Movie theater shooting
- Thread starter snakeblitz33
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saltwaterkeeper
Member
The sad thing is the media is going to take this tragedy and run around the world with it....we will be hearing about this for weeks to come.
flower
Well-Known Member
Just a sad horrible story, about a sad horrible man...and the more the news people get all excited about it and run their big newsbreaking story and all the details, the more some nut will copy it to get famous...
The news story should ONLY be about the loss and the poor people...the sad story focusing on the next possible doctor who may have found a cure for cancer...who knows what the little baby could have grown up to do if given the chance, the world is worse off now. All we ever hear about the victims are thier names and their ages, then they disappear from the media and we have to hear all about how Mr. crazy spent his last days, and what meds he was on....etc...etc.. In my opinion...All it should say about the killer is ...A nut killed a bunch of people in a theater today, we give no deatils about him/her because we want to forget this person ever existed in the first place.
It just might put an end to the murdering media seekers who want to go out with a bang...
After the shooting at Columbine, threats to go shooting up a school is a sure fire way to get attention, and the copy cats have done their damage. For once I would like to see the victims immortalized instead of the killer.
The news story should ONLY be about the loss and the poor people...the sad story focusing on the next possible doctor who may have found a cure for cancer...who knows what the little baby could have grown up to do if given the chance, the world is worse off now. All we ever hear about the victims are thier names and their ages, then they disappear from the media and we have to hear all about how Mr. crazy spent his last days, and what meds he was on....etc...etc.. In my opinion...All it should say about the killer is ...A nut killed a bunch of people in a theater today, we give no deatils about him/her because we want to forget this person ever existed in the first place.
It just might put an end to the murdering media seekers who want to go out with a bang...
After the shooting at Columbine, threats to go shooting up a school is a sure fire way to get attention, and the copy cats have done their damage. For once I would like to see the victims immortalized instead of the killer.
saltwaterkeeper
Member
Just a sad horrible story, about a sad horrible man...and the more the news people get all excited about it and run their big newsbreaking story and all the details, the more some nut will copy it to get famous...
The news story should ONLY be about the loss and the poor people...the sad story focusing on the next possible doctor who may have found a cure for cancer...who knows what the little baby could have grown up to do if given the chance, the world is worse off now. All we ever hear about the victims are thier names and their ages, then they disappear from the media and we have to hear all about how Mr. crazy spent his last days, and what meds he was on....etc...etc.. In my opinion...All it should say about the killer is ...A nut killed a bunch of people in a theater today, we give no deatils about him/her because we want to forget this person ever existed in the first place.
It just might put an end to the murdering media seekers who want to go out with a bang...
After the shooting at Columbine, threats to go shooting up a school is a sure fire way to get attention, and the copy cats have done their damage. For once I would like to see the victims immortalized instead of the killer.
Thank you, flower. This is what I'm saying. The news FOCUSES IN on the shooter, all about him. They shine light on him, when it needs to be on the victims.
The news story should ONLY be about the loss and the poor people...the sad story focusing on the next possible doctor who may have found a cure for cancer...who knows what the little baby could have grown up to do if given the chance, the world is worse off now. All we ever hear about the victims are thier names and their ages, then they disappear from the media and we have to hear all about how Mr. crazy spent his last days, and what meds he was on....etc...etc.. In my opinion...All it should say about the killer is ...A nut killed a bunch of people in a theater today, we give no deatils about him/her because we want to forget this person ever existed in the first place.
It just might put an end to the murdering media seekers who want to go out with a bang...
After the shooting at Columbine, threats to go shooting up a school is a sure fire way to get attention, and the copy cats have done their damage. For once I would like to see the victims immortalized instead of the killer.
Thank you, flower. This is what I'm saying. The news FOCUSES IN on the shooter, all about him. They shine light on him, when it needs to be on the victims.
flower
Well-Known Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by saltwaterkeeper http:///t/392376/movie-theater-shooting#post_3483593
Thank you, flower. This is what I'm saying. The news FOCUSES IN on the shooter, all about him. They shine light on him, when it needs to be on the victims.
Oh.... I read thru the other posts after I posted my opinion...we totally agree. I'm worried now because the unstable people are going to try and copy this, or top it...just like all the other times the media immortalized the killer. I believe media attention is what they were after or they would have found a private way to end their unhappy existence..they were not angry with a single person they murdered.
Originally Posted by saltwaterkeeper http:///t/392376/movie-theater-shooting#post_3483593
Thank you, flower. This is what I'm saying. The news FOCUSES IN on the shooter, all about him. They shine light on him, when it needs to be on the victims.
Oh.... I read thru the other posts after I posted my opinion...we totally agree. I'm worried now because the unstable people are going to try and copy this, or top it...just like all the other times the media immortalized the killer. I believe media attention is what they were after or they would have found a private way to end their unhappy existence..they were not angry with a single person they murdered.
saltwaterkeeper
Member
Oh.... I read thru the other posts after I posted my opinion...we totally agree. I'm worried now because the unstable people are going to try and copy this, or top it...just like all the other times the media immortalized the killer. I believe media attention is what they were after or they would have found a private way to end their unhappy existence..they were not angry with a single person they murdered.
Exactly.
bender77
Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by Flower http:///t/392376/movie-theater-shooting#post_3483596
Oh.... I read thru the other posts after I posted my opinion...we totally agree. I'm worried now because the unstable people are going to try and copy this, or top it...just like all the other times the media immortalized the killer. I believe media attention is what they were after or they would have found a private way to end their unhappy existence..they were not angry with a single person they murdered.
I have to agree with this too.
There is also another big part of this story that is bothering me. Why where there so many young children at a midnight showing of a violent movie? I've read stories about 4 yr olds, 6 yr old infants ect being involved. I worry that this may be one of the reasons (coupled with some other things) that violence is getting so much worse in our younger generations. A 4 yr old and 6 yr old can't process movie violence, in fact a movie like this could cause nightmares and other distress in children so young that could lead to more situations like this when they are older. This whole situation is sad, a borderline genius snapping and killing innocent people, the boys family that knew something was wrong and didn't try to intervene before he escalated to this level. Young children being exposed to unnecessary violence because their parents don't think a 4 yr old at a midnight movie is a bad idea and of course all the sadness and trauma that has come to the victims and their families.
The only thing I know for sure is the media needs to stop sensationalizing these things, bring support to the families and let them heal.
Originally Posted by Flower http:///t/392376/movie-theater-shooting#post_3483596
Oh.... I read thru the other posts after I posted my opinion...we totally agree. I'm worried now because the unstable people are going to try and copy this, or top it...just like all the other times the media immortalized the killer. I believe media attention is what they were after or they would have found a private way to end their unhappy existence..they were not angry with a single person they murdered.
I have to agree with this too.
There is also another big part of this story that is bothering me. Why where there so many young children at a midnight showing of a violent movie? I've read stories about 4 yr olds, 6 yr old infants ect being involved. I worry that this may be one of the reasons (coupled with some other things) that violence is getting so much worse in our younger generations. A 4 yr old and 6 yr old can't process movie violence, in fact a movie like this could cause nightmares and other distress in children so young that could lead to more situations like this when they are older. This whole situation is sad, a borderline genius snapping and killing innocent people, the boys family that knew something was wrong and didn't try to intervene before he escalated to this level. Young children being exposed to unnecessary violence because their parents don't think a 4 yr old at a midnight movie is a bad idea and of course all the sadness and trauma that has come to the victims and their families.
The only thing I know for sure is the media needs to stop sensationalizing these things, bring support to the families and let them heal.
darthtang aw
Active Member
I need to interject. I am a proponent of gun ownership and conceal carry. However, I grow tired of the people that say a couple conceal carry guns in the movie theatre may have minimized this.
Lets break this down realisticly.
Smoke pops...people believe it is a special effect. The start coughing and eyes are tearing badly due to the fact it is tear gas. The gun man starts shooting...wearing a gas mask. The shots are over in 60 seconds. 30 seconds after the gunman is in the parking lot sitting when police arrive. This happened in a 90 second span of time. The police arrived on scene in 90 seconds and the psycho was already in the parking lot.
Now, how is a conceal carry going to stop this when the owner can't see and hears nothing but screaming and gun fire?
Lets break this down realisticly.
Smoke pops...people believe it is a special effect. The start coughing and eyes are tearing badly due to the fact it is tear gas. The gun man starts shooting...wearing a gas mask. The shots are over in 60 seconds. 30 seconds after the gunman is in the parking lot sitting when police arrive. This happened in a 90 second span of time. The police arrived on scene in 90 seconds and the psycho was already in the parking lot.
Now, how is a conceal carry going to stop this when the owner can't see and hears nothing but screaming and gun fire?
meowzer
Moderator
Quote:
Originally Posted by Darthtang AW http:///t/392376/movie-theater-shooting/20#post_3483620
I need to interject. I am a proponent of gun ownership and conceal carry. However, I grow tired of the people that say a couple conceal carry guns in the movie theatre may have minimized this.
Lets break this down realisticly.
Smoke pops...people believe it is a special effect. The start coughing and eyes are tearing badly due to the fact it is tear gas. The gun man starts shooting...wearing a gas mask. The shots are over in 60 seconds. 30 seconds after the gunman is in the parking lot sitting when police arrive. This happened in a 90 second span of time. The police arrived on scene in 90 seconds and the psycho was already in the parking lot.
Now, how is a conceal carry going to stop this when the owner can't see and hears nothing but screaming and gun fire?
+1.....I think the difference would have been
100 dead or injured instead of 12.....
ALTHO I have to hope that the ones that do have permits to carry......also have enough common sense WHEN to or NOT to use thir weapon
Originally Posted by Darthtang AW http:///t/392376/movie-theater-shooting/20#post_3483620
I need to interject. I am a proponent of gun ownership and conceal carry. However, I grow tired of the people that say a couple conceal carry guns in the movie theatre may have minimized this.
Lets break this down realisticly.
Smoke pops...people believe it is a special effect. The start coughing and eyes are tearing badly due to the fact it is tear gas. The gun man starts shooting...wearing a gas mask. The shots are over in 60 seconds. 30 seconds after the gunman is in the parking lot sitting when police arrive. This happened in a 90 second span of time. The police arrived on scene in 90 seconds and the psycho was already in the parking lot.
Now, how is a conceal carry going to stop this when the owner can't see and hears nothing but screaming and gun fire?
+1.....I think the difference would have been
100 dead or injured instead of 12.....
ALTHO I have to hope that the ones that do have permits to carry......also have enough common sense WHEN to or NOT to use thir weapon
darthtang aw
Active Member
+1.....I think the difference would have been
100 dead or injured instead of 12.....
ALTHO I have to hope that the ones that do have permits to carry......also have enough common sense WHEN to or NOT to use thir weapon
Even if a concealed carry member managed to get a clear view and a shot off...there is the body armor aspect as well.
jerth6932
Active Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by Darthtang AW http:///t/392376/movie-theater-shooting/20#post_3483620
I need to interject. I am a proponent of gun ownership and conceal carry. However, I grow tired of the people that say a couple conceal carry guns in the movie theatre may have minimized this.
Lets break this down realisticly.
Smoke pops...people believe it is a special effect. The start coughing and eyes are tearing badly due to the fact it is tear gas. The gun man starts shooting...wearing a gas mask. The shots are over in 60 seconds. 30 seconds after the gunman is in the parking lot sitting when police arrive. This happened in a 90 second span of time. The police arrived on scene in 90 seconds and the psycho was already in the parking lot.
Now, how is a conceal carry going to stop this when the owner can't see and hears nothing but screaming and gun fire?
But would he have done it if he knew every one else was equipped with guns? Did he go in the parking lot and shoot at cops, who was equipped with guns? NOPE, get real, if they had it in this case it would of deterred it! If he wanted to go out in a blaze of glory he would of shot at the cops, he didn't! Even with his armor he didn't try to fight the cops! Its more of a physiological deterrent, rather then physical! HE DIDN'T WANT TO DIE...... HE GAVE UP TO GUNS! How wouldn't it of helped?
Can you prepare for all situations prior to them happening? No they are criminals whom what to do what they want to get away with it, so as much preparation that goes into it to stop it, it is a reaction. Unfortunately criminals have the element of surprise.
Originally Posted by Darthtang AW http:///t/392376/movie-theater-shooting/20#post_3483620
I need to interject. I am a proponent of gun ownership and conceal carry. However, I grow tired of the people that say a couple conceal carry guns in the movie theatre may have minimized this.
Lets break this down realisticly.
Smoke pops...people believe it is a special effect. The start coughing and eyes are tearing badly due to the fact it is tear gas. The gun man starts shooting...wearing a gas mask. The shots are over in 60 seconds. 30 seconds after the gunman is in the parking lot sitting when police arrive. This happened in a 90 second span of time. The police arrived on scene in 90 seconds and the psycho was already in the parking lot.
Now, how is a conceal carry going to stop this when the owner can't see and hears nothing but screaming and gun fire?
But would he have done it if he knew every one else was equipped with guns? Did he go in the parking lot and shoot at cops, who was equipped with guns? NOPE, get real, if they had it in this case it would of deterred it! If he wanted to go out in a blaze of glory he would of shot at the cops, he didn't! Even with his armor he didn't try to fight the cops! Its more of a physiological deterrent, rather then physical! HE DIDN'T WANT TO DIE...... HE GAVE UP TO GUNS! How wouldn't it of helped?
Can you prepare for all situations prior to them happening? No they are criminals whom what to do what they want to get away with it, so as much preparation that goes into it to stop it, it is a reaction. Unfortunately criminals have the element of surprise.
jerth6932
Active Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by meowzer http:///t/392376/movie-theater-shooting/20#post_3483622
+1.....I think the difference would have been
100 dead or injured instead of 12..... WHAT? SERIOUS? More dead? You are kidding me right? You really said that??
ALTHO I have to hope that the ones that do have permits to carry......also have enough common sense WHEN to or NOT to use thir weapon. Lets see if you know this fact? How many crimes are commited by people with consealed weapons permits? How many accidents are related to people who have the permits?
Originally Posted by meowzer http:///t/392376/movie-theater-shooting/20#post_3483622
+1.....I think the difference would have been
100 dead or injured instead of 12..... WHAT? SERIOUS? More dead? You are kidding me right? You really said that??
ALTHO I have to hope that the ones that do have permits to carry......also have enough common sense WHEN to or NOT to use thir weapon. Lets see if you know this fact? How many crimes are commited by people with consealed weapons permits? How many accidents are related to people who have the permits?
jerth6932
Active Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by reefraff http:///t/392376/movie-theater-shooting#post_3483576
Interesting factoid. The chain that owns that theater has a gun free zone policy. Only law enforcement can bring guns on the property, no CCW allowed.
Did them a whole dam# bit of good didn't it! Prohibit those who know how to use guns properly and are willing to have them for pertection!
THAT BAN REALLY DID A GREAT JOB AT STOPPING THE CRIMINAL, WHO FOLLOWS THE SIGN ON THE DOOR, RIGHT?
YOU RESTRICT THE ONES WHO FOLLOW THE LAWS, NOT THE ONES WHO DON'T, THEY ARE GOING TO DO AS THEY PLEASE!
GREAT POLICY THEATER......
Originally Posted by reefraff http:///t/392376/movie-theater-shooting#post_3483576
Interesting factoid. The chain that owns that theater has a gun free zone policy. Only law enforcement can bring guns on the property, no CCW allowed.
Did them a whole dam# bit of good didn't it! Prohibit those who know how to use guns properly and are willing to have them for pertection!
THAT BAN REALLY DID A GREAT JOB AT STOPPING THE CRIMINAL, WHO FOLLOWS THE SIGN ON THE DOOR, RIGHT?
YOU RESTRICT THE ONES WHO FOLLOW THE LAWS, NOT THE ONES WHO DON'T, THEY ARE GOING TO DO AS THEY PLEASE!
GREAT POLICY THEATER......
reefraff
Active Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by Darthtang AW http:///t/392376/movie-theater-shooting/20#post_3483620
I need to interject. I am a proponent of gun ownership and conceal carry. However, I grow tired of the people that say a couple conceal carry guns in the movie theatre may have minimized this.
Lets break this down realisticly.
Smoke pops...people believe it is a special effect. The start coughing and eyes are tearing badly due to the fact it is tear gas. The gun man starts shooting...wearing a gas mask. The shots are over in 60 seconds. 30 seconds after the gunman is in the parking lot sitting when police arrive. This happened in a 90 second span of time. The police arrived on scene in 90 seconds and the psycho was already in the parking lot.
Now, how is a conceal carry going to stop this when the owner can't see and hears nothing but screaming and gun fire?
Even assuming your timeline is accurate, which it is not, who is to say someone even returning a single shot in his direction (he was at the front of the theater near the screen) wouldn't have lead to him leaving? He obviously wasn't looking for suicide by cop so if he was worried about getting hit, even with body armor who's to say what would happen.
Originally Posted by Darthtang AW http:///t/392376/movie-theater-shooting/20#post_3483620
I need to interject. I am a proponent of gun ownership and conceal carry. However, I grow tired of the people that say a couple conceal carry guns in the movie theatre may have minimized this.
Lets break this down realisticly.
Smoke pops...people believe it is a special effect. The start coughing and eyes are tearing badly due to the fact it is tear gas. The gun man starts shooting...wearing a gas mask. The shots are over in 60 seconds. 30 seconds after the gunman is in the parking lot sitting when police arrive. This happened in a 90 second span of time. The police arrived on scene in 90 seconds and the psycho was already in the parking lot.
Now, how is a conceal carry going to stop this when the owner can't see and hears nothing but screaming and gun fire?
Even assuming your timeline is accurate, which it is not, who is to say someone even returning a single shot in his direction (he was at the front of the theater near the screen) wouldn't have lead to him leaving? He obviously wasn't looking for suicide by cop so if he was worried about getting hit, even with body armor who's to say what would happen.
bionicarm
Active Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jerth6932 http:///t/392376/movie-theater-shooting/20#post_3483635
But would he have done it if he knew every one else was equipped with guns? Did he go in the parking lot and shoot at cops, who was equipped with guns? NOPE, get real, if they had it in this case it would of deterred it! If he wanted to go out in a blaze of glory he would of shot at the cops, he didn't! Even with his armor he didn't try to fight the cops! Its more of a physiological deterrent, rather then physical! HE DIDN'T WANT TO DIE...... HE GAVE UP TO GUNS! How wouldn't it of helped?
Can you prepare for all situations prior to them happening? No they are criminals whom what to do what they want to get away with it, so as much preparation that goes into it to stop it, it is a reaction. Unfortunately criminals have the element of surprise.
Apparently the guy was prepared for any such confrontation, considering he was wearing a bullet-proof vest, even a bullet-proof neck gear. The guy was well prepared and armed himself accordingly. I've beat this puppy to death, but someone please explain why anyone should have access to an AR-15 with the capability of holding a 100-round drum? Convince me there would have been as much carnage if he'd would've just had the shotgun and the two 9mm's?
Originally Posted by Jerth6932 http:///t/392376/movie-theater-shooting/20#post_3483635
But would he have done it if he knew every one else was equipped with guns? Did he go in the parking lot and shoot at cops, who was equipped with guns? NOPE, get real, if they had it in this case it would of deterred it! If he wanted to go out in a blaze of glory he would of shot at the cops, he didn't! Even with his armor he didn't try to fight the cops! Its more of a physiological deterrent, rather then physical! HE DIDN'T WANT TO DIE...... HE GAVE UP TO GUNS! How wouldn't it of helped?
Can you prepare for all situations prior to them happening? No they are criminals whom what to do what they want to get away with it, so as much preparation that goes into it to stop it, it is a reaction. Unfortunately criminals have the element of surprise.
Apparently the guy was prepared for any such confrontation, considering he was wearing a bullet-proof vest, even a bullet-proof neck gear. The guy was well prepared and armed himself accordingly. I've beat this puppy to death, but someone please explain why anyone should have access to an AR-15 with the capability of holding a 100-round drum? Convince me there would have been as much carnage if he'd would've just had the shotgun and the two 9mm's?
jerth6932
Active Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by bionicarm http:///t/392376/movie-theater-shooting/20#post_3483642
Apparently the guy was prepared for any such confrontation, considering he was wearing a bullet-proof vest, even a bullet-proof neck gear. The guy was well prepared and armed himself accordingly. I've beat this puppy to death, but someone please explain why anyone should have access to an AR-15 with the capability of holding a 100-round drum? Convince me there would have been as much carnage if he'd would've just had the shotgun and the two 9mm's?
He was? Really? Is that why he just gave up?
How many AR's are in the hands of responsible owners? Just cause he chose one of those, ban it? There are several computers in the hands of idiots.... lets ban a computer... before you say they don't cause deaths, well ever heard of internet bullying or such things? People get killed because of the internet, lets ban it too.
Seriously, IT IS NOT THE GUNS THAT KILL PEOPLE, every one together now...... PEOPLE KILL PEOPLE!
Originally Posted by bionicarm http:///t/392376/movie-theater-shooting/20#post_3483642
Apparently the guy was prepared for any such confrontation, considering he was wearing a bullet-proof vest, even a bullet-proof neck gear. The guy was well prepared and armed himself accordingly. I've beat this puppy to death, but someone please explain why anyone should have access to an AR-15 with the capability of holding a 100-round drum? Convince me there would have been as much carnage if he'd would've just had the shotgun and the two 9mm's?
He was? Really? Is that why he just gave up?
How many AR's are in the hands of responsible owners? Just cause he chose one of those, ban it? There are several computers in the hands of idiots.... lets ban a computer... before you say they don't cause deaths, well ever heard of internet bullying or such things? People get killed because of the internet, lets ban it too.
Seriously, IT IS NOT THE GUNS THAT KILL PEOPLE, every one together now...... PEOPLE KILL PEOPLE!
reefraff
Active Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by bionicarm http:///t/392376/movie-theater-shooting/20#post_3483642
Apparently the guy was prepared for any such confrontation, considering he was wearing a bullet-proof vest, even a bullet-proof neck gear. The guy was well prepared and armed himself accordingly. I've beat this puppy to death, but someone please explain why anyone should have access to an AR-15 with the capability of holding a 100-round drum? Convince me there would have been as much carnage if he'd would've just had the shotgun and the two 9mm's?
For someone so prepared he didn't offer any resistance to the cops. I am not opposed to require a license of some sort for the mags that hold over 15 rounds. A 100 round drum would be expensive and fun to unload on a full auto but is a waste on a Semi auto like this goober had. It just makes the gun harder to handle.
Originally Posted by bionicarm http:///t/392376/movie-theater-shooting/20#post_3483642
Apparently the guy was prepared for any such confrontation, considering he was wearing a bullet-proof vest, even a bullet-proof neck gear. The guy was well prepared and armed himself accordingly. I've beat this puppy to death, but someone please explain why anyone should have access to an AR-15 with the capability of holding a 100-round drum? Convince me there would have been as much carnage if he'd would've just had the shotgun and the two 9mm's?
For someone so prepared he didn't offer any resistance to the cops. I am not opposed to require a license of some sort for the mags that hold over 15 rounds. A 100 round drum would be expensive and fun to unload on a full auto but is a waste on a Semi auto like this goober had. It just makes the gun harder to handle.
darthtang aw
Active Member
He was? Really? Is that why he just gave up?
He wanted to get caught. He was waiting by his vehicle. Not attempting to leave.....waiting.
He wanted to get caught. He was waiting by his vehicle. Not attempting to leave.....waiting.
jerth6932
Active Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by Darthtang AW http:///t/392376/movie-theater-shooting/20#post_3483648
He wanted to get caught. He was waiting by his vehicle. Not attempting to leave.....waiting.
MY POINT EXACTLY..... He didn't want to die..... He wanted to give up! So if there were people in there with GUNS and he KNEW that ..... HE WOULD NOT OF DONE IT!
Originally Posted by Darthtang AW http:///t/392376/movie-theater-shooting/20#post_3483648
He wanted to get caught. He was waiting by his vehicle. Not attempting to leave.....waiting.
MY POINT EXACTLY..... He didn't want to die..... He wanted to give up! So if there were people in there with GUNS and he KNEW that ..... HE WOULD NOT OF DONE IT!
darthtang aw
Active Member
MY POINT EXACTLY..... He didn't want to die..... He wanted to give up!
I own 4 handguns, an M4, a shotgun, a mossin nagant, and 2 .22 calibers (one semi auto) rifles . Unless I had one of my rifles with me, I would have been hard pressed to get my family out safely, through tear gas smoke, and semi automatic fire of 100 rounds and get an accurate shot off with my handguns. Especially at any distance greater than 25 yards....depending on where you are sitting...some of these theatres are 50 yards. That is all I am saying, much less hit him where there is no body armor.
I own 4 handguns, an M4, a shotgun, a mossin nagant, and 2 .22 calibers (one semi auto) rifles . Unless I had one of my rifles with me, I would have been hard pressed to get my family out safely, through tear gas smoke, and semi automatic fire of 100 rounds and get an accurate shot off with my handguns. Especially at any distance greater than 25 yards....depending on where you are sitting...some of these theatres are 50 yards. That is all I am saying, much less hit him where there is no body armor.