Liberal Logic - AZ out China still alright with em...

[stdreb27]

Originally Posted by GeriDoc
http:///forum/post/3270541
Why is it "liberals" who are OK with illegal immigrants getting free government services? Actually, it was the "conservative" SCOTUS who mandated this based on their reading of the Constitution. Just because you don't agree with something, don't assume that it is a "liberal" plot. Sometimes bad government is blind to the liberal-conservative axis, and is just plain old bad government!
Figures, the liberals want to use their sensor ship tool ie political correctness. To stop speech they do not like...
No one is perfect, especially republican politicians...
But lets look at my statement, all it is, is a generalization speaking about the ironies of political correctness, as dictated by liberals... I don't completely agree with any politician, and I can go through any republican's record, and find fault. That is simply another misdirection...
You'd have a steep hill to argue that the authors of the healthcare bill (just a little clue, they weren't conservatives) did not fully intend funding for illegal's health care...

 

[reefraff]

Originally Posted by Darthtang AW
http:///forum/post/3270549
Bullshit. I am calling it. I am tired of hearing this. MOST Illegals working are doing so "legally". What do you need to provide when hired for a job. a drivers license/ID and a Green Card/social security card. Look at your Social security card. How hard is this to copy or reproduce? Most states willingly give illegals a driver's license. So how is this the fault of the business owner that UNKNOWINGLY is hiring these people.
In most cases The business owner does not know. Untill SS contacts them and informs them the SS# is incorrect. nd even at that point they are NOT allowed to fire these people. They have to give them 6 months to produce another number. When that is done, it can take 2 years for SS to contact them and inform them that number is wrong.
Thanks for chiming in Darth, but I don't agree at all and I tire of the conservative defense of capitalism doing no wrong no matter what the cost. Why don't you just call for the deregulation of hiring practices completely in this country, but don't cry to me when your employer figures out he can replace you with cheap labor and your out the door. Heck let's just go ahead and make 7 or 8 dollars an hour the average wage in the country while we are at it.
Your claim that business owners do not knowingly hire illegals is complete B.S. I guarantee if business owners start getting hammered for hiring illegals it will stop and magically they will be able to tell the difference between a legal worker and non-legal. Care to defend BP and Goldman Sachs while you are at. LOL
Fishtaco
Darth is right about the forged papers and how long it takes to legally fire someone. You can't blame it all on business but they are going to have to be a major part of the solution. E Varify is the best solution but the Democrats wont allow it to become required. That still isn't going to cure the people hiring day laborers for cash.

 

[fishtaco]

Originally Posted by Fishtaco
http:///forum/post/3270559

Darth is right about the forged papers and how long it takes to legally fire someone. You can't blame it all on business but they are going to have to be a major part of the solution. E Varify is the best solution but the Democrats wont allow it to become required. That still isn't going to cure the people hiring day laborers for cash.
I always knew when the owner of a business hired someone with forged papers, they are the ones that would work for minimum wage with no benefits and one of the long-term employees would casually mention to them it was about time to have la migra out again and by some miracle they would leave at lunch and not come back.
Fishtaco

 

[reefraff]

Originally Posted by reefraff
http:///forum/post/3270568
I always knew when the owner of a business hired someone with forged papers, they are the ones that would work for minimum wage with no benefits and one of the long-term employees would casually mention to them it was about time to have la migra out again and by some miracle they would leave at lunch and not come back.
Fishtaco
Construction is one of the hardest hit as far as illegals taking good jobs. My brother quit hanging drywall and started selling Cocaine back in the early 80's because between the unions and the illegals you couldn't make money at it anymore in Southern California. We had a major hail storm here last year and out of the dozens of roofers I saw I don't think I ever heard more than a couple speaking English. The crew that did my house couldn't speak it at all, just the supervisor.

 

[bang guy]

Originally Posted by Fishtaco
http:///forum/post/3270559

Darth is right about the forged papers and how long it takes to legally fire someone. You can't blame it all on business but they are going to have to be a major part of the solution. E Varify is the best solution but the Democrats wont allow it to become required. That still isn't going to cure the people hiring day laborers for cash.
It's not just the Dems that won't enact E-Verify, the Republicans are not lifting a finger to push it along either.

 

[reefraff]

Originally Posted by reefraff
http:///forum/post/3270568

It's not just the Dems that won't enact E-Verify, the Republicans are not lifting a finger to push it along either.
Hopefully after Novemeber the Republican party will be purged of the milktoast whimps who are afraid to take a stand on these kind of issues. Right now both sides are pandering to the percieved hespanic block who will punish whoever does something about immigration. I say pass the Damned law and watch what happens. I think the hispanic backlash is more hype and posturing than anything.

 

[geridoc]

Originally Posted by stdreb27
http:///forum/post/3270561
You'd have a steep hill to argue that the authors of the healthcare bill (just a little clue, they weren't conservatives) did not fully intend funding for illegal's health care...
You can't have it both ways. Either the republican conservatives were consulted for the part of the healthcare bill that confines funding to citizens, or they were excluded, and the evil "liberals" are responsible for that provision. Which is it - were they consulted, or excluded?

 

[stdreb27]

Originally Posted by Darthtang AW
http:///forum/post/3270549
Bullshit. I am calling it. I am tired of hearing this. MOST Illegals working are doing so "legally". What do you need to provide when hired for a job. a drivers license/ID and a Green Card/social security card. Look at your Social security card. How hard is this to copy or reproduce? Most states willingly give illegals a driver's license. So how is this the fault of the business owner that UNKNOWINGLY is hiring these people.
In most cases The business owner does not know. Untill SS contacts them and informs them the SS# is incorrect. nd even at that point they are NOT allowed to fire these people. They have to give them 6 months to produce another number. When that is done, it can take 2 years for SS to contact them and inform them that number is wrong.
Thanks for chiming in Darth, but I don't agree at all and I tire of the conservative defense of capitalism doing no wrong no matter what the cost. Why don't you just call for the deregulation of hiring practices completely in this country, but don't cry to me when your employer figures out he can replace you with cheap labor and your out the door. Heck let's just go ahead and make 7 or 8 dollars an hour the average wage in the country while we are at it.
Your claim that business owners do not knowingly hire illegals is complete B.S. I guarantee if business owners start getting hammered for hiring illegals it will stop and magically they will be able to tell the difference between a legal worker and non-legal. Care to defend BP and Goldman Sachs while you are at. LOL
Fishtaco
Conservationism may seem to argue in favor of complete deregulation. But it doesn't. Although compared the complete control that the dems want. I can understand the misconception...
I sold phones for 3 years, and since I speak spanish, I had a LOT of illegals coming in for phones. Their papers were usually VERY VERY good. When they had them...

 

[stdreb27]

Originally Posted by GeriDoc
http:///forum/post/3270606
You can't have it both ways. Either the republican conservatives were consulted for the part of the healthcare bill that confines funding to citizens, or they were excluded, and the evil "liberals" are responsible for that provision. Which is it - were they consulted, or excluded?
Have what both ways? If we are talking the healthcare bill, I'd submit you, the vote, basically along party lines, minus on representative in Louisiana? That was the dem's baby...

 

[darthtang aw]

Originally Posted by Fishtaco
http:///forum/post/3270559
Thanks for chiming in Darth, but I don't agree at all and I tire of the conservative defense of capitalism doing no wrong no matter what the cost. Why don't you just call for the deregulation of hiring practices completely in this country, but don't cry to me when your employer figures out he can replace you with cheap labor and your out the door. Heck let's just go ahead and make 7 or 8 dollars an hour the average wage in the country while we are at it.
Your claim that business owners do not knowingly hire illegals is complete B.S. I guarantee if business owners start getting hammered for hiring illegals it will stop and magically they will be able to tell the difference between a legal worker and non-legal. Care to defend BP and Goldman Sachs while you are at. LOL
Fishtaco
I don't have to worry about being replaced by the illegal. I own my business and work part-time for health insurance only (get it cheaper without asking the government to do it for me). As a business owner I know this first hand. As a plant manager in minnesota I saw the same thing....Papers were in order. at this point, if I suspect they are illegal (even if they have proper documents) am I supposed to discriminate? Sorry, you don't speak english well and have a funny accent, I know you are qualified and the only one that is, but I am not gonna hire you because you LOOK and SOUND illegal.
I am not asking for deregulation..I am saying the government and employment laws need to become stricter and enforced.

 

[stdreb27]

Originally Posted by Darthtang AW
http:///forum/post/3270664
I don't have to worry about being replaced by the illegal. I own my business and work part-time for health insurance only (get it cheaper without asking the government to do it for me). As a business owner I know this first hand. As a plant manager in minnesota I saw the same thing....Papers were in order. at this point, if I suspect they are illegal (even if they have proper documents) am I supposed to discriminate? Sorry, you don't speak english well and have a funny accent, I know you are qualified and the only one that is, but I am not gonna hire you because you LOOK and SOUND illegal.
I am not asking for deregulation..I am saying the government and employment laws need to become stricter and enforced.
That is when you get hammered by the equal employment opportunity act...

 

[geridoc]

Originally Posted by stdreb27
http:///forum/post/3270628
Have what both ways? If we are talking the healthcare bill, I'd submit you, the vote, basically along party lines, minus on representative in Louisiana? That was the dem's baby...
OK, then it was the liberal Dems idea to limit benefits to citizens. How about that - a good idea from the liberals.

 

[stdreb27]

Originally Posted by GeriDoc
http:///forum/post/3270699
OK, then it was the liberal Dems idea to limit benefits to citizens. How about that - a good idea from the liberals.
lol, ok, sure. That makes sense... That is a skinny limb you're on there...