New mccain ad

reefraff

reefraff

Active Member
Originally Posted by VinnyRaptor
http:///forum/post/2755233
its not a 1st ammendment issue! whats the problem with teaching our kindergarteners about sexual predators? Palin wants to teach abstinence is that --- ed? and ofcourse nothing should be forced. if parents dont want their child exposed to this curiculum then they shouldn't be.
It is a first amendment issue if the schools decide to teach the stuff whether the parents like it or not as Rylan seemed to indicate with his post. Quite frankly I think the Catholic church's views on the subject of BC are absurd but that isn't for me or the government to decide.
Not a thing in the world wrong with teaching about predators. That has NOTHING to do with the s ex ed curriculum. Unfortunately this bill which expanded it from 6 -12 to K 12 didn't limit the scope of what was being taught to the younger kids other than to say age appropriate. If it was such a good bill why didn't it pass?
 
V

vinnyraptor

Guest
can you read? in the early years it will be about PREDATORS! not physiology, biology, and anatomy!
Originally Posted by Darthtang AW
http:///forum/post/2755320
Not to kindergarteners she does not. A Kindergartener can't even read, and you want to teach them about ---? If they aren't fully capable at that age of learning to read in a correct manner, what do you think they will do with information about ---? For god's sake, at this age they still stick strange things in their mouths. You teach them how a baby is made what do you think they will play out at recess. Maybe not the real act...but a playground with 5 year olds humping each other (even playing with clothes on) is not something I want to see.
Hell, while we are at it, let's show them graphic wr pictures as well. Take a field trip to a morgue to see what a dead body looks like and how it changes....that would be great for children. I mean the more information you give them early the better, correct?
 
1knight164

1knight164

Member
Originally Posted by Darthtang AW
http:///forum/post/2755320
Not to kindergarteners she does not. A Kindergartener can't even read, and you want to teach them about ---? If they aren't fully capable at that age of learning to read in a correct manner, what do you think they will do with information about ---? For god's sake, at this age they still stick strange things in their mouths. You teach them how a baby is made what do you think they will play out at recess. Maybe not the real act...but a playground with 5 year olds humping each other (even playing with clothes on) is not something I want to see.
Good point. How were they expecting to teach them? I can picture the teacher breaking out the Barbie and Ken dolls. Or maybe Tele-tubbies.
 
1journeyman

1journeyman

Active Member
This is just yet another case of the Obama supporters listening to the talking points instead of looking up the truth for themselves.
Crimzy, you asked where in the Bill it addressed "K". How about the following? :"Each class or course in comprehensive --- education offered in any of grades K 6 through 12 shall include instruction on the prevention of sexually transmitted infections, including the prevention, transmission and spread of HIV AIDS.."
Does that sound like it is addressing s ex predators?
Have any of you Obama supporters bothered to read the curriculum Obama's spokesman cites regarding s ex education? That's a rhetorical question, of course...
I can't link the curriculum. It's definitely not "G" rated. Google it for yourselves then let's discuss this from an educated, informed and intelligent perspective.
 
V

vinnyraptor

Guest
look do you really think anyone is going to agree with a bill that teaches our/my 5 yr old the "birds and the bees". i actually have a kindergartener RIGHT NOW. he just started a few weeks ago. it will teach about predators early on then HIV and other diseases. and eventually the "birds and bees". and its ALL by consent of the parent!
you try and make it sound like its going to FORCED down your kids throats. a total lie. you try to associate teaching little ones about *** with Obama! its disgusting, desperate, and false! he is the only canidate in a LONG TIME the points out our are lack of teaching in MATH and SCIENCE globally! he wants our kids to have the best education to compete globally! in Math and Science not ---!
he is also progressive enough to understand the times.
teen pregnancy, HIV and disease, and child predators are REAL problems in our society. whats wrong with OFFERING education on these issues if the PARENTS CONSENT? whats wrong with the richest country in the world having the BEST education system in the world? whats socialist or marxist about it?
Originally Posted by 1journeyman
http:///forum/post/2757279
Show me where in the Bill this is stated... or are you just making it up?
 
1journeyman

1journeyman

Active Member
Again I ask; Show me where in the Bill you are getting your "facts" from.
We've quoted the Bill, quoted Obama, and I've read the curriculum. You have yet to site any evidence to contradict the freakin Bill.
 
crimzy

crimzy

Active Member
Originally Posted by 1journeyman
http:///forum/post/2757290
Crimzy, you asked where in the Bill it addressed "K". How about the following? :"Each class or course in comprehensive --- education offered in any of grades K 6 through 12 shall include instruction on the prevention of sexually transmitted infections, including the prevention, transmission and spread of HIV AIDS.."
Does that sound like it is addressing s ex predators?

Journey, this is not at all what I asked (and I asked my question MANY times). Of course the bill mentions the grade "K". It is meant to cover any course that is offered in elementary, middle and high schools. Of course, "K" is included in that group. I asked where the add suggested, promoted or even encouraged s-e-x education being taught to Kindergardeners. It simply doesn't... the bill only addresses the content where the course is going to be offered.
 
stdreb27

stdreb27

Active Member
Originally Posted by crimzy
http:///forum/post/2757651
Journey, this is not at all what I asked (and I asked my question MANY times). Of course the bill mentions the grade "K". It is meant to cover any course that is offered in elementary, middle and high schools. Of course, "K" is included in that group. I asked where the add suggested, promoted or even encouraged s-e-x education being taught to Kindergardeners. It simply doesn't... the bill only addresses the content where the course is going to be offered.

Lawyers splitting words.
Even if you accept the assumption that they were already teaching --- ed to Kindergardeners. I think it is a far safer conclusion that obama supports said education for kindergarden based on his Yes vote for the bill that you say only discusses content of said education to Kindergardeners. Than to say a sitting president invaded another country for anything other than kosher intentions.
 
1journeyman

1journeyman

Active Member
Originally Posted by crimzy
http:///forum/post/2757651
Journey, this is not at all what I asked (and I asked my question MANY times). Of course the bill mentions the grade "K". It is meant to cover any course that is offered in elementary, middle and high schools. Of course, "K" is included in that group. I asked where the add suggested, promoted or even encouraged s-e-x education being taught to Kindergardeners. It simply doesn't... the bill only addresses the content where the course is going to be offered.

Crimzy, the Bill was an amendment to the previous law, which, if I'm not mistaken, was for 6-12 grades. If you look at the link I provided of the Bill it shows "6th" being crossed out in favor of "K".
Now, that said, if you want the particulars of the curriculum Obama endorsed Google it. As I said, I've read it and it most certainly is all about s ex ed from the beginning.
Read the curriculum Crimzy, then let's talk.
 
reefraff

reefraff

Active Member
Originally Posted by crimzy
http:///forum/post/2757651
Journey, this is not at all what I asked (and I asked my question MANY times). Of course the bill mentions the grade "K". It is meant to cover any course that is offered in elementary, middle and high schools. Of course, "K" is included in that group. I asked where the add suggested, promoted or even encouraged s-e-x education being taught to Kindergardeners. It simply doesn't... the bill only addresses the content where the course is going to be offered.

Look at the bill in the link Crimz, You will notice it says K 6 (6 is strikethough) 12 which means they were changing the law from applying from 6-12 to include K 12. I
 
bionicarm

bionicarm

Active Member
Any of you think that maybe the reason they modified the bill to include K - 6 was to cover all their bases in case of some lawsuit? Omit the K - 6, and some parent comes screaming discrimination, "I want my 1st grader to learn about predators, etc., and you left them out! I'm gonna sue based on age discrimination!!!" Remember, it's lawyers who write most of these bills up.
 
crimzy

crimzy

Active Member
Gentlemen... I don't want to keep saying the same things that I was saying 2 pages ago so I'll pretty much leave it at this. READ THE BILL. It is clear on its face. Yes, it does INCLUDE elementary schools in the curriculum requirements where s-e-x education courses are offered. No, it does not SUPPORT the teaching of s-e-x education to kindergardeners anywhere in the Bill. You guys are all smart guys, so I can only assume that your misunderstanding of this simple distinction is more about your support for your guy than your rational analysis of this Bill. And I do have a sneaking suspicion that, despite your best arguments here, you ALL can plainly see that this Bill does not, in any way, promote the teaching of s-e-x education to kindergardeners.
Let me put it this way, if you have a child in kindergarden, does this Bill make it any more likely that your child will be taught s-e-x education? Nope... would just mandate the curriculum in any public school and provide the parents rights where those courses are provided.
But you guys will continue to argue this non-issue... after all, that's what we do around here.
 
bionicarm

bionicarm

Active Member
Originally Posted by 1journeyman
http:///forum/post/2758027
I'll say it again...
Read the curriculum. It's not about predator avoidance... That's the Straw Man here.
Straw Man. Now theres a term I haven't heard in a while. Why do you take each comment so literally? I used predators as an example as to why they would teach that stuff to kids in kindergarten and 1st grade. Like I said, the inclusion of K - 6 is most likely a legal one. Cover any potential lawsuits. Also, read one of the first lines of the bill. If a parent doesn't want their kid to be taught the content, they can opt out of it. The Texas Congress just passed some bill making it mandatory that High Schools start offering some class on 'religious history'. Nice little way for the religious zealots to get into the public school system. I don't agree with it, so I have the option to keep my kids from taking the course. Governor Rick Perry (Mr. Republican of Texas) tried pushing that Gardasil vaccination down our throats, wanting every girl starting at 11 to take it. Thank goodness smarter heads prevailed and got that insane Executive Order reversed. It's called Freedom Of Choice. I probably wouldn't want my 5 or 6 year old learning about s-e-x, but there's some people who have no problem with it. Again, this bill gives them that option. You don't want your kids in the class, take them out. It's that simple.
What is it with the Republicans who think the government has this 'hidden agenda'? The Democrats are out there to take over your lives. Are the books '1984' and 'Animal Farm' required reading material to join the Republican Party? What comical is there are clones of you guys on other forums I peruse through. They have the same paranoid doctrine that Big Brother is going to take over their entire lives. Hate to tell you, but there are times when it's wise to let the government make decisions for you. Look at the Hurricane Ike survivors. You have people wanting to stay in Galveston and Boliver because 'they have the right to protect their property'. But the conditions down there are pretty much Third World right now. The government leaders are telling them to leave, because they simply can't support them right now. So if these people do stay, can they blame their demise on the government's inability to support them?
 
stdreb27

stdreb27

Active Member
Originally Posted by bionicarm
http:///forum/post/2758252
Straw Man. Now theres a term I haven't heard in a while. Why do you take each comment so literally? I used predators as an example as to why they would teach that stuff to kids in kindergarten and 1st grade. Like I said, the inclusion of K - 6 is most likely a legal one. Cover any potential lawsuits. Also, read one of the first lines of the bill. If a parent doesn't want their kid to be taught the content, they can opt out of it. The Texas Congress just passed some bill making it mandatory that High Schools start offering some class on 'religious history'. Nice little way for the religious zealots to get into the public school system. I don't agree with it, so I have the option to keep my kids from taking the course. Governor Rick Perry (Mr. Republican of Texas) tried pushing that Gardasil vaccination down our throats, wanting every girl starting at 11 to take it. Thank goodness smarter heads prevailed and got that insane Executive Order reversed. It's called Freedom Of Choice. I probably wouldn't want my 5 or 6 year old learning about s-e-x, but there's some people who have no problem with it. Again, this bill gives them that option. You don't want your kids in the class, take them out. It's that simple.
What is it with the Republicans who think the government has this 'hidden agenda'? The Democrats are out there to take over your lives. Are the books '1984' and 'Animal Farm' required reading material to join the Republican Party? What comical is there are clones of you guys on other forums I peruse through. They have the same paranoid doctrine that Big Brother is going to take over their entire lives. Hate to tell you, but there are times when it's wise to let the government make decisions for you. Look at the Hurricane Ike survivors. You have people wanting to stay in Galveston and Boliver because 'they have the right to protect their property'. But the conditions down there are pretty much Third World right now. The government leaders are telling them to leave, because they simply can't support them right now. So if these people do stay, can they blame their demise on the government's inability to support them?
You can make all the excuses you want, but the reality still remaines. Obama actually voted yes for a bill that shows that he supports the said education to kids in kindergarden. As for the folks in galveston. I haven't seen the guys who stayed in galveston complaining.
 
1journeyman

1journeyman

Active Member
Originally Posted by crimzy
http:///forum/post/2758240
Gentlemen... I don't want to keep saying the same things that I was saying 2 pages ago so I'll pretty much leave it at this. READ THE BILL. It is clear on its face. Yes, it does INCLUDE elementary schools in the curriculum requirements where s-e-x education courses are offered. No, it does not SUPPORT the teaching of s-e-x education to kindergardeners anywhere in the Bill. ...
You're wrong Crimzy.
 
zeke92

zeke92

Active Member
Wow thats really sad...my favorite ad is McSame saying OBAMA is the same...doesn't make any sence.
And IMO, if we knew about these 'things' when we were kindergarteners, and talked as if they weren't things to be shy and not talk about in public, i think everyone would be alot more self confident about some things and alot of things would be alot less awkward. Just imo.
 
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