News flash: the war in Iraq is NOT a war against terror

[ross]

I havent read the whole thread and this may not be what yall are talking about right now, but...
Everyone who is saying that having our soldiers over their fighting is a waste, think about the family of the people you are talking about, who have to read crap like yours saying its a waste that the son/daughter/brother/sister is over there willing to give their life (and it some cases doing it) for no reason. That is total bull crap. My dad is in the military and i HATE it when people talk like that. Maybe you dont have family in the situation and thats why you dont get it or maybe you do, either way your wrong for saying what you do. Bush is finally a man enough to step up and not let us get pushed around and screwed with by terrorists. Dont you remember 9/11? Dont you remember how many people lost a loved one. Cant you remember how much that hurt so many thouands of people? So you think we shouldnt anything about it? Im done before i say too much.

 

[lovethesea]

Originally Posted by Reefbabe
Thank you Darth Tang, ScoobaDoo and Ilovethesea for your support of our active troops. My husband is an active US Marine and has been serving now for 15 years. .

um, no....THANK YOU and your hubby !! Its a huge sacrifice for the families also. My dad is a retired Colonel in the Army, 3 tours in Nam, so I know how proud these men and women are.
There is another Marine on here.......TheRock0861. Got back from a tour in Iraq. I think he may have gotten deployed again, haven't seen him awhile.
Praying for your families and all the service men and women during this holiday season!

 

[scotts]

LTS,
Actually the last post I saw from the Rock was that he had two weeks left in Iraq, and I have not seen a post from him since. Yes that was some time ago.
Scott

 

[beth]

http://www.comcast.net/news/index.js...11/281643.html

 

[zman1]

The UK.....

 

[scubadoo]

Originally Posted by jcrim
Honestly, I don't know. I do believe though that Bin Laden was not perceived as the same threat during Clinton (pre 9/11) as he is now.
Probably the most outrageous comment in this thread. If he was not percieved as a credible and dangerous threat why were we chasing him?
I am amazed how some can be critical of this adminstration and the war on terror ...but the INCOMPETENCE of other administrations are easily dismissed and excused away.
I suggest you do some research as to what exactly bin Laden was linked to pre 9/11. That would involve research and objectivity.
I will give Clinton some credit for his "try" at solving the problem. beter than doing nothing. it was a failed effort though.

 

[darth tang]

Bin Laden was involved in at least three major attacks - the 1993 World Trade Center bombing, the 1996 killing of 19 US soldiers in Saudi Arabia, and the 1998 bombings in Kenya and Tanzania.
There I did some of the research for you.

 

[jcrim]

Originally Posted by ScubaDoo
Probably the most outrageous comment in this thread. If he was not percieved as a credible and dangerous threat why were we chasing him?
I am amazed how some can be critical of this adminstration and the war on terror ...but the INCOMPETENCE of other administrations are easily dismissed and excused away.
I suggest you do some research as to what exactly bin Laden was linked to pre 9/11. That would involve research and objectivity.
I will give Clinton some credit for his "try" at solving the problem. beter than doing nothing. it was a failed effort though.
I can't believe you're arguing with a comment I made at the beginning of all this. I haven't even read this thread in several days... been kinda busy. But I said he wasn't perceived as as much of a thread not "credible and dangerous". If you're going to put words in my mouth then you might as well just argue with yourself. Since you either didn't understand my point (or ignored it) I'm saying that nothing osama did before rivaled his 9/11 attacks. I think most people would agree with that. Read a little more carefully next time.

 

[jcrim]

BTW, are you really reading comments from 10 days ago looking for points to argue? A little too much time on your hands?

 

[darth tang]

Maybe not by the American people. But in Washington he was viewed as a threat, and a major one. Clinton had a discussion with Bush about him at the end of his term. If he wasn't viewed as that much of a threat I doubt Clinton would have had a lengthy conversation about him.
I will agree nothing he did prior to 9/11 rivaled any other attack against us by him......

 

[scubadoo]

Originally Posted by jcrim
BTW, are you really reading comments from 10 days ago looking for points to argue? A little too much time on your hands?
I was reviewing the thread and somehow missed the comment. I find it interesting that someone can claim posting facts yet seem uninformed in other areas directly related to a subject.
The idea here again is proactivity. You analyze a situtation and do something before a massive body count not after. His declared war was well known and no secret both by the current and previous administrations.
Your intial post states the ONGOING (emphasis addedd) war on terror has been a fialure since we have yet to get bin laden. This was/is propsoed by you as criticism against the ccurrent adminisrtation. Certianly, the current administration has some repsonsinbilty for its inaction previous to 9/11.
How one can state the ongoing war a fialure since we have yet to get bin Laden is beyond me...the key word being ONGOING. How one can announce this and leave out the previous administration and it's effort is also beyond me.
Much like Saddam...bin Laden was a swell guy previous to 9/11.

 

[scubadoo]

Originally Posted by jcrim
I can't believe you're arguing with a comment I made at the beginning of all this. I haven't even read this thread in several days... been kinda busy. But I said he wasn't perceived as as much of a thread not "credible and dangerous". If you're going to put words in my mouth then you might as well just argue with yourself. Since you either didn't understand my point (or ignored it) I'm saying that nothing osama did before rivaled his 9/11 attacks. I think most people would agree with that. Read a little more carefully next time.

I am not arguing...just pointing out that you are uninformed regarding the topic...or at best....you simply wish to dismiss the failures of others based on a lack of knowledge regarding the history of the terrorist group, it's comminicated mission, threats, it's past activity and the failure for the current and previous administrations to do something prior to 9/11
You see, I do criticize the current administration for not doing something based on known facts prior to 9/11.. You simply make some weak excuse that we needed a body count first in order to do something and/or no one would or could preceive the threat in the previous administration. Or, no one knew and/or had reason to beleive anything stated prior to 9/11 was credible or the actions represented no current or future threat.
I am amazed how easily dismissed and excused away the inaction and/or failure of the previous administration is articulated...but the current administration which has done something and declared war is labeled a failure.

 

[scubadoo]

For the record, bin Laden made a specific declaration in 1996..care to guess what that was?

 

[scubadoo]

Originally Posted by Darth Tang
Bin Laden was involved in at least three major attacks - the 1993 World Trade Center bombing, the 1996 killing of 19 US soldiers in Saudi Arabia, and the 1998 bombings in Kenya and Tanzania.
There I did some of the research for you.
And the best the previous adminisrtation could do on the initial WTC bombing was to treat it as a crminal act as opposed to a state terrorist attack. Mistake number one.

 

[darth tang]

I am expected to get some heat for my next comment...but here goes.
There is a part of me that desires that we do not "catch" bin laden. Why? Because I feel the majority of Americas perceive that as the end and the prize sought. That we will then stop our aggressive nature towards terrorists. Without that "figurehead" to be feared out there we do not haver a "perceived" goal any longer. Without him out there........there is no enemy for the war on terror. (I am stepping away from the Iraq discussion a bit)
I feel the minute the Iraq conquest started to go downhill in the public eye was when we caught Sadaam. We lost a figurehead to contend with. We now do not have that picture of evil before us. We have Zarqawi (sp?) but he just recently got on the scene. Osama and Hussein have been on the scene for a while.

 

[scubadoo]

Originally Posted by Darth Tang
I am expected to get some heat for my next comment...but here goes.
There is a part of me that desires that we do not "catch" bin laden. Why? Because I feel the majority of Americas perceive that as the end and the prize sought. That we will then stop our aggressive nature towards terrorists. Without that "figurehead" to be feared out there we do not haver a "perceived" goal any longer. Without him out there........there is no enemy for the war on terror. (I am stepping away from the Iraq discussion a bit)
I feel the minute the Iraq conquest started to go downhill in the public eye was when we caught Sadaam. We lost a figurehead to contend with. We now do not have that picture of evil before us. We have Zarqawi (sp?) but he just recently got on the scene. Osama and Hussein have been on the scene for a while.
I agree to a point. We have painted a couple faces as it pertains to terror. Although the administration articulated this is a war against many...we simply forgot. or forget
The picture we should paint is that of the WTC's falling...that is the picture of terror..and we should vow to do everything to continue the war on terror in order to prevent another attack.
instead, many would rather proununce we have failed...that we do not know what we are doing, criticize, whine and complain.
This does little to prevent another 9/11 and encourages those that wish to continue their terror to do so.
Like I stated...they have yet to attack us here at home since 9/11...yet it appears to me they are defeating us here at home...our resolve, courage and committment is dwindling each day.
Again, the miltary cannot do it alone..they need our support.
Like Hillary Clinton...you can not state you would never have voted to give the president the authority to attack...would now change your vote...but you still support the troops. Sorry to say those comments are inconsistent, mutually exclusive and down right disturbing from a presidential candidate wannabe.
I am eagerly awainting a detailed plan as to how the war on terror will continue.form folks like Hillary and those that now beleive we have failed. Those that criticize offer little as an alternative. This leads me to beleive they wish to return back to pre 9/11 times...when we simply dismissed, ignored, did not beleive, did not take serious, slept at the wheel, certainly that group did not mean what they said, etc...
They seek to criticize, whine, cry and complain but bring little to nothing as an alternative.
The face of terror is death..and those that paint the picture have all of us as the 'subject matter'.

 

[beth]

I believe Clinton did take bin Ladin pretty seriously....but perhaps did not conceive of the scale of the threat. Who could perceive of the scale of what happened on 911?

 

[bang guy]

Originally Posted by Beth
I believe Clinton did take bin Ladin pretty seriously....but perhaps did not conceive of the scale of the threat. Who could perceive of the scale of what happened on 911?
I think the scale should have been derived from the first time Bin Laden bombed the WTC and almost brought it down.

 

[scubadoo]

Originally Posted by Beth
I believe Clinton did take bin Ladin pretty seriously....but perhaps did not conceive of the scale of the threat. Who could perceive of the scale of what happened on 911?
Bin laden declared war on the US in 1996..no secret. he demonstrated not only a will but a desire and capability to do so.
it is eaasy for all of us to say now that he was a credible threat.
The point I am trying to make is that one cannot be critical of the current andministrations actions...yet let the previous one slide on some technicality as the starter of this thread and many others here in America seek to do.
Both current and previous share some responsibility. We also then must analyze the actions taken.....and draw conclusions.
No one has a crystal ball..so we must take these cowards at face value....they mean what they say. IMO..the fist WTC attack served as a wake up call...yet we continued to sleep...we all share some repsonsibility regarding actions taken and/or inaction.

 

[beth]

I'm not critical at all on what Bush has done in terms of Bin Ladin. Perhaps, even, I would say he hasn't done enough. One has to wonder, if we had not been at war with Iraq, if all those military resources may have produced better results on the Bin Ladin front.
We'll never know.