Is Tap Water Bad?

[beaslbob]

Originally posted by dburr
My ignorance? Excuse me Bob, I can't remember the exact #'s, but it was really on the high side of exceptable to drink. I believe in water changes to replenish trace elements. Like it or not, my corals are THRIVING, not DYEING. Stop and read that again.......

yep your ignorance. how do you know it would take 5 pounds of caulpera per week? If it is bang's fatally flawed "scientific" test of existing reef tanks and the algae removed from those thans, then you simply do not have good information. Hopefully you arrived at the five pounds per week through something better.
It sounds to me like you are simply running scared. All that would happen with water with iron, nitrates, ammonia, phosphates, and mag in it is the plant life would grow faster. And in the process bring down heavy ions and toxins in drinkable water to well below any toxic levels.
I certainly hope you are not accusing people like crazyreefnut who have thriving corals and have used tap water for years of having dieing corals. Sure I can kill them. Especially with low light, not enough plant life, a disastorous move, incorrect feeding, non reef safe fish. But that does not mean tap is bad.
Can you imagine if people never tried new things to make things better. I'd be driving a model T, or a horse to work.

We've come A LONG way since the 70's technology. It's about time some old school people tried some new things.
I do use the very latest technonogy. 1) plant life to filter waste water and 2) the very latest filtering and conditioning system meeting federal standards that provides me with drinkable tap water. The same plant life filters the ocean's water. The same water that flows to the ocean with its trace elements and salt.

 

[dburr]

It sounds to me like you are simply running scared. All that would happen with water with iron, nitrates, ammonia, phosphates, and mag in it is the plant life would grow faster. And in the process bring down heavy ions and toxins in drinkable water to well below any toxic levels.
Yep. Running scared. Scared my tank will look like yours. You say better, no, I don't think so. I can't run the risk of losing corals. I could go buy more if they die. It bothers me to see things die, though. I NEVER lost a fish to ick. Some disappered, some carpet surfers, ect... I may have lost a coral or two also. But the thing is, I LEARN FROM MY MISTAKES. All that extra iron could not be good for the system and no way all of it can be seqestered.
I certainly hope you are not accusing people like crazyreefnut who have thriving corals and have used tap water for years of having dieing corals. Sure I can kill them. Especially with low light, not enough plant life, a disastorous move, incorrect feeding, non reef safe fish. But that does not mean tap is bad.
Tell me Bob why, how did yours die? You did post that some died right? Or will you deny that too?
I do use the very latest technonogy. 1) plant life to filter waste water
New? You said yourself this was from the seventies. It's even older than that.
and 2) the very latest filtering and conditioning system meeting federal standards that provides me with drinkable tap water. The same plant life filters the ocean's water. The same water that flows to the ocean with its trace elements and salt.
This is the same thing, isn't it? Did someone give you a blanket party in the AF. You must have had a blow to the head.

The same water that flows to the ocean with its trace elements and salt.
And what about these trace elements? Every time you throw away macro how do you replace these? Tap water? It does not contain all that seawater has. So, tell me. I think you are being very ignorant right now.

 

[bang guy]

Beaslbob just looks at his dead fish and corals as a great way to grow his plants. He's found that if you kill your corals with tap water the plants grow even better!
I think Bob should write a book on how to grow saltwater algae using dying corals & dead Flame Angelfish.

 

[bang guy]

Originally posted by beaslbob
yep your ignorance. how do you know it would take 5 pounds of caulpera per week? If it is bang's fatally flawed "scientific" test of existing reef tanks and the algae removed from those thans, then you simply do not have good information.
If you have something better please share! My income isn't "several times the median household income" so I don't have the resources available to me like you do.

 

[jedininja]

Bob, how dare you call anybody ignorance! The root word of ignnorance is ignore and you are the only one here ignoring tested and proven facts. All you do isgnore all opinions and advocate for plant life. Yet the rest of us here do not ignore the fact that plants are very benficial. We just are not so closed minded that we think our method is the only way. So we take every precaustion for a healthy tank. RO is not the cure all. Skimmers are not the cure all. A fuge is not the cure all. DSBs is not the cure all. So instead, we use combinitions of those methods or even all those methods. So the only ignorance here is shown by you, not Dburr.

 

[broomer5]

Bob,
What would you recommend to someone that didn't want to introduce any plant life to a marine tank ?
Someone that by personal choice, chooses to run his tank without plant life.
Aside from the natural micro algae that would become present over time, what would you say to someone that just really didn't want to have a macro algae refugium, or any macro algae in his or her display tank ?
What would you recommend to this same person that had terrible tapwater, tapwater that tested positive for nitrate & phosphate, and this person was totally against the introduction of any marine macro algae as a means of nutrient reduction ?
What would you say to this person ?

 

[squidd]

Originally posted by beaslbob

All that would happen with water with iron, nitrates, ammonia, phosphates, and mag in it is the plant life would grow faster.
Unfortunately, that is the exact problem with using tap water...The limited amount of Macros(desirable) cannot and will not "outcompeate" the Uglies (hair,etc...) if you continue to OVERFEED the PLANTS with the stuff in tap water (Which can be avoided) and the food and waste produced by fish (Which CANNOT be avoided) We're back to realistic volume comparisons...
Try this...Plants in a tank with Tap water...no fish or feeding...will the plants live and thrive...YES...
This tells me there is ALOT more nutrients in Tap water than your admitting to...I'd rather have the plants able to consume the nutrients I can't avoid (fish,feeding and waste) than be OVERLOADED by adding nutrients I CAN AVOID (TAP)
I certainly hope you are not accusing people like crazyreefnut who have thriving corals and have used tap water for years of having dieing corals.
You mention his name alot...But I don't see him here defending you or straightening the record...I would be interested in hearing his opinion/methods as well...
I believe we would find some major differences between he and you...:nope:

 

[dburr]

You mention his name alot...But I don't see him here defending you or straightening the record...I would be interested in hearing his opinion/methods as well...
I did a search and seen some of his pics. But I to would like to hear how his tank is and his methods on reef keeping.
RO is not the cure all. Skimmers are not the cure all. A fuge is not the cure all. DSBs is not the cure all. So instead, we use combinitions of those methods or even all those methods.
Right, this is where I think Bob falls short. He is DEPENDING on macro to do it all. If it crashes, then what? Start allllllll over again.
To be honest and show you what I advocate, I was skimmerless for 2+ years. And proud of it. My tank rocked. Well, anyway, my corals were all blah, no colors. I read about others tanks and how to get them to color up. Most everyone runs a skmmer in a SPS reef. So, I turned the skimmer on a few weeks ago, just to see. Wow, they are coloring up alittle. Live and LEARN.
I will post this again.
Just try for a month, do a couple water changes with RO water. You WILL be amazed at the differance. See for yourself. I don't think you will, why?, because all you ever posted will be thrown out the window. You will notice a differance. You may or may not admit it. If you don't, you can always go back to what your doing.

 

[dburr]

I just thought about what I wrote. If I added more macro that should have done the trick, according to Bob anyway.

 

[schneidts]

IGNORANCE!! Do you have any idea what Fe does to coral? Nonsense! I think there should be a sticky warning people of this kind of nonsense:yes:

 

[schneidts]

I don't think his learning is of concern...it's the people new to the hobby who come looking for info/advice that are of concern. It repeatedly seems like newcomers ask a question and are immediately confused. You're right, Kip, it's obviously the attention he loves, but I don't think turning your head works, and that doesn't help the people who are getting the bunk advice.:nope:

 

[bang guy]

I'm in agreement with schneidts. The problem with just ignoring Beaslbob is the new hobbiests looking for advice.

 

[squidd]

Kip...
I know your tired of it, and I have watched you "battle" week after week while I basicly stood back...
But, I too have seen the confusion and lately a few "Hey I tried it...it's not working" posts...And that bugs me...
So kick back and relax, I know I and a few others won't mind "carrying the ball" for a while... Actually I think the "ball is starting to roll"...:jumping:

 

[grantman]

Wow you people here can be pretty mean. I have been in this hobby for about 6 years. I am quite new to this board. I think I have been here for about a year. I am also new to reef tanks. Most of my experience is in a fish only system. I am very new to reefkeeping and am finding it quite an enjoyable and consuming experience. I am by no means an expert and I will not jump into this rediculous debate that has taken three valuable pages of board space on either side. My only contribution to this thread is the emphatic proclamation that there is MORE THAN ONE WAY TO SKIN A CAT.

 

[bang guy]

Grantman, you are absolutely correct. There are lots and lots of ways to a successful tank. I hope you have missed the endless quotes out of context, misinformation, and outright dishonest statements by this member. His beliefs are fine if he would keep them to himself, but for him to preach tapwater as the only way to a successful aquarium when it is obvious that it isn't even working for him is just intolerable.
I am sure that if I told you that your teaching methods are wrong and the conventional curriculum was garbage you would question me. If it was then discovered that my students were harmed by my teaching experience you would have a problem with that.
What would you do if I started preaching my methods to other inexperienced teachers?
I would hope that you would speak up and not just let the new teachers go about teaching based on a model that has been proven to be a failure.
This is what we're up against.
Call it mean if you would like, that kinda hurts but I can see how it might look that way. I just hope that it saves some of the new hobbiests some heartache.

 

[reefnut]

Originally posted by Squidd
But, I too have seen the confusion and lately a few "Hey I tried it...it's not working" posts...And that bugs me...
I've seen it too and it was inevitable... and we will see more in the future if he is allowed to continue.
BTW, IMO "MEAN" is persuading others to fallow a failing method.

 

[grantman]

I guess I lied, I will make a second contribution to this thread. Bang, I think you are the ---- when it comes to knowledge on reeftanks and fishkeeping (a compliment). I also think some of what bealsebob says is accurate and informative it just somehow gets lost in translation. Not to be too preachy but the most effective argument for various tank systems is to just show pictures of your tanks and let the newbies decide which system they like better and this stuff won't go on interminably.

 

[reefnut]

Originally posted by Kip4130
If he doesnt go away. I make a motion for a board vote on his membership.
Seems to me Admin doesn't want him to go away... controversy attracts attention. Others have been band for less IMO.

 

[dburr]

If he doesnt go away. I make a motion for a board vote on his membership.
This wont work, I thought of it. He could just sign on as a new member again.
Wow you people here can be pretty mean.
Yes, you are right, I feel mean and I don't like it. I teach my 5 and 6 year old boys not to be mean. I feel like a hypocrite. But all that aside, I don't like seeing new guys get in the hobby , ask questions here and Bob posts that these are the best ways. Just forget everyone else they don't know what their talking about. Add the macro to your tank. A month from now they asking how to get rid of it. Or their tank is a mess. Or every thing is dying, Bob said this is the way to do it. Doesn't matter what the problem is, add plant life it'll go away. Don't matter what the water quality is, it'll be fixed.
This debate is rediculous. Geez, I just wanna

 

[reefnut]

Originally posted by grantman
Not to be too preachy but the most effective argument for various tank systems is to just show pictures of your tanks and let the newbies decide which system they like better and this stuff won't go on interminably.
If it was only that easy. Follow the story for a while.