Help to make a sump without drilling my tank

flower

flower

Well-Known Member
Originally Posted by meowzer
http:///forum/post/3279627
How is a 15" skimmer gonna fit in a 12" wide tank????

LOL..it is 15 inches AROUND Take a measuring tape and you will see it is 5 inches in diameter. I measure weird, I just took a tape measure and wrote down the numbers and posted it that way.
 
meowzer

meowzer

Moderator
Originally Posted by Flower
http:///forum/post/3279633

LOL..it is 15 inches AROUND Take a measuring tape and you will see it is 5 inches in diameter. I measure weird, I just took a tape measure and wrote down the numbers and posted it that way.
GOTCHA...with all the skimmers I have been researching....BELIEVE ME...some ARE that big or bigger....
 
flower

flower

Well-Known Member
Originally Posted by meowzer
http:///forum/post/3279635
GOTCHA...with all the skimmers I have been researching....BELIEVE ME...some ARE that big or bigger....

LOL...The coralife is the biggest and most frustrating one so far for me. I run it at night so I don't have to look at all the micro bubbles. I hate it...I hope a sump will help. All HOBs are garbage, the only ones happy on here are those who run it in a sump system.
 
flower

flower

Well-Known Member
Originally Posted by meowzer
http:///forum/post/3279639
Not necessarily


DON'T YOU SAY THAT! AAAHHHH!

Do you know much grief this piece of crap has caused me??? This is skimmer number 4! All the advice I can give on a skimmer is what NOT to buy..LOL
 
meowzer

meowzer

Moderator
Originally Posted by Flower
http:///forum/post/3279641

DON'T YOU SAY THAT! AAAHHHH!

Do you know much grief this piece of crap has caused me??? This is skimmer number 4! All the advice I can give on a skimmer is what NOT to buy..LOL
I know Flower...do you know how much "great" equipment I have bought....only to find out afterwards it's inadequate :( I have a room full of spare parts
This next skimemr is gonna cost a lot...BUT BELIEVE ME....it will be the last
 
flower

flower

Well-Known Member
Originally Posted by meowzer
http:///forum/post/3279642
I know Flower...do you know how much "great" equipment I have bought....only to find out afterwards it's inadequate :( I have a room full of spare parts
This next skimemr is gonna cost a lot...BUT BELIEVE ME....it will be the last


I have a big bag of parts, thats were I found the clips for my new in tank basket of macro algae... I knew some day that stuff would be worth keeping..30 years worth of junk...LOL.
Well I need to shower and get ready for work..I will check in tomorrow and see what the thread looks like by then..have a good night.
 
J

jstdv8

Guest
my coralife skimmer works great now that its in my sump. microbubbles glaore when it was HOB on my DT.
 
2quills

2quills

Well-Known Member
So the body of your skimmer is 5" wide...what about the pump on it and the output? You need to figured out the actual footprint of the entire skimmer and that's what your dimensions for your chamber will have to be, or a little bit bigger (prefferably). For instance...would the whole thing fit inside of a 12"x14" area?
 
J

jstdv8

Guest
Flower, here is a side shot of my sump. it is very basic. the drain from teh overflow comes into the chamber with the skimmer in it on he far left of the picture. the water in this chamber is always as high as the very far left acrylic baffle you can see glues in place with silicone. Water flows over the top of that sheet and under the next one right next to it to the left. That makes a bubble trap so that bubbles have to go down to get into the next chamber. and bubbles want to rise, so not very many make it into the middle chamber at all.
The middle chamber that has all the big rocks in it is my refugium. I now have all of those rocks in my DT and I have an algae turf scrubber in that area.
Then to the far right you can see anotehr set of baffles. Basically the same idea except the opposite direction so that any surface bubbles get caught up against the first baffle on th right side of the middle chamber and cant make it under to get to the final chamber which is where my return pump is.
As you can see, the return pump chamber on mine is way too large. It only needed to be big enough to hold the pump and I could fit about 6 pumps in there. But its a 55g sump/fuge so I ahve quite a bit of room to mess up :)
Hope this helps give a visual for you.
In the event of a power outage the return pipe that oes back to the DT from the sump will also have a siphon on it and will siphon water out of your DT down the pipe that usually has water flowing up. it will siphon water out until that pipe is out of the water.
so 1 of two things needs to happen.
1.) you do what I did and leave alot of room in the sump for a fair amount of water to siphon back down. my 90g (at the time) lost about an inch of water height in the DT becuase my return pipe was in the water about an inch (which is probably alot more than I need)
or
2.) you can drill a little hole in the pipe towads the top that will cause air to get into the pipe and break the siphon so no water can drain back into the sump during power outage. Downside I found to this is that it tends to spray water when the pump is on out the little hole.
so I just run my sump lower than most. Ohters probably have solutions to this, I hanvnt tried anything else becuase if it aint broke....
 
acrylic51

acrylic51

Active Member
All exceelent recommendations here. Meowzer is correct on the benefits of a good skimmer. I think alot of people have hadissues with the coralife skimmers and microbubbles in the DT. Having it in sump might make life alittle easier. IMHO it doesn't make it any easier or harder to have your sump/fuge in separate containers. If you plump accirdingly and your system is built with these concepts in mind it is super easy.
As far as someone mentioning the syphon break hole that is a very good idea, but your sump levels should be set correctly which would mean shutting down your pumps and verifying the back syphon of the system. If the sump gets to th point of overflowing your water level is to high, so you would need to drain water from the system and keep correcting till your back syphon is at a safe level.
As far as a pump returning water from the sump to the DT, I would highly recommend an Eheim pump. More expensive than a MagDrive, but runs cooler less heat transfer to the tank water, more energy efficient as well, and more than capable of doing the job and reliable as well.
 
flower

flower

Well-Known Member

2Quills:
The pump is on a tube that fits to the skimmer, it is about 3 inches square and has a long nozzle that sticks out another 2 ½ inches. I have absolutely no idea of the output..how would I find that out..it is covered in coralline so I can’t read anything on it. I will try and look online, maybe I can find the skimmer and get information that way.
P.S.
After looking at Jstdv8s set up..he has one just like my skimmer. His is in a 55g..
Jstdv8:
Thank you so much, I can see how you did the baffles, very good to see..that helps allot. You have no idea. 2Quills asked about the “footprint” size…can you tell me? Mine is going to have to go in a 20g 12 inches max…will it fit?
Yours is exactly like my skimmer. Like I said, I only have a 20g to work with so my set up will be a very mini version, so are you saying to put that tube that is now in overflow black box with the sponge in it, that now you attached it to a PVC pipe in the same chamber?
If I understand correctly..read this very carefully because I will copy it if you say it’s a go:
The skimmer in the first chamber and tube that WAS in the box now attached to a PVC pipe, with an opening below the baffle, then another baffle more to the top with the bottom more open… a section for my Macroalgae…refugium thing, then another high and low baffle setup like the first, the last chamber for the return pump…Is that correct?
With the hole in the return tube, will that make micro bubbles, or just shoot a water jet like a spray bar does? If it is like a spray bar…Do you think I can rig a spray bar just under the water surface to help with gas exchange and prevent a flood?
Acrylic51:
Thanks, I will look for that kind of pump, any idea the size I need to pump water 4 to 5 foot up the back of my tank from the bottom of the stand? How do I synchronize the return to the siphon so they don’t outdo each other?
 
beaslbob

beaslbob

Well-Known Member
Footprint is the crossectional area of it looking from the top down.
Also sometimes referring to the pressure it puts on the floor.
Like your feet put on the ground which results in a foot print.
 
flower

flower

Well-Known Member
Originally Posted by acrylic51
http:///forum/post/3279794
Flower I think it's a 1260 or 1262......I just looked at them this morning, been up alittle to long.

Thanks...How do I synchronize the return to the siphon so they don’t outdo each other?
 
beaslbob

beaslbob

Well-Known Member
Originally Posted by Flower
http:///forum/post/3279850

Thanks...How do I synchronize the return to the siphon so they don’t outdo each other?
You just turn the pump on.

The overflows do have an upper limit of say 600 or 800 g/h. But anything below that the overflow just matches whatever is bing pumped back. pump 400g/h overflow 400g/h. pump 200g/h over flow 200g/h. pump 1g/h overflow 1g/h ( you get the idea).
my .02
 
J

jstdv8

Guest
You don't need to sync your pump to the overflow as long as the pump is rated for equal or less to the overflow then it will just take care of itself. the overflow will only siphon out what the pump puts in so its pretty easy.
Yes you can make a spray bar with the water that is coming up from the return pump.
I will get dimmension on my sump section.
You might be doing it a bit different than mine wehn it comes to the skimmer. My pipe coming down from the drain on the overflow just dumps right into that far left chamber that the skimmer is sitting in. Then the skimmer pump picks it up just like as if it were in your DT and processes it and dumps it back into the same chamber.
If I'm not mistaken you may be able to connect the drain pipe from the overflow directly to your skimmer and not need a skimmer pump at all. I don't know this for sure, just throwing it out there. maybe someone else can chime in on this.
 
flower

flower

Well-Known Member
Originally Posted by Jstdv8
http:///forum/post/3279887
You don't need to sync your pump to the overflow as long as the pump is rated for equal or less to the overflow then it will just take care of itself. the overflow will only siphon out what the pump puts in so its pretty easy.Yes you can make a spray bar with the water that is coming up from the return pump.
I will get dimmension on my sump section.
You might be doing it a bit different than mine wehn it comes to the skimmer. My pipe coming down from the drain on the overflow just dumps right into that far left chamber that the skimmer is sitting in. Then the skimmer pump picks it up just like as if it were in your DT and processes it and dumps it back into the same chamber.
If I'm not mistaken you may be able to connect the drain pipe from the overflow directly to your skimmer and not need a skimmer pump at all. I don't know this for sure, just throwing it out there. maybe someone else can chime in on this.

The spray bar idea is good then....
Can you get a good close up shot of where the tubes to the skimmer are? Also I stilll don't understand the whole what gets pumped in will equal what gets pumped back out thing. It looks like the return will send out more than the syphon and drain the tank...it is only 20g..

Just explain the concept better...I get that the overflow box will take care of it...I wonder how does it work exactly, just so I know and understand the concept.
 
meowzer

meowzer

Moderator
water comes in from the over flow....water goes back to the tank thru the return pump.....LOL.....
your sump size doesn't have a lot to do with that.......
 
beaslbob

beaslbob

Well-Known Member
Originally Posted by Flower
http:///forum/post/3279893

The spray bar idea is good then....
Can you get a good close up shot of where the tubes to the skimmer are? Also I stilll don't understand the whole what gets pumped in will equal what gets pumped back out thing. It looks like the return will send out more than the syphon and drain the tank...it is only 20g..

Just explain the concept better...I get that the overflow box will take care of it...I wonder how does it work exactly, just so I know and understand the concept.
Take two examples from around the house.
first the toilet.

Take a glass of water and slowly pour it in the bowl. The water level stays the same so the water you put in has gone down the drain. Fill the glass up again and this time pour it in faster. Same thing.
Find a sink that has a little hole near the top. stopper the sink and fill it up to that hole. now try a slow water flow and the water should go up to the hole then stop. Turn the water on faster and the water level will remain about the same but the water will run faster into the hole.
So in either case and our overflows, whatever is poured or pumped into the tank (up to a limit) results in the same amount of water overflowing down the drain.
my .02
 
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