Hey all you lighting experts!

[bang guy]

Originally Posted by TurningTim
Why is the LUX meter a poor choice for measureing lumens in the tank? Is there something better. From the above articles it would seems that the clarity of water and what the light has to go through matters a great deal.
Thanks again!
Tim
A LUX meter is designed to measure the brightness of an object from the perspective of human eyes. This is only marginally related to how much light is being produced. A PAR meter that measures microEinsteins will tell how much light is being emitted but these are not inexpensive devices.
Actinic bulbs are an excellent example. A LUX meter will show that a VHO actinic bulb is not very bright but a PAR meter will show that it emits almost as much light than a daylight VHO bulb. To the human eye to Daylight bulb is 20 times brighter but the Actinic bulb produced almost the same amount of light. Human eyes are not able to pick up the 420nm wavelength very well, we do better at picking up light around 555nm (yellow).

 

[turningtim]

OK Bang, but that brings up another question. In my search for lights I have found 420nm and 460nm (?) is there any difference? Also what your saying is that the actinic bulbs produce the same amount of usable light for the corals as daylight bulbs at a given wattage? The mix of color temp and Actinic is purly our perseption of how we want our own tanks to look as long as we are above the 6500k range?
Tim

 

[bang guy]

Originally Posted by TurningTim
OK Bang, but that brings up another question. In my search for lights I have found 420nm and 460nm (?) is there any difference?
Yes. On the visible light spectrum 420 is purple and 460 is blue. The difference is aesthetic.
Also what your saying is that the actinic bulbs produce the same amount of usable light for the corals as daylight bulbs at a given wattage? The mix of color temp and Actinic is purly our perseption of how we want our own tanks to look as long as we are above the 6500k range?

Actinic bulbs are slightly less efficient and therefore produce slightly less light. The difference is measurable but not huge. Light near the purple end of the spectrum is also more energetic but that difference is also measurable but not a big difference.
Bottom line, in my opinion lighting color is not significant to coral health but it will make a big difference in how the tank looks and the colors some corals will display.

 

[emmitt]

Bangguy, why shouldnt you change all the bulbs at the same time? How long should i wait to stagger them? I still am on my original bulbs so they both were bought the same day.

 

[bang guy]

Flourescent bulbs are unusually bright for the first week or so. If you replace all of your dim bulbs with very bright new bulbs the photosynthetic animals will stress for a week or so until the acclimate to the new amount of light. By then the bulbs will dim to their normal output and again, the animals will stress (only a little) while they adapt to the dimmer lighting.
I find it better to stagger the bulb changes so there's less stress and the amount of light doesn't change so much.

 

[coachklm]

light acclimation

 

[wattsupdoc]

Originally Posted by Bang Guy
Flourescent bulbs are unusually bright for the first week or so. .

We call this curing the lamps. Generaslly a flourescent lamp will also burn a different color until its fully cured. you can help this process along by burning them constantly for 24 hrs. Not sure if thats a good idea for your 'varmits" but it does help to improve bulb life somewhat. Just another lil thought.

 

[wattsupdoc]

I think my mind needs to acclimate from this thread. :hilarious I have to say that I am thouroughly impressed. What a thread.

Thanks to all who have participated in helping me and all others who have or will read this to accend and deccend this mount everest of a learning curve. Coach, Tim, Thomas and Bang Guy you guys are the BOMB!

TY
Charlie.

 

[bang guy]

Originally Posted by wattsupdoc
We call this curing the lamps. Generaslly a flourescent lamp will also burn a different color until its fully cured. you can help this process along by burning them constantly for 24 hrs. Not sure if thats a good idea for your 'varmits" but it does help to improve bulb life somewhat. Just another lil thought.
This is interesting. How long do you have to burn the bulb 24/7 in order to benefit?

 

[turningtim]

You and me both Bang! I would also like to hear some thoughts on DIY reflectors. I know there is polished aluminum out there but what shape is best? And if is more harmful then good if not done properly? Charlie I know you have some but what is the material and if you "paint" them what will you use?
Also any peference in PC bulbs coralife, sunpaq or the no names?
Tim

 

[wattsupdoc]

Sorry Bang my bad! For the initial start up on the lamps its doog to burn a flourescent for 24 hr.s to help the curing process not sure why that is except that is a manufacturers recomendation. Tim the reflectors that I have a re some parabolic.Parabolic meaning bowl shaped I believe.There are alot of reflectors out there, however IMO the reflectors with the flatter smoother surface and smooth bends will be more effectic. AlsoI noticed some of these are aluminum. Aluminum oxidizes very quickly. As well as saltwater is corrosive. So how is it that these aluminum reclectors are not oxidizing and corroding. Must be sealed with something like maybe a clear laquer? Would this also add to the reflective properteis of th reflector. The manufacturers of the T5's are claiming that a single parabolic reflector per lamp is optimum for them.Hmmmm. :thinking: They state that it is because the light is being cast downward into you tank from all area aroung the bulb. Also the light is not lost be being cast onto the back of the lamp. Because of the curve shape the light is hitting it from all angles and thus being cast out at all angles though, isnt it also being cast back onto the lamp itself and some of it being lost? The reflector that Thomas stated his VHO's has would'nt do this though.IMO an internal parabolic reflector would cast the light directly out of the lamp without the possibility to be bouncing off the back of a reflector and and being lost when contacting the back of the lamp.Which one works better, I dont know..... However IMO A curved rflector would work better that a flat one with the sides bent up by a break or somthing.
JMO
Charlie

 

[wattsupdoc]

Well, Their white right now.Not sure what I'll paint them with right now.I have some highly reflective spray paint that i was gonna see how shinny it really is. If its really shiny then Ill probably sand, prime and paint with it. If not then I'll need to punt I suppose.Also I want to install all of the lamps on this one reflector. But I'm not sure yet what to do to create an individual reflector for each lamp on it or if I even need to worry about that. Obviousley I want the maximum benefit from each lamps so still hammering this out. :notsure: I'll post a couple of pics of the reflectors that I have later on.

 

[wattsupdoc]

The reflectors.

 

[coachklm]

sorry to go backwards on this but more info: Anthony Calfo
"More light is not better either for most all corals. Quite the contrary. Of the three principal influenes on coral growth (within reasonable params) - Light, Water Flow, Feeding... lighting is a distant third place as an influence! Yet aquarists spend themost time, money and energy obsessing over it.
Corals can/do adapt over a very wide range of light on the reef. But they cannot be deprived of water flow. And feeding easily makes up for any deficiency in light while the reverse is not true (or even biologically possible past the compensation point for zoox)
What you need to do is light the tank to the lowest common denominator of a hopefully compatible group of species and then feed the more demanding species to compensate for their slight deficiency (even heavy fish bioloads take care of this)"

 

[wattsupdoc]

Originally Posted by coachKLM
sorry to go backwards on this but more info: Anthony Calfo
"More light is not better either for most all corals. Quite the contrary. Of the three principal influenes on coral growth (within reasonable params) - Light, Water Flow, Feeding... lighting is a distant third place as an influence! Yet aquarists spend themost time, money and energy obsessing over it.
Corals can/do adapt over a very wide range of light on the reef. But they cannot be deprived of water flow. And feeding easily makes up for any deficiency in light while the reverse is not true (or even biologically possible past the compensation point for zoox)
What you need to do is light the tank to the lowest common denominator of a hopefully compatible group of species and then feed the more demanding species to compensate for their slight deficiency (even heavy fish bioloads take care of this)"
Thanks coach i tried ggoleing A. calfo as u suggested but didnt have much luck.
So judjing by this we could say that a least the light acclimating species (TY) Lighting, while it may be important is far less important than other forms of nourishment. But, obviously, not depriving them of any forms of nourishment is our ultimate goal. Not just fretting over light. So In order to do this we need to give as much PAR generating light as possible but more so feeding and flow need to be our major concerns. This would allow an aquariest to light the tank to his or her prefferences and still be able to achieve happy healthy inhabitants. And which brings us to your saying....To each their own. Is this correct?

 

[coachklm]

i just posted that to prove what i said earlier about the corals adapting... to a certain extent... flow..food...lighting...

 

[wattsupdoc]

I think these reflectors will be pretty good for a DIY hood. I plan on cutting them down(ther 48 inches right now) to 36 inches to fit my cabinet. Then Ill mount the toumbstones (lamp sockets) directly to it, grouping them as tightly as possible.A person cou;d probably mount 8 (maybe a stretch) of the T5's on this one reflector. Not sure yet but 6 will fit nicely on it. Some of em may need to be placed along the curved sides but still should work out nicely. Then If a guy wanted and didnt mind the look you could probably mount the ballasts directly on the back of it and even pendant it down for a hanging pendant type. Need to enclose the ballasts in something non combustable though. I think i have some old retro type 4' flourescents out back that a guy could use to make a complete fixtuer with ballast compartment and attach to this reflector(bout 40 yrs old but a good cleaning and some paint & waallah!

Mine will probably located remotely in the cabinet above the lamps in their own box. May even cut one in halve and make 2 2' fixtures out of it too though.Still kicking this around :notsure: and when I finally get ready to build I'll decide then. Sorry for all the typos in my posts jus get ahead of myself sometimes.

Timm I'll be glad to box a couple of em up and ship em to ya if you want. Let me know.

 

[wattsupdoc]

Oh yeah, their sheet metal.

 

[zman1]

So do the reflectors you installers use on commercial lighting good for a salt environment? I used one for VHOs and it eventually started to rust. I know from reading about T-5 HO they are the cats meow when compared to NO T-8 and T-12s in a commercial lighting environment. Just wondering how many situations you have installed T-12 VHO commercially.

 

[wattsupdoc]

Good question. Mostly you see those in places were the need for strips of light are needed, these are a good choice. Especially large indutrail refrigerated warehouses. Where an electronic ballast is preffered because of the low temp and highbay HID or lowbay HIDs would not be appropriate because of shadowing between isle of poduct. They are a good choice for maintenance because of the high intensity and lower maintenance costs as well as the fact that when the lamps start to go its not a big deal for e few to be out and not have a major lighting issue.