Do you follow your own advice?

snakeblitz33

Well-Known Member
Or do you say some things just to cover your butt?
Let me go first...
I read people articles, threads, posts, etc. etc. and I constantly hear some things over and over and over again. For example:
- Do not dose what you don't test for.
- Don't use bioballs.
- Don't use tap water. Even when starting a tank.
- Do frequent water changes, once a week etc. etc.
- Don't use any chemicals to correct problems
- Always use a GFCI unit
- Use gloves when handling corals and live rock
- Don't use biowheel filters
- Don't grow Caulerpa because it will go sexual
- Chaeto is the best macro to grow
- Protein skimmers are a necessary piece of equipment
- Don't put a yellow tang in a 4 foot tank
- Mix your saltwater 24 hours before use
- Don't use canister filters because they are nitrate factories.
Those are just a few of the things that I always hear that people say over and over again. But, to be honest, haven't you dosed a calcium and alkalinity product in your tank without testing first? Doesn't it get old testing every single time you want to do something to your water? Isn't testing once a week or once a month, or when things look "off" enough? I've dosed my tanks without knowing my water parameters. I check once a week or once a month to make sure everything is on par. I think that it's essential to do when you are just starting to get used to dosing a chemical, but when you get the feel for it, I doubt it's necessary to test every single time.
Bioballs aren't bad if they are maintained - wet/dry filtration systems are still the number one type of filtration system sold in the commercial market, not refugium sumps... Granted, they are sold to first time consumers or used by fish stores that have been around for generations and use what works for them. I've used bioballs successfully in systems for a long time with periodic maintenance and it seems to do a decent job of filtering the water. Many people say if it ain't broke - don't fix it!
I've consistantly used tap water to start tanks over the years. In my area, the tap isn't completely bad to start the tank with. I wouldn't keep topping it off every time, but there is an algae spike for a month and then it goes away with proper husbandry... I don't see what is the big deal, to be honest. I've had many successful tanks started with conditioned tap water, including some SPS dominated tanks. But every person on here that I talk to, I say to start with RO/DI water because I cover my butt in case their tank crashes because of bad tap water.
People say to do frequent water changes all the time to get your nitrates, phosphates, calcium and alkalinity,... and magnesium back in order and balanced, but if you know your stuff you should be able to use those test kits to keep your water parameters in check. There's also tools an aquarist can use to reduce nitrate and phosphate in the system without water changes. Those tools are such things as macroalgaes, remote deep sand beds, refugiums, excess live rock, low fish bioloads, algae scrubbers, and chemical means such as nitrate and phosphate removing media. I've gone a year or a little over in some tanks without a water change. I keep a close eye on salinity and monitor it once a month, and if it starts going low because of salt creep, I add some saltwater to get it back up. I feel like topping off with saltwater when your salinity goes low is just enough to add enough trace elements to the system without doing a complete water change. Sometimes if you are adding a three part calcium/alkalinity/magnesium buffer, your salinity can get a bit high, and taking out some saltwater is necessary. Basically, I don't believe that frequent (once a week, once a month) water changes are necessary to maintain a healthy system.
Some say not to use any chemicals to correct a problem - like an antibiotic to kill cyanobacteria, or GFO to control phosphates. I think that with proper care and maintenance, you shouldn't have to - but there's more than one way to skin a cat - and I know, because I'm a taxidermist. Some chemicals can be used to balance your tank, others are used to remove things from your tank. In any case, being a saltwater aquarist - we are amature alchemists. Learning how to balance calcium, alkalinity, magnesium and pH is absolutely essential to maintain the health and well being of your tank. Sometimes it's not as easy as "do a water change."
"Always use a GFCI unit" - I tell people this to cover my butt, just incase their tank electrocutes them, their family, or burns down their house - then I'm not responsible. I've had ungrounded tanks on regular outlets that I have made sure had all the proper safety procedures, and a powerstrip with a built in fuse - and I've been just fine. I don't recommend it, but I'm just saying that I can't say I haven't done it because then I'de be a hypocrit.
"Use gloves when handling corals and live rock" - I've seen this over and over throughout the years, and I recommend to new aquarists to do it as well... but do I follow my own advice? No. I can't tell you how many times I've reached into a tank and moved my live rock and corals around without gloves. Albeit - I'm being very careful and watching what I am doing. I'm just sayin...
"Don't use Biowheel type filters" Mainly because they splash and create salt creep and the biowheel creates nitrates etc. etc. I've used biowheel filters (Emperor 280, 400) on many tanks as the main filter and have never had any problems.
"Don't grow caulerpa because it will go sexual" Some people have had the unfortunate experience of caulerpa species of macroalgaes releasing eggs/sperm into the water column and flooding their tank with the nitrate and phosphate that they have absorbed. This is because proper husbandry didn't take place. Caulerpa is an awesome macroalgae - very pretty in some varieties - and with proper pruning, it will probably never go sexual. It's not an algae to completely avoid. I've had caulerpa varieties in many fuges, and have never had a single problem with it.
"Chaeto is the best macroalgae to grow." Chaeto does well for some and doesn't do so well for others. Chaeto has a tendency to crumble and get caught in return pumps, and in fact, I believe it's not the most efficient macro there is, personally. I can't prove it by any means, but I don't go around saying Chaetomorpha algae is the king of the hill, the beez neez, the cats pajamas of all macroalgaes...
"Protein skimmers are a necessary piece of equipment." No they aren't. They are a useful tool for reducing waste in an aquarium, yes, but it's not necessary. Adequate biofiltration with lots of live rock, remote deep sand beds, macroalgae refugiums, algae scrubbers, water changes, and low fish bioloads are all great ways of maintaining a healthy tank without a protein skimmer. Protein skimmers are the most marketed piece of aquarium equipment there is, and it has new aquarists convinced that they need one to keep a saltwater aquarium. Protein skimmers are useful, and are a tool, (which I will use) but are not completely necessary for a healthy tank.
"No tangs in a 4 foot tank." I've kept a yellow tang in a 4foot tank for 4 years without any signs of stress, ich or anything. It was just ONE tang, granted, but it can be done. I hate it when the tang police show up and bash people who keep one small tang in a four foot tank. Leave em' alone.
"Mix your saltwater 24 hours before use." How many of you start mixing your saltwater at 8pm one night, and then do a water change around 4 or 5PM the next day? I've done a water change with freshly mixed saltwater after 12 hours without any problems at all. You could possibly do a water change at the one hour mark if you aerate it with a powerful air pump and a couple air stones and a large pump. There are a lot of variables when it comes to mixing saltwater. As a new hobbyist, though, 24 hours seems to be the standard. I'll say to mix the full 24 hours before using because I don't want to be liable for any damages/loss of life. But, for me - It all just depends.
These are just a few of the things that I hear over and over that I actually tell people to do or not to do, but sometimes I don't follow my own advice. What do you tell people, and then do or not do? I'm just curious...
 

luvmyreef

Active Member
Replies in red.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SnakeBlitz33 http:///t/388540/do-you-follow-your-own-advice#post_3426984
Or do you say some things just to cover your butt?
Let me go first...
I read people articles, threads, posts, etc. etc. and I constantly hear some things over and over and over again. For example:
- Do not dose what you don't test for.
- Don't use bioballs.
- Don't use tap water. Even when starting a tank.
- Do frequent water changes, once a week etc. etc.
- Don't use any chemicals to correct problems
- Always use a GFCI unit
- Use gloves when handling corals and live rock
- Don't use biowheel filters
- Don't grow Caulerpa because it will go sexual
- Chaeto is the best macro to grow
- Protein skimmers are a necessary piece of equipment
- Don't put a yellow tang in a 4 foot tank
- Mix your saltwater 24 hours before use
- Don't use canister filters because they are nitrate factories.
Those are just a few of the things that I always hear that people say over and over again. But, to be honest, haven't you dosed a calcium and alkalinity product in your tank without testing first? Doesn't it get old testing every single time you want to do something to your water? Isn't testing once a week or once a month, or when things look "off" enough? I've dosed my tanks without knowing my water parameters. I check once a week or once a month to make sure everything is on par. I think that it's essential to do when you are just starting to get used to dosing a chemical, but when you get the feel for it, I doubt it's necessary to test every single time. I rarely test for anything, but then again I do not dose anything LOL. But newbies should test in the beginning for mult. reasons. I tend to test everything when I feel something is off.
Bioballs aren't bad if they are maintained - wet/dry filtration systems are still the number one type of filtration system sold in the commercial market, not refugium sumps... Granted, they are sold to first time consumers or used by fish stores that have been around for generations and use what works for them. I've used bioballs successfully in systems for a long time with periodic maintenance and it seems to do a decent job of filtering the water. Many people say if it ain't broke - don't fix it! Never used them, so I do not give advice on them.
I've consistantly used tap water to start tanks over the years. In my area, the tap isn't completely bad to start the tank with. I wouldn't keep topping it off every time, but there is an algae spike for a month and then it goes away with proper husbandry... I don't see what is the big deal, to be honest. I've had many successful tanks started with conditioned tap water, including some SPS dominated tanks. But every person on here that I talk to, I say to start with RO/DI water because I cover my butt in case their tank crashes because of bad tap water. I started my old 75g with tap. It was a mistake for sure. I had hair algae that you could dry and weave into a blanket!! Started my 180g with ro/di and did not have the same problem. Guess it would depend on your source water.
People say to do frequent water changes all the time to get your nitrates, phosphates, calcium and alkalinity,... and magnesium back in order and balanced, but if you know your stuff you should be able to use those test kits to keep your water parameters in check. There's also tools an aquarist can use to reduce nitrate and phosphate in the system without water changes. Those tools are such things as macroalgaes, remote deep sand beds, refugiums, excess live rock, low fish bioloads, algae scrubbers, and chemical means such as nitrate and phosphate removing media. I've gone a year or a little over in some tanks without a water change. I keep a close eye on salinity and monitor it once a month, and if it starts going low because of salt creep, I add some saltwater to get it back up. I feel like topping off with saltwater when your salinity goes low is just enough to add enough trace elements to the system without doing a complete water change. Sometimes if you are adding a three part calcium/alkalinity/magnesium buffer, your salinity can get a bit high, and taking out some saltwater is necessary. Basically, I don't believe that frequent (once a week, once a month) water changes are necessary to maintain a healthy system. If your like me, and do not dose anything, then a water change every two weeks is a good thing IMO. And this is what I do.
Some say not to use any chemicals to correct a problem - like an antibiotic to kill cyanobacteria, or GFO to control phosphates. I think that with proper care and maintenance, you shouldn't have to - but there's more than one way to skin a cat - and I know, because I'm a taxidermist. Some chemicals can be used to balance your tank, others are used to remove things from your tank. In any case, being a saltwater aquarist - we are amature alchemists. Learning how to balance calcium, alkalinity, magnesium and pH is absolutely essential to maintain the health and well being of your tank. Sometimes it's not as easy as "do a water change." There comes a time when a chemical is a last resort. There are a lot of "old school" thinkers out there that freak out at the mention of it. I have recently used one, and had good results. I don't recommend them, but the products are out there and I think that it is up to the tank owner to decide whether or not to risk it.
"Always use a GFCI unit" - I tell people this to cover my butt, just incase their tank electrocutes them, their family, or burns down their house - then I'm not responsible. I've had ungrounded tanks on regular outlets that I have made sure had all the proper safety procedures, and a powerstrip with a built in fuse - and I've been just fine. I don't recommend it, but I'm just saying that I can't say I haven't done it because then I'de be a hypocrit. I don't use one, probably should.
"Use gloves when handling corals and live rock" - I've seen this over and over throughout the years, and I recommend to new aquarists to do it as well... but do I follow my own advice? No. I can't tell you how many times I've reached into a tank and moved my live rock and corals around without gloves. Albeit - I'm being very careful and watching what I am doing. I'm just sayin... I only use gloves when fragging zoas, on a new shipment of live rock when I scrub it, etc.
"Don't use Biowheel type filters" Mainly because they splash and create salt creep and the biowheel creates nitrates etc. etc. I've used biowheel filters (Emperor 280, 400) on many tanks as the main filter and have never had any problems. I don't agree with the above statements. Biowheel HOB type filters are good, and they keep the surface water moving nicely.The emperor 400 is a good one.
"Don't grow caulerpa because it will go sexual" Some people have had the unfortunate experience of caulerpa species of macroalgaes releasing eggs/sperm into the water column and flooding their tank with the nitrate and phosphate that they have absorbed. This is because proper husbandry didn't take place. Caulerpa is an awesome macroalgae - very pretty in some varieties - and with proper pruning, it will probably never go sexual. It's not an algae to completely avoid. I've had caulerpa varieties in many fuges, and have never had a single problem with it. I have never used caulerpa, so I can't comment on it. Couldn't find it locally, only cheato. Cheato works for me but not for others.
"Chaeto is the best macroalgae to grow." Chaeto does well for some and doesn't do so well for others. Chaeto has a tendency to crumble and get caught in return pumps, and in fact, I believe it's not the most efficient macro there is, personally. I can't prove it by any means, but I don't go around saying Chaetomorpha algae is the king of the hill, the beez neez, the cats pajamas of all macroalgaes... Works for me, but I haven't tried any other kind. May get some shave brush plants next.
"Protein skimmers are a necessary piece of equipment." No they aren't. They are a useful tool for reducing waste in an aquarium, yes, but it's not necessary. Adequate biofiltration with lots of live rock, remote deep sand beds, macroalgae refugiums, algae scrubbers, water changes, and low fish bioloads are all great ways of maintaining a healthy tank without a protein skimmer. Protein skimmers are the most marketed piece of aquarium equipment there is, and it has new aquarists convinced that they need one to keep a saltwater aquarium. Protein skimmers are useful, and are a tool, (which I will use) but are not completely necessary for a healthy tank. I think it depends on the setup. Sometimes it is needed more than others.
"No tangs in a 4 foot tank." I've kept a yellow tang in a 4foot tank for 4 years without any signs of stress, ich or anything. It was just ONE tang, granted, but it can be done. I hate it when the tang police show up and bash people who keep one small tang in a four foot tank. Leave em' alone. I successfully kept a yellow tang in my 75g for 6 years. But I think newbies should be aware that they will eventually out grow that small of an environment (and if they are like us and tend to get attached to our fish) it can be hard for them later.
"Mix your saltwater 24 hours before use." How many of you start mixing your saltwater at 8pm one night, and then do a water change around 4 or 5PM the next day? I've done a water change with freshly mixed saltwater after 12 hours without any problems at all. You could possibly do a water change at the one hour mark if you aerate it with a powerful air pump and a couple air stones and a large pump. There are a lot of variables when it comes to mixing saltwater. As a new hobbyist, though, 24 hours seems to be the standard. I'll say to mix the full 24 hours before using because I don't want to be liable for any damages/loss of life. But, for me - It all just depends. I don't do this. I make my ro/di water up the day before. I mix it well, measure for correct numbers, and off into the tank it goes. There is a powerhead in with it, but I don't make a big deal out of the whole 24hr thing.
These are just a few of the things that I hear over and over that I actually tell people to do or not to do, but sometimes I don't follow my own advice. What do you tell people, and then do or not do? I'm just curious...
I will only give advice on the experiences that I have had. good or bad. And yes, I respect others advice and will, like everyone else, make my own decision in the end. I am open minded on most things.
 

morgan175

Member
LOVE YOUR THREADS. BUT SHOULD BE TITLED DEEP THOUGHTS BY SNAKE. I'M TRYING TO DO THINGS THE RIGHT WAY TO CUT DOWN ON PROBLEMS.
YES I EVEN WENT OUT AND BOUGHT A GFI ON YOUR ADVICE.
 

snakeblitz33

Well-Known Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by Al&Burke http:///t/388540/do-you-follow-your-own-advice#post_3427083
Man when do you find the time time to type all of this. LOL
In between housework and naptime.
Quote:
Originally Posted by morgan175
http:///t/388540/do-you-follow-your-own-advice#post_3427088
LOVE YOUR THREADS. BUT SHOULD BE TITLED DEEP THOUGHTS BY SNAKE. I'M TRYING TO DO THINGS THE RIGHT WAY TO CUT DOWN ON PROBLEMS.
YES I EVEN WENT OUT AND BOUGHT A GFI ON YOUR ADVICE.
THATS THE MORGAN I KNOW! GOOD FOR YOU!
 

geoj

Active Member
There is no black and white, right and wrong, as many posters wish. I break all the rules if and when it is needed. Of coarse with experience you learn how far you can push your luck and when it is time to get back to work. To stay in the hobby you have to put in the time and effort to make a satisfying tank but also take a break when needed. So find the shortcuts that you can live with, and live with them....
 

aquaknight

Active Member
I like Geo's answer, shades of gray. The yellow tang is a good example. There is quite the difference between a yellow tang being stuffed into a 4ft. 55gal with other tangs and large fish, versus being the only big fish in an also 4ft. 90gal or 4ft. 120gal. My 10+ year old YT has never seen a tank bigger then 90gal, but he's always been the only large fish.
I think perhaps what some people may be seeing, is that different people tend to be overly critical of some aspects to aquaria for different reasons, and thus it may seem like there's lots of people critical about everything. Someone who's critical about GFCI's may have been seriously shocked themselves or lost a tank that would have been saved with a GFCI, tends to be pushy about it. While on that same token, they make not QT new additions. People who have lost everything to disease, like myself, will be critical about QT'ing, and laissez-faire on other topics.
People who have these large tanks, tend to be a little critical with fish that really should go in decent sized tanks. I tend to be critical of canister filters, as I just don't see a point to them, and especially if the person asking about them, doesn't have them yet, their money could be better spent elsewhere.
I am bad with gfci's and cord's in general, at least on my QT's. I also never wear gloves, fragging zoas, handling fish, I don't even think I have a set that I could use.... I can't remember the last time I tested the 240gal, even for salinity. I've started keeping some higher-end SPS in my 90 reef, so I've been somewhat good with tests and water changes there. The corals haven't tolerated any slack, I have a pretty substantial bioload.
 

flower

Well-Known Member
Hi,
LOL...there is a difference between your own advice as the title reads, and all advice ever given.
The only advice I am guilty of not following is using a quarantine tank...I advise that very strongly because I had ich in a reef tank, oh the grief I had to deal with. My goal was to prevent others that grief.
As for don't dose what you don't test for. If your alkalinity is low you do a test to find that out...the bottle or powder container tells you how much over time to add to raise it. My calcium says the same. So I do my tests and if something is low, I dose the recommended amount all week then retest to see how far my tank is from the desired numbers and go from there. So you don't test every single time. My advice was given to new reefers who were dosing iodide and had never tested to see if they even needed iodide to begin with.
I do try and pass on advice that I think is good...no tangs in a 4 foot tank. I can't begin to discribe the disaster of taking out every rock and stirring up sand to catch an overgrown fish that needs to be rehomed. I used to hold to the idea that a smaller tang can be kept for a while, then rehomed...I did it, and so after finding out how much of a pain it is to catch a fish in an established tank...I now tell folks to get the right fish for the tank to start with.
LOL...I always wait 24 hours or more before I use my new mixed salt and ONLY once in an emergancy I didn't, because either waiting or using burning salt would kill the fish, I took a huge chance and it worked. My heater had broke and with so much death I had to change the water fast....the situation could not get any worse when I did it.
Do I follow my own advice?.... Absolutly. Have I passed on what I felt was good advice that others have given?.... Absolutly, because of that advice I started doing it and pass it on.
I didn't comment on every bit of advice you listed...I never used bioballs and I stopped using biowheel HOB because it made salt creep...but so does my bubbles for the SH tank....I quit saying anything. I do use GFCI...it saved my 90g when the heater went...I had no fish loss, only inverts and a great deal of coral.
 

mantisman51

Active Member
I had a successful reef for several years after I got rid of the skimmer, refugium and used a canister filter on a 125g tank. I never once had an algae problem and never had a nitrate problem. Those three "rules" are bunk. Yep, now comes the recriminations because it is against the law to dissent.
 

bang guy

Moderator
Quote:
Originally Posted by mantisman51 http:///t/388540/do-you-follow-your-own-advice#post_3427209
I had a successful reef for several years after I got rid of the skimmer, refugium and used a canister filter on a 125g tank. I never once had an algae problem and never had a nitrate problem. Those three "rules" are bunk. Yep, now comes the recriminations because it is against the law to dissent.
You'll get no arguement from me. I've run a tank with a 1/2" sand bed as the only filtration.
I believe skimmers are useful though. Especially with systems that are on the bleeding edge of stocking levels.
 

flower

Well-Known Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by mantisman51 http:///t/388540/do-you-follow-your-own-advice#post_3427209
I had a successful reef for several years after I got rid of the skimmer, refugium and used a canister filter on a 125g tank. I never once had an algae problem and never had a nitrate problem. Those three "rules" are bunk. Yep, now comes the recriminations because it is against the law to dissent.
+1 I ran canister filters for many years and I went to a sump because my nitrates were reading 80+...turns out my test kits were old and nitrates were 1 by the time I retested with a good kit and had swapped my filteration system. Sumps are easier to maintain and it hides a butt load of equipment, but I have nothing bad to say about canister filters.
 

travelerjp98

Active Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by SnakeBlitz33 http:///t/388540/do-you-follow-your-own-advice#post_3426984
Or do you say some things just to cover your butt?
Let me go first...
I read people articles, threads, posts, etc. etc. and I constantly hear some things over and over and over again. For example:
- Do not dose what you don't test for.
agree here
- Don't use bioballs.
I say this, but my tank has them... they are just hard to maintain.
- Don't use tap water. Even when starting a tank.
LOL... do as I say, not as I do.
- Do frequent water changes, once a week etc. etc.
Wow, once again: do as I say, not as I do.
- Don't use any chemicals to correct problems
YES; unless critically necessary.
- Use gloves when handling corals and live rock
It's a good idea I guess, but I never do that!
- Don't use biowheel filters
I use a sump, so...

- Don't grow Caulerpa because it will go sexual
Agree

- Chaeto is the best macro to grow
YEP!

- Protein skimmers are a necessary piece of equipment
In 3 years of sw fish keeping, I have not had a protein skimmer once, even though they are helpful.

- Don't put a yellow tang in a 4 foot tank
YEP!

- Mix your saltwater 24 hours before use
Do as I say, not as I do.

- Don't use canister filters because they are nitrate factories.
I use a sump, so...

Wow, I don't follow my own advice too much, now do I?
 
S

siptang

Guest
Quote:
Originally Posted by SnakeBlitz33 http:///t/388540/do-you-follow-your-own-advice#post_3426984
Or do you say some things just to cover your butt?
Let me go first...
I read people articles, threads, posts, etc. etc. and I constantly hear some things over and over and over again. For example:
- Do not dose what you don't test for.
Check
- Don't use bioballs.
Check
- Don't use tap water. Even when starting a tank.
Check
- Do frequent water changes, once a week etc. etc.
Check, I do mini frequent changes.
- Don't use any chemicals to correct problems
Check
- Always use a GFCI unit
What is that? Probably not since I don't even know what it is...
- Use gloves when handling corals and live rock
Hmm... I guess I should
- Don't use biowheel filters
Disagree, I think unless power goes out for days, bio wheel is a good HOB filter system that aerates the top water well.

- Don't grow Caulerpa because it will go sexual
Check

- Chaeto is the best macro to grow
Will try one day

- Protein skimmers are a necessary piece of equipment
Check

- Don't put a yellow tang in a 4 foot tank
Shade of grey there

- Mix your saltwater 24 hours before use
Depends on but I guess I should try to do this.

- Don't use canister filters because they are nitrate factories.
I guess that depends on as well.
 

snakeblitz33

Well-Known Member
lol, ya'll are just taking what I say and going down the list. What are some of the things that you say to do, but don't do yourself? Think about it.
 

travelerjp98

Active Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by SnakeBlitz33 http:///t/388540/do-you-follow-your-own-advice#post_3427293
lol, ya'll are just taking what I say and going down the list. What are some of the things that you say to do, but don't do yourself? Think about it.
OK, I highly recommend and tell everyone to have a qt tank. But... oh goodness here it goes... I don't have one either. BUT, do as I say and not as I do!!! LOL.
 

deejeff442

Active Member
well some of us who have been at this for 20+ years would give different(safer) advise for a noob.i would say.
 

beth

Administrator
Staff member
I pretty much follow all except handling corals and live rock with gloves. I don't use gloves.
Also, depending on the kind of tank you set up would warrant the use of bioballs, canister, etc. I prefer not to use them based on the type of tank that I usually opt to keep. QT, however, would have filter pads in it and I'd use a canister with charcoal as a temporary add on to clean out meds, etc.
I also change out a gal or so a day rather than weekly maintenance. Its more a daily maintenance.
 
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