Officially joined the hobby today!!!
- Thread starter gcgrad
- Start date
2quills
Well-Known Member
Sounds good, Dean. You already have the pump so you might as well use it. I'm not a huge fan of the vinyl tube too much when it comes to the drains. Do you know what size the bulkheads are for the drains and the return? I was just working on some plumbing tonight, if you're looking for ideas you could check out my page, I just posted some pics. https://forums.saltwaterfish.com/forum/thread/378912/2quills-120g-re-build-thread/320#post_3363532
gcgrad
Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2Quills http:///forum/thread/383014/officially-joined-the-hobby-today/180#post_3363533
Sounds good, Dean. You already have the pump so you might as well use it. I'm not a huge fan of the vinyl tube too much when it comes to the drains. Do you know what size the bulkheads are for the drains and the return? I was just working on some plumbing tonight, if you're looking for ideas you could check out my page, I just posted some pics. https://forums.saltwaterfish.com/forum/thread/378912/2quills-120g-re-build-thread/320#post_3363532
Nice job Corey! Just checked it out and it looks good. I think the pvc definitely gives it a cleaner look. Looks like the drain bulkhead is 3" and the return is 2" (that's measuring the diameter of the fitting. The previous owner used 1 1/4" tubing for the drain line with 1" pvc gate valves. He used 1" tubing for the return with 3/4" pvc gate valves. Quick question. If you are using pvc, how do you connect the piping to the bulkhead? In other words, do you have to insert a fitting on the threaded part of the bulkhead or does the pvc piping fit snugly onto the threaded part of the bulkhead? Also, when connecting the pvc piping, couplings, valves and such, what do you use to seal them to prevent water leaking? Thanks Corey!
Originally Posted by 2Quills http:///forum/thread/383014/officially-joined-the-hobby-today/180#post_3363533
Sounds good, Dean. You already have the pump so you might as well use it. I'm not a huge fan of the vinyl tube too much when it comes to the drains. Do you know what size the bulkheads are for the drains and the return? I was just working on some plumbing tonight, if you're looking for ideas you could check out my page, I just posted some pics. https://forums.saltwaterfish.com/forum/thread/378912/2quills-120g-re-build-thread/320#post_3363532
Nice job Corey! Just checked it out and it looks good. I think the pvc definitely gives it a cleaner look. Looks like the drain bulkhead is 3" and the return is 2" (that's measuring the diameter of the fitting. The previous owner used 1 1/4" tubing for the drain line with 1" pvc gate valves. He used 1" tubing for the return with 3/4" pvc gate valves. Quick question. If you are using pvc, how do you connect the piping to the bulkhead? In other words, do you have to insert a fitting on the threaded part of the bulkhead or does the pvc piping fit snugly onto the threaded part of the bulkhead? Also, when connecting the pvc piping, couplings, valves and such, what do you use to seal them to prevent water leaking? Thanks Corey!
2quills
Well-Known Member
Ok, yeah, I would definately ditch that plumbing for the drains. Those 90 degree barb fittings and the other barb fittings reduce flow efficiency very quickly so I would try to stay away from that stuff if you can. It's fine for your return plumbing, I just don't like it for drains. When it comes to elbows/90 degree fittings, I like to use the "long sweep 90's". They have a long sweeping curve to them instead of a sharp turn so it's better for effiency. That's what I'm using on my build. I also incorporated some Spa Flex Pipe (flexible pvc pipe) for part of my drains which is kind of nice. It just gives you a little flexibilty when putting things together or eliminated having to use 90's in some cases. My whole return line will be ran with it.
The best way to measure your bulkeads is to gauge the diameter of the inside of the bulkhead at it's smallest point. Just so I'm clear...the tank has two drain holes and one return, correct?
The best way to measure your bulkeads is to gauge the diameter of the inside of the bulkhead at it's smallest point. Just so I'm clear...the tank has two drain holes and one return, correct?
gcgrad
Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2Quills http:///forum/thread/383014/officially-joined-the-hobby-today/180#post_3363769
Ok, yeah, I would definately ditch that plumbing for the drains. Those 90 degree barb fittings and the other barb fittings reduce flow efficiency very quickly so I would try to stay away from that stuff if you can. It's fine for your return plumbing, I just don't like it for drains. When it comes to elbows/90 degree fittings, I like to use the "long sweep 90's". They have a long sweeping curve to them instead of a sharp turn so it's better for effiency. That's what I'm using on my build. I also incorporated some Spa Flex Pipe (flexible pvc pipe) for part of my drains which is kind of nice. It just gives you a little flexibilty when putting things together or eliminated having to use 90's in some cases. My whole return line will be ran with it.
The best way to measure your bulkeads is to gauge the diameter of the inside of the bulkhead at it's smallest point. Just so I'm clear...the tank has two drain holes and one return, correct?
The drain bulkhead looks to be 1 1/4" opening initially (probably 1" at the smallest point). The return bulkhead is 1" opening initially (3/4" at the smallest point). Looks like he glued the barb fittings in so I don't think I can remove them from the bulkhead. I will probably mimic what you are doing Corey. I like the idea of using the long sweep 90s for the drain and running pvc for the drain. Then using the spa flex piping for the return to eliminate 90 degree turns on the return. As far as the overflows go, its twin corner overflows. Therefore there are two holes drilled in each return, hence two drain holes and two return holes. I'm thinking I would use a pvc "Y" connector which would attach to the spa flex piping which would then attach to the return barb fittings. What you think?
Originally Posted by 2Quills http:///forum/thread/383014/officially-joined-the-hobby-today/180#post_3363769
Ok, yeah, I would definately ditch that plumbing for the drains. Those 90 degree barb fittings and the other barb fittings reduce flow efficiency very quickly so I would try to stay away from that stuff if you can. It's fine for your return plumbing, I just don't like it for drains. When it comes to elbows/90 degree fittings, I like to use the "long sweep 90's". They have a long sweeping curve to them instead of a sharp turn so it's better for effiency. That's what I'm using on my build. I also incorporated some Spa Flex Pipe (flexible pvc pipe) for part of my drains which is kind of nice. It just gives you a little flexibilty when putting things together or eliminated having to use 90's in some cases. My whole return line will be ran with it.
The best way to measure your bulkeads is to gauge the diameter of the inside of the bulkhead at it's smallest point. Just so I'm clear...the tank has two drain holes and one return, correct?
The drain bulkhead looks to be 1 1/4" opening initially (probably 1" at the smallest point). The return bulkhead is 1" opening initially (3/4" at the smallest point). Looks like he glued the barb fittings in so I don't think I can remove them from the bulkhead. I will probably mimic what you are doing Corey. I like the idea of using the long sweep 90s for the drain and running pvc for the drain. Then using the spa flex piping for the return to eliminate 90 degree turns on the return. As far as the overflows go, its twin corner overflows. Therefore there are two holes drilled in each return, hence two drain holes and two return holes. I'm thinking I would use a pvc "Y" connector which would attach to the spa flex piping which would then attach to the return barb fittings. What you think?
2quills
Well-Known Member
Sounds good. Look for a Wye like this online...
For the drains I would pick up long sweep 90's for all four drains (appropriate size for each). And then get your self some fittings like in the the picture below. Get some short pieces of rigid pvc pipe for coupling the pieces together. Glue the long sweeps to new bulkheads on the bottoms and then glue you're addapters/fittings on to those in order to hook up your hoses and pvc pipes.
Example: but without long sweeps...yours would have the longsweeps coming out of the bottom of the bulkheads and then the addapters/fittings would run horizontally.
and the long sweeps...
Hope that makes sense.
For the drains I would pick up long sweep 90's for all four drains (appropriate size for each). And then get your self some fittings like in the the picture below. Get some short pieces of rigid pvc pipe for coupling the pieces together. Glue the long sweeps to new bulkheads on the bottoms and then glue you're addapters/fittings on to those in order to hook up your hoses and pvc pipes.
Example: but without long sweeps...yours would have the longsweeps coming out of the bottom of the bulkheads and then the addapters/fittings would run horizontally.
and the long sweeps...
Hope that makes sense.
gcgrad
Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2Quills http:///forum/thread/383014/officially-joined-the-hobby-today/180#post_3363836
Sounds good. Look for a Wye like this online...
For the drains I would pick up long sweep 90's for all four drains (appropriate size for each). And then get your self some fittings like in the the picture below. Get some short pieces of rigid pvc pipe for coupling the pieces together. Glue the long sweeps to new bulkheads on the bottoms and then glue you're addapters/fittings on to those in order to hook up your hoses and pvc pipes.
Example: but without long sweeps...yours would have the longsweeps coming out of the bottom of the bulkheads and then the addapters/fittings would run horizontally.
and the long sweeps...
Hope that makes sense.
I think I'm following you. Is the one on the left for return and the one on the right drain? So the 90 sweep will slide onto the bulkheads and those fittings/adapter will fit into the 90 sweeps. Then pvc or hose will attach to the fitting if I'm right. Sorry I have so many questions. I just haven't done this before and sometimes it can be difficult to understand if I don't have something in my hands to work with. If I can grasp all this then I will be setting up the plumbing this weekend hopefully.
Originally Posted by 2Quills http:///forum/thread/383014/officially-joined-the-hobby-today/180#post_3363836
Sounds good. Look for a Wye like this online...
For the drains I would pick up long sweep 90's for all four drains (appropriate size for each). And then get your self some fittings like in the the picture below. Get some short pieces of rigid pvc pipe for coupling the pieces together. Glue the long sweeps to new bulkheads on the bottoms and then glue you're addapters/fittings on to those in order to hook up your hoses and pvc pipes.
Example: but without long sweeps...yours would have the longsweeps coming out of the bottom of the bulkheads and then the addapters/fittings would run horizontally.
and the long sweeps...
Hope that makes sense.
I think I'm following you. Is the one on the left for return and the one on the right drain? So the 90 sweep will slide onto the bulkheads and those fittings/adapter will fit into the 90 sweeps. Then pvc or hose will attach to the fitting if I'm right. Sorry I have so many questions. I just haven't done this before and sometimes it can be difficult to understand if I don't have something in my hands to work with. If I can grasp all this then I will be setting up the plumbing this weekend hopefully.
2quills
Well-Known Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by gcgrad http:///forum/thread/383014/officially-joined-the-hobby-today/180#post_3364101
Thanks Corey!
No sweat!
Ok, I did some rough drawings just to throw some ideas your way. Again I'd just like to say that these are just some ideas and not something that you necessarily "need" to do. It is your tank and you do what you want with it, so it won't hurt my feelings if you don't like the idea or wish to do something different.
For your returns I would highly suggest running them with flexible pvc pipe instead of the clear vinyl tubing. It's a little more costly but well worth it (IMO). The drawing shows splitting them with a Tee, which you could do if you can't get your hands on a Wye.
And for the drains is another simple but clean look and pretty self explanatory. There is a valve on the the vertical drain going to the fuge for flow control.
I rummaged around out in the garage and pulled out some various plumbing parts. So I threw something together real quick to kind of illustrate how the actual drains would look. I don't have all of the correct pieces on hand so I had to improvise with one of the Tee's (It's actually a 4-way).
And a few more pictures of various way of connecting plumbing to bulkheads whether you have slip or thread.
Originally Posted by gcgrad http:///forum/thread/383014/officially-joined-the-hobby-today/180#post_3364101
Thanks Corey!
No sweat!
Ok, I did some rough drawings just to throw some ideas your way. Again I'd just like to say that these are just some ideas and not something that you necessarily "need" to do. It is your tank and you do what you want with it, so it won't hurt my feelings if you don't like the idea or wish to do something different.
For your returns I would highly suggest running them with flexible pvc pipe instead of the clear vinyl tubing. It's a little more costly but well worth it (IMO). The drawing shows splitting them with a Tee, which you could do if you can't get your hands on a Wye.
And for the drains is another simple but clean look and pretty self explanatory. There is a valve on the the vertical drain going to the fuge for flow control.
I rummaged around out in the garage and pulled out some various plumbing parts. So I threw something together real quick to kind of illustrate how the actual drains would look. I don't have all of the correct pieces on hand so I had to improvise with one of the Tee's (It's actually a 4-way).
And a few more pictures of various way of connecting plumbing to bulkheads whether you have slip or thread.
gcgrad
Member
Wow Corey! That looks great. Thanks for taking the time to illustrate the setup. I feel pretty confident about it now. I was initially thinking to use the amiracle filter system in addition to the sump for more water volume and to be my fuge. I would have simply used a mag 5 to pump water from the sump to the amiracle(fuge) then hook the return pipes up to the quiet one pump. However with further thought, I think the 29 gal sump may suffice. Although It may only hold around 22 gal or so, I think it will work.
2quills
Well-Known Member
Sure, Dean, try it out with just the 29 and see how it goes. It is a little small for a set up of this size typically but it's better than nothing. Just a little FYI, I'm going with a 65g for my sump on my 120g. Refugiums that tend to be a little bit on the smaller side aren't really very effective when it comes to converting or removing nitrates, but if nothing else it's still a refugium and great for breeded pods.
If you give me the dimensions of the 29g and your baffle heights I can tell you how much actual water volume you will have when it's up and running.
If you give me the dimensions of the 29g and your baffle heights I can tell you how much actual water volume you will have when it's up and running.
gcgrad
Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2Quills http:///forum/thread/383014/officially-joined-the-hobby-today/180#post_3364536
Sure, Dean, try it out with just the 29 and see how it goes. It is a little small for a set up of this size typically but it's better than nothing. Just a little FYI, I'm going with a 65g for my sump on my 120g. Refugiums that tend to be a little bit on the smaller side aren't really very effective when it comes to converting or removing nitrates, but if nothing else it's still a refugium and great for breeded pods.
If you give me the dimensions of the 29g and your baffle heights I can tell you how much actual water volume you will have when it's up and running.
Just did the math Corey. With my baffle heights and what not I'm looking at roughly 16 gallons. That isn't much at all. This doesn't even factor in the volume removed by protein skimmer, return pump, and deep sand bed. I guess I messed up by not having two of the baffles vertically running to the top of the tank. I guess on a positive note only having 16 gal will allow ample space for water in the event of a power outage. In which case the overflows would drain until the water level was below the siphon. Now I'm thinking that I might want to use that Amiracle to get more water volume. I could set it up as a fuge like I had mentioned before and simply pump water from the sump to the amiracle. Ah man... what to do what to do.
Originally Posted by 2Quills http:///forum/thread/383014/officially-joined-the-hobby-today/180#post_3364536
Sure, Dean, try it out with just the 29 and see how it goes. It is a little small for a set up of this size typically but it's better than nothing. Just a little FYI, I'm going with a 65g for my sump on my 120g. Refugiums that tend to be a little bit on the smaller side aren't really very effective when it comes to converting or removing nitrates, but if nothing else it's still a refugium and great for breeded pods.
If you give me the dimensions of the 29g and your baffle heights I can tell you how much actual water volume you will have when it's up and running.
Just did the math Corey. With my baffle heights and what not I'm looking at roughly 16 gallons. That isn't much at all. This doesn't even factor in the volume removed by protein skimmer, return pump, and deep sand bed. I guess I messed up by not having two of the baffles vertically running to the top of the tank. I guess on a positive note only having 16 gal will allow ample space for water in the event of a power outage. In which case the overflows would drain until the water level was below the siphon. Now I'm thinking that I might want to use that Amiracle to get more water volume. I could set it up as a fuge like I had mentioned before and simply pump water from the sump to the amiracle. Ah man... what to do what to do.
2quills
Well-Known Member
Dean if you were to use something like the design for the drain that I posted above you wouldn't need a pump to feed the fuge. You'd just have to come up with a way for the fuge to drain into the return chamber in the other tank. You wouldn't be able to use a pump for this purpose simply because you'll never be able to match the amount of flow pumping out with the amount of drain water coming in. What would end up happening if you were to try that would be either pumping the water out too fast, thus draining the fuge dry and burning out the pump because they drain water coming in won't be enough to keep up. Or, it will pump too slow and not keep up with the drain water coming in and you could flood the fuge. Even if the difference was very minuscule you would still be playing with fire. You'll just have to trust me on this one and save yourself the headache.
gcgrad
Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2Quills http:///forum/thread/383014/officially-joined-the-hobby-today/180#post_3364548
Dean if you were to use something like the design for the drain that I posted above you wouldn't need a pump to feed the fuge. You'd just have to come up with a way for the fuge to drain into the return chamber in the other tank. You wouldn't be able to use a pump for this purpose simply because you'll never be able to match the amount of flow pumping out with the amount of drain water coming in. What would end up happening if you were to try that would be either pumping the water out too fast, thus draining the fuge dry and burning out the pump because they drain water coming in won't be enough to keep up. Or, it will pump too slow and not keep up with the drain water coming in and you could flood the fuge. Even if the difference was very minuscule you would still be playing with fire. You'll just have to trust me on this one and save yourself the headache.
Haha. I notice I'm so indecisive at times. I commit to doing it this way and then end up changing my mind, then change back,etc.
I will just use the 29 gal and save myself the headache like you said. That will make things a lot simpler and if I keep good water quality then the extra volume isn't necessary. Thanks for the help Corey!
Originally Posted by 2Quills http:///forum/thread/383014/officially-joined-the-hobby-today/180#post_3364548
Dean if you were to use something like the design for the drain that I posted above you wouldn't need a pump to feed the fuge. You'd just have to come up with a way for the fuge to drain into the return chamber in the other tank. You wouldn't be able to use a pump for this purpose simply because you'll never be able to match the amount of flow pumping out with the amount of drain water coming in. What would end up happening if you were to try that would be either pumping the water out too fast, thus draining the fuge dry and burning out the pump because they drain water coming in won't be enough to keep up. Or, it will pump too slow and not keep up with the drain water coming in and you could flood the fuge. Even if the difference was very minuscule you would still be playing with fire. You'll just have to trust me on this one and save yourself the headache.
Haha. I notice I'm so indecisive at times. I commit to doing it this way and then end up changing my mind, then change back,etc.
gcgrad
Member
Well I bought some plumbing parts today. They don't have 1" sweep elbows. I've looked online and the start those at 1 1/2". They also didn't have a barbed wye, thinking about ordering a 3/4" barbed wye online. An alternative to the 1" sweep which was unavailable would be to use two 45 degree elbows and connect them via a small pipe. However it may make more sense to just use a 90 degree elbow instead of connecting two 45 degree elbows. I bought the 1" pvc length that I will cut to attach my 1" Tees, outlet elbows, and ball valves. Also going to just use the braided pvc tubing as they had no flexible pvc piping. Any suggestions on the drain line Corey?
2quills
Well-Known Member
Yep, just some regular ol' pvc will work just fine for the drains. You're right they only make the long sweeps in 1.5" and up. They use them for actual drain plumbing in residential and commercial buildings so that's why you don't typically see them any smaller then that. Also, if you add some unions in the right places it will allow you to disconnect the pieces for cleaning down the road or incase you ever need to relocate the tank you can break down the plumbing and re use it without having to cut it all apart.
florida joe
Well-Known Member
Cory are the drain pvc pieces in the overflow box
Perforated
Perforated
