Healthcare bill will pass the senate.

oscardeuce

Active Member
Originally Posted by reefraff
http:///forum/post/3195441
There is a video of a Congressman admitting the public option was designed to drive private insurance out of business and bragging about it.
For all the talk of competition driving down costs the Dems absolutely rejected any talk of opening up the insurance market across state lines which would have been the most widespread competition you could create.
Wait until all these people with individual policies and pre existing conditions find out they wont be covered until 2014. In the mean time the insurance companies will just jack the rates up until them. A buddy of mine with Asthma which is a pre existing had his rates just jacked up from 330 and change to over 440 per month.
About the only positive thing I see coming out of this is the insurance exchanges.
I work for a self funded pre paid non profit insurance company. My complany will be heavily taxed in theis bill. Since many of the plans are "Cadillac" the employer and employees who buy my company will also be taxed for their coverage.
Do the math. It will now be cheaper for employers AND employees to take the gov't option. Our costs (taxes) go up as the gov't has forced people to opt for the "cheaper" gov't plan.
The long and short if it, I've just been legislated out of a job.
Should I keep my job, my taxes also go up.
I'm hosed no matter what.
 

oscardeuce

Active Member
Originally Posted by SteveDave08
http:///forum/post/3195405
"The bottom line seems to be that it's not perfect, but it is something. The thorny issue of abortion — many old men without wombs in both houses would like to deny it to women — will be dealt with when the House and Senate bills are reconciled. Here are some views from Senators, taken from the Times piece:
Senator Sherrod Brown, Democrat of Ohio, said insurance companies were often "just one step ahead of the sheriff."
Senator Dianne Feinstein, Democrat of California, said the industry "lacks a moral compass."
"Premiums are out of hand," Mrs. Feinstein said. "Chief executive salaries are out of hand. Administrative costs are out of hand. My bottom-line belief is that the health insurance industry should be nonprofit."
And Senator Sheldon Whitehouse, Democrat of Rhode Island, said the business model of the health insurance industry deserved to die.
"It deserves a stake through its cold and greedy heart," Mr. Whitehouse said.
The stake seems to have missed its target. But it may have wounded the insurance industry enough to make it more manageable."
Anyone know how much Ms. Feinstein makes?
Me thinks she doth protest too much.
 

reefraff

Active Member
Originally Posted by oscardeuce
http:///forum/post/3195684
I work for a self funded pre paid non profit insurance company. My complany will be heavily taxed in theis bill. Since many of the plans are "Cadillac" the employer and employees who buy my company will also be taxed for their coverage.
Do the math. It will now be cheaper for employers AND employees to take the gov't option. Our costs (taxes) go up as the gov't has forced people to opt for the "cheaper" gov't plan.
The long and short if it, I've just been legislated out of a job.
Should I keep my job, my taxes also go up.
I'm hosed no matter what.
As it stands now there is no public option to opt in to.
 

veni vidi vici

Active Member
Originally Posted by bionicarm
http:///forum/post/3195366
What do you expect from a guy who lives in Illinois? He doesn't have to deal with illegals because none of them want to live there.
Im sorry to have to correct you again ,but Illinois has as many or more Mexicans than Texas but not as many dirty Cuban refugees as south Florida.
And BTW she said definitely inverted like a belly button or something.
 

reefraff

Active Member
Originally Posted by Veni Vidi Vici
http:///forum/post/3195833
Im sorry to have to correct you again ,but Illinois has as many or more Mexicans than Texas but not as many dirty Cubans as south Florida.
And BTW she said definitely inverted like a belly button or something.
Damn dude, it's Christmas. Did Santa leave a dog turd in your stocking or something

Drink a couple quarts of well spiced egg nog and see us tomorrow.
 

bionicarm

Active Member
Originally Posted by Veni Vidi Vici
http:///forum/post/3195833
Im sorry to have to correct you again ,but Illinois has as many or more Mexicans than Texas but not as many dirty Cuban refugees as south Florida.
And BTW she said definitely inverted like a belly button or something.
I seriously doubt Illinois has a tenth of the Mexican population than Texas. They don't tolerate temps under 45 for more than a couple of days.
Interesting you would talk to your mother about her $ex life. You really must be the mama's boy Steve was describing. At least your mother enjoys those kind of things. I'm sure the last time you did the 'Horizontal Bop' was when you went down to the local farm. Illinois: Where the men are Men And the sheep are nervous.
Are you my daaaady?
I waaaant you.
Deeeeeper, Deeeper.
You know what I'm talking about don't you?
 

bionicarm

Active Member
Originally Posted by reefraff
http:///forum/post/3195841
Damn dude, it's Christmas. Did Santa leave a dog turd in your stocking or something

Drink a couple quarts of well spiced egg nog and see us tomorrow.
It's all in fun reef. I think it's rather comical and just a normal reaction from a guy like Veni.
I'm enjoying one of my better gifts this year. Fifth of Crown, and sippin' it on the rocks. I'll even drink one and toast you on this joyful holiday. Salud!!
 

reefraff

Active Member
Originally Posted by bionicarm
http:///forum/post/3195864
It's all in fun reef. I think it's rather comical and just a normal reaction from a guy like Veni.
I'm enjoying one of my better gifts this year. Fifth of Crown, and sippin' it on the rocks. I'll even drink one and toast you on this joyful holiday. Salud!!

Back at you buddy. Egg Nogg with Bacardi.
 

oscardeuce

Active Member
Originally Posted by reefraff
http:///forum/post/3195841
Damn dude, it's Christmas. Did Santa leave a dog turd in your stocking or something

Drink a couple quarts of well spiced egg nog and see us tomorrow.
Yup, this expensive, unConstitutional bill
 

reefraff

Active Member
Originally Posted by oscardeuce
http:///forum/post/3196027
There is on the House Bill.
What ever comes out of committee will be a monster.
I dunno, With the CBO comments about the "Medicare Savings" I am hopeful this will get blown up. There is no way they get the votes in the senate with a public option and not so sure the house wont hold firm on it. The CBO report gives either side a great out if they want to vote no.
 

sickboy

Active Member
Originally Posted by Darthtang AW
http:///forum/post/3194247
Look at abortion....a doctor must perform the abortion procedure ...they can not state it is against their beliefs...they HAVE TO do it.
Actually this is NOT true. My father, and his private practice, just got bought out by a County run hospital and one of his concerns as a devout Catholic was no birth control, no abortions. They put a clause in his contract so he doesn't have to do anything that goes against his beliefs. One of his colleagues is Hindi and she has the same clause in her contract. And remember, this is technically a Public Institution that is providing this contract. Not sure where you are getting this information....
 

reefraff

Active Member
Originally Posted by sickboy
http:///forum/post/3196361
Actually this is NOT true. My father, and his private practice, just got bought out by a County run hospital and one of his concerns as a devout Catholic was no birth control, no abortions. They put a clause in his contract so he doesn't have to do anything that goes against his beliefs. One of his colleagues is Hindi and she has the same clause in her contract. And remember, this is technically a Public Institution that is providing this contract. Not sure where you are getting this information....
I just looked it up, there is a lawsuit seeking to eliminate the provision in the law allowing the docs to refuse to do them but for now they don't have to. There is also a bill working it's way through the system that would require all hospitals to perform them if they participate in any federally funded programs. As you can imagine all those Catholic hospitals aint too happy about that one.
 

sickboy

Active Member
Originally Posted by reefraff
http:///forum/post/3196379
I just looked it up, there is a lawsuit seeking to eliminate the provision in the law allowing the docs to refuse to do them but for now they don't have to. There is also a bill working it's way through the system that would require all hospitals to perform them if they participate in any federally funded programs. As you can imagine all those Catholic hospitals aint too happy about that one.
I imagine if he was forced, he would just leave and start a new practice again, as he didn't have to sell, the money was that good.
So much for the Hippocratic Oath huh? I really don't see how they can force anyone to do that because of Federal Funding, but I guess abortion has been deemed legal by the Supreme Court.
 

reefraff

Active Member
Originally Posted by sickboy
http:///forum/post/3196383
I imagine if he was forced, he would just leave and start a new practice again, as he didn't have to sell, the money was that good.
So much for the Hippocratic Oath huh? I really don't see how they can force anyone to do that because of Federal Funding, but I guess abortion has been deemed legal by the Supreme Court.
Tooth implants are legal too but dentists aren't forced to do them if they don't want to.
 

dragonzim

Active Member
Originally Posted by sickboy
http:///forum/post/3196361
Actually this is NOT true. My father, and his private practice, just got bought out by a County run hospital and one of his concerns as a devout Catholic was no birth control, no abortions. They put a clause in his contract so he doesn't have to do anything that goes against his beliefs. One of his colleagues is Hindi and she has the same clause in her contract. And remember, this is technically a Public Institution that is providing this contract. Not sure where you are getting this information....
He should be put out of business for refusing to issue birth control

[hr]
.
 

ironeagle2006

Active Member
Dragon Zim a little thing called the Separation of CHURCH and State and FREEDOM OF RELIGION. By his own Religion he can not issue Birth Control Perform Abortions and such. We have the same problem in my town the Hospital is Catholic and no women or Men can get Surgical Sterlization don e there. However we go 18 miles away to the next town to a Non-Catholic Hosptial and the Same Docs have Privileges there and the girls can get Cut Tied and Burned and the Men can get the Snip done. However here in town the Docs can not even talk about it because of the Contract they have with the Hospital.
 

bionicarm

Active Member
Originally Posted by ironeagle2006
http:///forum/post/3196484
Dragon Zim a little thing called the Separation of CHURCH and State and FREEDOM OF RELIGION. By his own Religion he can not issue Birth Control Perform Abortions and such. We have the same problem in my town the Hospital is Catholic and no women or Men can get Surgical Sterlization don e there. However we go 18 miles away to the next town to a Non-Catholic Hosptial and the Same Docs have Privileges there and the girls can get Cut Tied and Burned and the Men can get the Snip done. However here in town the Docs can not even talk about it because of the Contract they have with the Hospital.
So how does a hospital like that stay in business? I'd have a hard time living in a community where religion dictates how I live my life. It's a sad state of affairs when a doctor or hospital puts their own religious beliefs over the health and welfare of their patients. What I do find interesting is in the Hippocratic Oath, there is the inclusion of this line -- "and similarly I will not give a woman a pessary to cause an ab0rtion." The modern version states, " I will neither prescribe nor administer a lethal dose of medicine to any patient even if asked nor counsel any such thing nor perform the utmost respect for every human life from fertilization to natural death and reject ab0rtion that deliberately takes a unique human life."
So by these statements, any doctor that performs an abortion is breaking the Hippocratic Oath. However, Roe vs. Wade legally superceeds this Oath, I assume, otherwise no doctor could 'legally' perform ab0rtions. But again, I'd hate to have to rely on a hospital like this where I lived. I'd hate knowing that I could require a procedure that this hospital would not perform due to their religious convictions, and I'd die before getting to a hospital that would perform the procedure.
 

reefraff

Active Member
Originally Posted by bionicarm
http:///forum/post/3196498
So how does a hospital like that stay in business? I'd have a hard time living in a community where religion dictates how I live my life. It's a sad state of affairs when a doctor or hospital puts their own religious beliefs over the health and welfare of their patients. What I do find interesting is in the Hippocratic Oath, there is the inclusion of this line -- "and similarly I will not give a woman a pessary to cause an ab0rtion." The modern version states, " I will neither prescribe nor administer a lethal dose of medicine to any patient even if asked nor counsel any such thing nor perform the utmost respect for every human life from fertilization to natural death and reject ab0rtion that deliberately takes a unique human life."
So by these statements, any doctor that performs an abortion is breaking the Hippocratic Oath. However, Roe vs. Wade legally superceeds this Oath, I assume, otherwise no doctor could 'legally' perform ab0rtions. But again, I'd hate to have to rely on a hospital like this where I lived. I'd hate knowing that I could require a procedure that this hospital would not perform due to their religious convictions, and I'd die before getting to a hospital that would perform the procedure.
NOTHING exceeds your constitutional rights, supposedly. There is no right to an abortion in the constitution, there is a right to religion.
Having a Catholic hospital is better than no hospital at all. Even in a small town what percentage of the hospitals business would be snip and clip or abortions, 1% or so?
 
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