Photography School

[gemmy]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Southern Wolf http:///t/391680/photography-school/40#post_3476522
Ok... I am going to leave this up to those of you who are following this thread because if you don't want to participate in this next idea I have then it will be useless.
I have thought about changing my camera settings from RAW to JPG. This way I don't have to process the images (aside from shrinking for web use). Then take a series of images that are off. I'll post them up and ask ya'll what settings needed to be changed to get the correct exposure or DOF and why. This will build on what has already been discussed. It will also get you to thinking about the settings (shutter, aperture, ISO) and how they relate to each other.
Do you want me to start doing a series of test images?
Go for it. I'll try.

 

[southern wolf]

Guess we can start off with real crappy since I have it online and handy (not on my personal computer right now).

Yes.... even I can take crappy pics LOL. Difference is I don't normally show them, but since this is a teaching aid... I will break my rules.
Little background on the shot. The wolf is slowly running behind the tree and I attempted to pan with the wolf. I am also using my big lens and it is wide open at f/6.3. It is also getting towards dusk and there is not a whole lot of light in the woods.
Here are the image parameters.
Shutter 1/13
Aperture f/6.3
ISO 400
What could I have done differently to get a good image and why?

 

[gemmy]

I would say increase the shutter speed a bit. On page 2 you recommend speeding the shutter speed when shooting live animals to capture the movement.

 

[southern wolf]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gemmy http:///t/391680/photography-school/60#post_3476544
I would say increase the shutter speed a bit. On page 2 you recommend speeding the shutter speed when shooting live animals to capture the movement.
Ok... how would you go about getting a faster shutter speed? If you only increase the shutter speed you cut down on available light hitting the sensor.
Remember.... when it comes to getting the proper exposure... it's all about the light hitting the sensor.

 

[gemmy]

You wouldn't want to shoot the image wide open. You would also have to reduce the aperture. I guess this is where I get a little confused.
I can't wait to get my camera and try these things out. I'm more of a visual learner.

 

[southern wolf]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gemmy http:///t/391680/photography-school/60#post_3476548
You wouldn't want to shoot the image wide open. You would also have to reduce the aperture. I guess this is where I get a little confused.
I can't wait to get my camera and try these things out. I'm more of a visual learner.
"wide open" refers to the largest opening you can get. This in turn lets in more light. The more light you can get to the sensor.. the faster you can make the shutter.
If you reduce the aperture (or stopping down the lens) then you are reducing the size of the hole in the lens, thus you get in less light. Less light doesn't allow you to increase shutter speed because a faster shutter also reduces light.
Like you... I'm more of a visual learner. I think that is one of the reasons I try to include photo's with the lessons.
You are right about needing to increase the shutter speed. That is the only way to stop the blur in that image... but to increase the shutter speed you have to increase the light getting to the sensor to compensate for the faster shutter speed.
There are four ways to accomplish this.

• 
  you could slow down the shutter to allow more light in (in this case... this is not an option)
• 
  You could open up the lens (lower f/stop numbers). This would also have an effect on your DOF. However in this case... it's not an option because my big lens is wide open at f/6.3
  You could add in external light (in the form of a flash or strobe). Also in this case not an option. The wolf was too far away from the camera for a flash to be effective.
  You can bump up your ISO to allow more light into the sensor.

This is why it's important not to forget about your ISO setting when shooting. By changing the ISO it was the only way I could keep shooting. I think I bumped it from 400 up to 1000. This allowed a lot more light onto the sensor and thus I was able to increase my shutter speed.

 

[gemmy]

I'm not sure if you recommended it in this thread, but is that why it is sometimes recommended to increase the ISO when taking pics of our tanks?

 

[southern wolf]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gemmy http:///t/391680/photography-school/60#post_3476554
I'm not sure if you recommended it in this thread, but is that why it is sometimes recommended to increase the ISO when taking pics of our tanks?
Yep... that is why I recommeded to increasing the ISO for shooting your tanks. It will allow you to increase your shutter speed without having to use a flash.

 

[southern wolf]

I'll try to do a series of shots showing how much difference changing the ISO makes. I am debating if I want to leave the shutter and aperture the same or change them so I can keep a good exposure.

 

[southern wolf]

Here is a visual representation of how the ISO affects your image.
We will start off with a base line of ISO 400. I have the camera on my tripod because I had to slow the shutter way down. This also lets all the images be exactly the same. In this series... the only thing I changed was the ISO variable.
Shutter 1/6, Aperture f/3.5, ISO 400

Lets cut that in half and go down to ISO 200

Next step up from 400 is ISO 640

Lets bump it up again to ISO 800

And take it even higher to ISO 1000

Lets skip several and just double the last. ISO 2000

Add another 1200 and I top out at ISO 3200

Keep in mind... the ONLY thing I changed in all these images is the ISO setting. And yes... I know I need to clean the calcium buildup off the back of the tank LOL

 

[gemmy]

Thanks! I can see how more light is added when the ISO gets higher and the image gets darker when you go lower. I think I am getting it.

 

[southern wolf]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gemmy http:///t/391680/photography-school/60#post_3476618
Thanks! I can see how more light is added when the ISO gets higher and the image gets darker when you go lower. I think I am getting it.
sweet... My goal is to get anyone better at taking photos that wants to get better. I also plan on doing a couple of write ups to show folks some of my tips and tricks.

 

[geoj]

Nice, If you where looking to buy a camera how would you know that,the camera could take shots at the higher ISO without pixelizing? Play with it in the store? :%%:

 

[southern wolf]

Quote:
Originally Posted by GeoJ http:///t/391680/photography-school/60#post_3476685
Nice, If you where looking to buy a camera how would you know that,the camera could take shots at the higher ISO without pixelizing? Play with it in the store?

Best way is go to the manufacturers website and check out the stats. Chances are the cameras at the store wont have a memory card in them and most wont snap a photo without it. With my D90 I try not to go above ISO 1000 and even then I have the noise filter enabled in the menu. If you're wanting insainly high ISO then you're going to pay thousands just for the camera body.
This is another reason I love shooting in RAW. With the digital negative... if you're a little bit dark you can use the exposure slider while processing and add some more light into your image.

 

[southern wolf]

Ok... another lesson in DOF.
I took this image this morning in my gardens.

Shutter was 1/500, Aperture f/10, ISO 1600
And as I type this... I realize I didn't reset my ISO from shooting the tanks the other night. wooops
Anyhow... it was overcast this morning and that is the only reason this photo isn't blown all out because of the high ISO.
You'll notice that the moth is in good focus, but the blade of grass that runs from the left bottom towards the right top is not. That is because of my f/10 aperture.
In my opinion... that adds to the image whereas if it was in focus then you're eye would gravitate towards it instead of the moth.
However photography can be subjective depending on who is viewing it. That is the beauty of photography. You shoot for you and what makes you happy and then let others interpret your work.
So my question is this. IF I wanted that blade of grass in focus what would I set my aperture at?
f/5.6 or f/16 (keep in mind these are hypothetical settings... but they will be getting you closer to your goal)

 

[novahobbies]

I would.....increase the f-stop to f/16.....a narrower aperture increases the depth of field, while a wide open aperture (Low f-stop) would narrow the DOF to a very small range.
Since you're increasing the f-stop, am I correct in assuming you might want to bump ISO up as well to allow for the light lost? Or change shutter speed...but you're photographing a bug (moves a lot) on a piece of grass (also moves a lot), so shutter speed should most likely stay high, yes?
This thread has been VERY informative. I only have a PAS Nikkon Coolpix and of course my camera phone, but it's still good info to know! Thanks!

 

[southern wolf]

Quote:
Originally Posted by novahobbies http:///t/391680/photography-school/60#post_3476779
I would.....increase the f-stop to f/16.....a narrower aperture increases the depth of field, while a wide open aperture (Low f-stop) would narrow the DOF to a very small range.
Since you're increasing the f-stop, am I correct in assuming you might want to bump ISO up as well to allow for the light lost? Or change shutter speed...but you're photographing a bug (moves a lot) on a piece of grass (also moves a lot), so shutter speed should most likely stay high, yes?
This thread has been VERY informative. I only have a PAS Nikkon Coolpix and of course my camera phone, but it's still good info to know! Thanks!
You would be correct. In order to increase the DOF you'd need to stop down your lens (or choose a higher f/stop number)
Considering I messed up and already had my ISO at 1600 (because I forgot to reset it after shooting the fishtanks at night) I wouldn't raise it any higher. So that only leaves me two options. Add light via a flash or slow down the shutter speed. Since it was at 1/500 I could slow it down a bit. Unless butterflies and moths are in flight they have pretty slow movements and I could have easily slowed down the shutter to 1/200 to compensate for the narrower aperture.
Bonus Tip: When you're shooting using a flash the highest shutter speed available is 1/200
One thing the image doesn't show is the fact that the grass wasn't moving at all. There was no wind to speak of therefore it would make it even easier to slow the shutter speed down. The whole time I was photographing my gardens (and the moth) he never moved from his location.
I know some folks have asked me about lenses. That moth was photographed with my Tamron 28/300 macro lens.

 

[southern wolf]

I took this image this morning after the rain stopped.

Shutter 1/400, Aperture f/6.3, ISO 400
The reason I wanted to show this photo was for it's DOF and focus issues.
Of course my main target was the bug on the clover leaf. I wanted the clover under him to be out of focus and blurred (like it is). Basically I wanted a soft green to kinda frame the bug.
Aside from the bug.. there is two other areas that jump out at me. If I was to publish this image then I would have to take care of them. You'll notice on the clover in the lower left corner there is some rain drops that are in somewhat focus (those are fine). Well those two white blobs along the center plane are also water drops. That is what happens when you don't get water drops in focus. They just become a white blob that detracts from your image.
This is a drawback to a shallow DOF when the surrounding area is wet and the sun is out.

 

[novahobbies]

No problem man. Gotcha covered.

How's THAT for one of the crappiest PS jobs I've ever done? Still easy to see the healing brush.
What would you have done to reduce the blurred droplets in-frame, but still kept your narrow depth of field?

 

[southern wolf]

Aside from changing the physical location of the camera... I don't know of anything else to do. If you bring them more in focus you loose your DOF. In a scenerio like that... if possible... I would just clone them out of the image if I planned on printing or publishing it.