So. Who are you voting for?

[darthtang aw]

Correct chapter 11. For a moment I allowed personal feeling to cloud my thoughts. However one can argue they were bad investments to begin with. Using bonds at a 13% interest rate can be argued as a recipe for financial loss. His fourth bankruptcy, casinos closed. People lost jobs. Regardless if he was around for the closing his actions helped lead to it.

But let's talk about his promises he has given.

Your explanation of how to get the wall built is not his explanation. His explanation will raise cost of consumer if Mexico does not agree to pay for a wall taller than the Great Wall of china.


He wants to end birthright citizenship.
Pretty sure the constitution prevents that. So a constitutional amendment will be needed. Name the last sitting president to get a constitutional amendment passed. Especially in this political atmosphere.

Triple us customs and immigration officers. Funding for that comes from where?

Deport 11 million immigrants in the country. Funding come from where?

Death penalty for killing a police officer. Pretty sure state rights for penal code statutes trump Trump on this one.

Allow conceal carry permits in all 50 states. Pretty states rights is the issue again. Constitution only covers ownership.

Cut the budget by 20%. Yet also save SS, MEDICARE, and Medicaid without raising rates on anyone.
How?

Impose an import tax of 35%. How do you do this with out raising the cost of goods by the same amount?


Let's start with that. I have many more.

 

[2quills]

Correct chapter 11. For a moment I allowed personal feeling to cloud my thoughts. However one can argue they were bad investments to begin with. Using bonds at a 13% interest rate can be argued as a recipe for financial loss. His fourth bankruptcy, casinos closed. People lost jobs. Regardless if he was around for the closing his actions helped lead to it.

But let's talk about his promises he has given.

Your explanation of how to get the wall built is not his explanation. His explanation will raise cost of consumer if Mexico does not agree to pay for a wall taller than the Great Wall of china.


He wants to end birthright citizenship.
Pretty sure the constitution prevents that. So a constitutional amendment will be needed. Name the last sitting president to get a constitutional amendment passed. Especially in this political atmosphere.

Triple us customs and immigration officers. Funding for that comes from where?

Deport 11 million immigrants in the country. Funding come from where?

Death penalty for killing a police officer. Pretty sure state rights for penal code statutes trump Trump on this one.

Allow conceal carry permits in all 50 states. Pretty states rights is the issue again. Constitution only covers ownership.

Cut the budget by 20%. Yet also save SS, MEDICARE, and Medicaid without raising rates on anyone.
How?

Impose an import tax of 35%. How do you do this with out raising the cost of goods by the same amount?


Let's start with that. I have many more.

How did it all of a sudden become my job to convince you lol?

True on the 4th bankruptcy. People lost jobs. A casino in Atlantic City in the middle of a recession it didn't fair well. But he satisfied his investors by forfeiting his share and he got out before it tanked. Casinos property is high risk to begin with. I'm sure those investors knew that before they took the deal.

I don't think people care if we build one big wall. If we simply reinforce what we have, add some more agents, bring in some new technology and maybe a small fleet of drones to keep constant survailance over the desolate areas it would make a huge difference.

Think about all the military equipment we've given people in the middle east that ended up in the hands of extremists. If we took a fraction of that and simply reinforced our borders we could have our hypothetical wall. The funding would come from other budget cuts I'm sure that would work in conjuction with his other economic plans.

Don't need a constitutional amendment on birthrights. Just need one court case that clearly defines who gets birth right citizenship. The only two cases on the books now defined rights to specific peoples, such as native Americans and the Chinese imagrants who were used on the rail roads that were technically here legaly.

11 million illegals deported under Clinton, 10 million under Bush. How much more difficult and expensive do you think it needs to be to get this done?

Federal Death penalty? There are already many ways for the feds to intervene in state cases and try people in federal court. There's also federal death penalty already. All they'd have to do is classify it as a hate crime or something crazy like that then boom, feds step in and take over. If he had support from congress consider it done.

I think what he's suggesting is that concealed carry permits to work like a drivers liscense. Meaning you should be able to use it when you travel. There's an argument there that the constitution guarantees the rights of law biding citizens and is there to prevent states from being able to take that right away from us. I'd be interested in seeing how that would play out as well.

There's tremendous bloat in government. His cuts seem to be aimed mostly at regulatory agencies and ineffective programs. But the cuts need to be considered in a two pronged approach with his economic plans. Some of which come from reducing taxes for business to bring companies back and re patriot as much of the trillions of American companies monies sitting off shore as much as possible.

The tax on import is probably a tricky one. I know he's talked about it a bunch of times. But surely it would cause some hiccups in prices on the shelves.

 

[bang guy]

Impose an import tax of 35%. How do you do this with out raising the cost of goods by the same amount?

That's the idea. Make imports more expensive than domestic. There are a lot, I mean LOT, of unintended negative consequences to this but it does make domestic products more attractive to the consumer.

 

[darthtang aw]

While it makes domestic products more attractive it puts a significant burden on the population. The quality of life needle will be pushed backwards.

Right now there is discussion of a 10 dollar per barrel of oil tax increase. Conservatives are up in arms over this as are many others. The average family under 50 thousand a year pays 26% of their income for fossil fuels.

The majority of our foods, especially heathy things like fruits and vegetables are imported. What does this do for the average citizen? It increases their average grocery bill. Or they begin eating less healthy and suffer medical issues causes higher costs for insurance.

This type of tax for imports sounds like a decent idea to encourage job creation locally and increase US dollar sales. However if one follows the most likely chain reaction we have have increased costs in many other areas due to this one tax. Maybe not right away. But eventually.

 

[2quills]

Ideas like that should probably be phased in over time.

I think the bigger question is how much longer can we go on continuing not to do something like that? The longer we wait the worse it gets.

 

[darthtang aw]

There is tipping point of when things can be done and when things that get done make them worse. We surpassed that line mid 60's to 70's.

Can you state any legislation of the last twenty years that have made a significant difference for the better without making other things worse? Everyone has the idea we need to do something. Why?

 

[2quills]

There is tipping point of when things can be done and when things that get done make them worse. We surpassed that line mid 60's to 70's.

Can you state any legislation of the last twenty years that have made a significant difference for the better without making other things worse? Everyone has the idea we need to do something. Why?

Of course not. Which is why I'd like to see it get back to the conservative principles that were instrumental in building this nation in the first place.

If we do nothing then we've already failed. How many times did it take Edison to figure out the light bulb?

Take a hard look at Denmark. That's the mythical model that Sanders wants us to be like. But study it and take a hard look at what's happening over there now. Try and get an understanding of why they are having to slash benefits. See what's happening to their economy and with their education system. This type of system certainly isn't sustainable.

If I ever here you say you'd vote for Hillary, or Sanders again your fired.

 

[darthtang aw]

Lol. Good point on sanders and Hilary.

I will touch on everything else later.

 

[beth]

 

[2quills]

Priceless lol

See even the people of westoros needed a wall to protect themselves from white walkers and wildlings.

 

[beaslbob]

I respectfully suggest that all who want to impose import taxes or tariffs study and study hard the great depression. Specifically the smoot-Hawley bill and how it created the world wide recession out of what had been up to that point just a recession.

If we do nothing trade wise and I mean absolutely nothing, our dollars will flow to China, change the exchange rate making our labor cheaper in china and china labor more expensive in the US.

All with absolutely nothing done.

 

[2quills]

I respectfully suggest that all who want to impose import taxes of tariffs study and study hard the great depression. Specifically the smoot-Hawley bill and how it created the world wide recession out of what had been up to that point just a recession.

If we do nothing trade wise and I mean absolutely nothing, our dollars will flow to China, change the exchange rate making our labor cheaper in china and china labor more expensive in the US.

All with absolutely nothing done.

That would be great if it weren't for China selling their own currency in the foreign currency echange, devaluing their own dollar and thus preventing that from happening.

Free trade only works if it's fair trade.

 

[bang guy]

Free trade only works if it's fair trade.

Amen

 

[beaslbob]

That would be great if it weren't for China selling their own currency in the foreign currency echange, devaluing their own dollar and thus preventing that from happening.

Free trade only works if it's fair trade.

Let's see.

Fair--that's where we win
unfair that's when they win. LOL
constant devaluating currency still down not prevent the flow of US dollars and therefore is a loosing proposition. You can pass laws but never repeal the law of supply and demand. And our currency will continue to increase the cost of china labor and lower the cost of US labor.
especially when we pay off all that debt to china and really flood china with us dollars.

 

[2quills]

Let's see.

Fair--that's where we win
unfair that's when they win. LOL
constant devaluating currency still down not prevent the flow of US dollars and therefore is a loosing proposition. You can pass laws but never repeal the law of supply and demand. And our currency will continue to increase the cost of china labor and lower the cost of US labor.
especially when we pay off all that debt to china and really flood china with us dollars.

China, is already one step ahead on that. They're on the cusp of a robot revolution to take over the vast majority of "cheap labor" manufacturing jobs.

They're investing big dollars to make sure manufacturing remains cheap.

 

[beaslbob]

China, is already one step ahead on that. They're on the cusp of a robot revolution to take over the vast majority of "cheap labor" manufacturing jobs.

They're investing big dollars to make sure manufacturing remains cheap.

and yet all that cannot overrule market forces and make their labor more and more expensive.

 

[2quills]

and yet all that cannot overrule market forces and make their labor more and more expensive.

I'm not terribly sure I'm following.

Are you saying you think it's best to do nothing and wait for the market to bounce back in our favor?

Because even though wages in China have gone up, labor remains much cheaper than just about everywhere else. With the exemption of foreign investors such as ourselves already seeking cheaper countries to do business with outside of china. Companies like Nike, and such that make shoes, clothes etc.

 

[beaslbob]

I'm not terribly sure I'm following.

Are you saying you think it's best to do nothing and wait for the market to bounce back in our favor?

Because even though wages in China have gone up, labor remains much cheaper than just about everywhere else. With the exemption of foreign investors such as ourselves already seeking cheaper countries to do business with outside of china. Companies like Nike, and such that make shoes, clothes etc.

Yes.
Chinese wages will continue to rise in US dollars until the trade balances out.

We heard this about Japan back in my day. Yet today Japan has had 2 flat decades because the wages are more expensive.

and today US wages are cheaper then 13-14 industrialized countries even thou the actual wages of increased in the US.

Meanwhile Hyundai, Mercedes, Honda, Toyota build 8-9 million cars in Alabama because it is less expensive.

I suggest you study the great depression and smoot-Hawley.

I would rather see free market trade policies then socialists who reject free markets attempting to control the "evil foreigners" To increase their power.

 

[darthtang aw]

Amen

 

[2quills]

That's great guys. But unfortunately every other nations hits us pretty hard with terrifs as it is. While we play mister nice guy and just sit back and take it.

It would be great if we truly had a free market world but that just doesn't seem to be the case.

Why should we continue to roll over and take it while everyone else does it to us?