reefraff]

Originally Posted by bionicarm
http:///forum/post/3273635
That's the problem Darth. You want immediate results from the guy. Obama spent the first year of his term catching up with all the crap Bush left him. And PLEASE don't tell me Bush left this country in some perfect world in the last two years of his second term. That's why the liberals still blame Bush. Oh wait, it wasn't Bush, it was the Democrat-led Congress.

Yet you go on saying Obama doesn't do anything but criticize Congress instead of working with them. Why didn't Bush do the same? I don't care who you would've stuck in that position in 2008. Nothing would be where you and all the other Conservatives in this country would want it. McCain, Romney, Clinton, whoever wouldn't be any further than where Obama is now. That's the reality of it. But instead of giving the guy at least some benefit of the doubt, you just want to lay the hammer down on the guy to try and run him out of office so we can have yet another Bush clone, or god forbid another Reagan.
But it waaaaas the Democrat led Congress

Look, Congress does create all the spending. The white house can't spend a nickle if Congress doesn't approve it and when Pelosi and Reid hit town the economy was in good shape so why would it be fair to only blame Bush.