Soldier doubts eligibility, defies president's orders

reefraff

reefraff

Active Member

Originally Posted by bionicarm
http:///forum/post/2968619
I'm not 'rearranging' my argument, just interpreting the "Law Of The Land" correctly. Yes, I know where the statement is coming from. Look at the PUNCTUATION of that statement. There is a comma after both 'natural born citizen' AND 'citizen of the United States', which would imply EITHER are acceptable as conditions for being qualified to run for President. You seem to want to use this statement as a way to suit your argument. Do you realize that there's nowhere in the Constitution that clearly defines what a 'natural born citizen' is?
Ever look at Section 1 of the 14th Amendment?
Section 1. All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside. No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.
So AGAIN, since Obama was BORN in Hawaii, he is considered a Natural Born Citizen AND a Citizen of the United States.
So your conspiracy theory is that Obama wasn't actually BORN in Hawaii? As I stated, even if he was born in Kenya, since his mother was a LEGAL citizen of the US, he becomes one as well. The U.S. Code was created to clearly define what a 'natural born citizen' and a 'citizen of the US' is, since it isn't defined in the Constitution.
As long as his mother had been a resident in the US for at least one year (which I am sure she was) you are right.
What people should be putting their energy into is exposing Obama's lies and broken campaign promises. This is a non issue.
 
bionicarm

bionicarm

Active Member
Originally Posted by 1journeyman
http:///forum/post/2968821
in 2003 we were fighting Saddam's regime for refusing to live up to his side of the peace agreement he signed after the Gulf War.
After the insurgency began, until today, we are fighting the Global War on Terror here in Iraq.
Please don't get journey started on one of his "Why I love the Iraq War and how it's benefitting Americans" tirade. It's the same old song and dance everytime. I think he has the same phrases sitting in some text document that he can cut and paste into a thread anytime the subject comes up.
Well in 15 months your fight against the 'Global War on Terror' in Iraq will come to a screeching halt. I'm sure you'll shed some tears about losing your cash cow. Are you still in the running for the Australian Dream Job?
 
1journeyman

1journeyman

Active Member
Originally Posted by bionicarm
http:///forum/post/2968882
Please don't get journey started on one of his "Why I love the Iraq War and how it's benefitting Americans" tirade. It's the same old song and dance everytime. I think he has the same phrases sitting in some text document that he can cut and paste into a thread anytime the subject comes up.
Well in 15 months your fight against the 'Global War on Terror' in Iraq will come to a screeching halt. I'm sure you'll shed some tears about losing your cash cow. Are you still in the running for the Australian Dream Job?
My "cash cow" in Iraq is good for 2 more years.
How about yours? I'd guess the military won't need your IT guys to risk their lives in this theatre in 15 months.
If it seems I cut and paste it's because new people paste the same uninformed posts taken form liberal blogs concerning Iraq. I'm sorry if I can't make the truth more entertaining.
 
stevedave08

stevedave08

Member
Originally Posted by 1journeyman
http:///forum/post/2968752
Gee... cause they didn't already have a place to kill Americans called the United States of America.
19 terrorists killed 3,000 Americans on 9-11.
Thousands of Al Qaeda have been killed in iraq. Want to do the math on how many Americans could have died had the War on Terror been fought in Kansas?
WOW, that is the dumbest thing I have ever heard. Number one, look how long it took those terrorists to attack us. Getting into the country, pretending they were normal peace loving people, taking their flight lessons and then attacking. The war would not be fought here anyway, ever. Your thinking is so one sided and only to suit what you want to believe. Those thousands of Al-qaeda that were killed in iraq were most likely never ever in their lives going to have the opportunity to step foot in the U.S. What are they going to invade us? LMAO you're so full of it dude. The terrorists are cowards and attack in little ambushes or IED's. That's all they got. If we're not there, they can't kill us! Security is much tighter after 9/11 and it would be alot more difficult to pull off any attacks here. They have no means of getting here and would lack the means to propogate an attack here if they did get here. Are they going to check the RPG's as luggage?
 
1journeyman

1journeyman

Active Member
Originally Posted by SteveDave08
http:///forum/post/2968950
WOW, that is the dumbest thing I have ever heard. Number one, look how long it took those terrorists to attack us. Getting into the country, pretending they were normal peace loving people, taking their flight lessons and then attacking. The war would not be fought here anyway, ever. Your thinking is so one sided and only to suit what you want to believe. Those thousands of Al-qaeda that were killed in iraq were most likely never ever in their lives going to have the opportunity to step foot in the U.S. What are they going to invade us? LMAO you're so full of it dude. The terrorists are cowards and attack in little ambushes or IED's. That's all they got. If we're not there, they can't kill us! Security is much tighter after 9/11 and it would be alot more difficult to pull off any attacks here. They have no means of getting here and would lack the means to propogate an attack here if they did get here. Are they going to check the RPG's as luggage?
How do drugs get into this country? We have what, 20 million illegals here currently? Ya, our borders are flawless.

How long did the 9-11 attack take to plan?
Those "cowards" with their "little ambushes" and IEDs have killed several thousand of the world's finest military troops. Do you think flight attendants and first responders would fair better?
You say the War would never be fought in the USA. What are you basing that on? Look at Israel. How tight is their security? How small are their borders in relation to ours? Do terrorists ever manage a successful suicide bombing in Tel Aviv???
Terrorists don't need to smuggle RPGs into the country. They didn't on 9-11. And, as you will recall, Oklahoma City was hit by a homegrown bomb that was quite devastating...
You say my post is "dumb", yet all you offer is complete conjecture as to the fact that "terrorists could never get into the USA so we're safe". I ask again, how many illegals enter our country every day?
 
moprint

moprint

Member
Our borders are very lax. To say they need to smuggle RPGs in their luggage is absurd. The Oklahoma City bombing and the first World Trade Center bombing show that a bomb can be made with a little research. Timothy McVay(spl) was not the sharpest knife in the drawer, but look what he did. I agree fight them over there. It is called hit them before they hit us. If you think just cause you haven't heard about terrorists plans being stopped, doesn't mean it is not happening. So do we need to go back to a pre WWII mentality and not worry what is going on in the world. It didn't work then and it is not gonna work now.
 
bionicarm

bionicarm

Active Member
Originally Posted by 1journeyman
http:///forum/post/2968923
My "cash cow" in Iraq is good for 2 more years.
How about yours? I'd guess the military won't need your IT guys to risk their lives in this theatre in 15 months.
If it seems I cut and paste it's because new people paste the same uninformed posts taken form liberal blogs concerning Iraq. I'm sorry if I can't make the truth more entertaining.

My guys will either migrate to Afghanistan or Germany. They do Network Security, Intrusion Detection and Prevention, etc. Actually they aren't over there but for a couple of weeks at a time. Just long enough to 'fix the holes' and teach whoever needs to know how to keep from getting 'hit' the next time...
 
moprint

moprint

Member
By the way John McCain was born on a U.S.A. military base, Coco Solo Naval Air Station. Being born on a military base is just as good as being born in the states. His father and grandfather were both four star Admirals in the Navy. No question about who, what, where and when.
 
bionicarm

bionicarm

Active Member
Originally Posted by 1journeyman
http:///forum/post/2968965
How do drugs get into this country? We have what, 20 million illegals here currently? Ya, our borders are flawless.

How long did the 9-11 attack take to plan?
Those "cowards" with their "little ambushes" and IEDs have killed several thousand of the world's finest military troops. Do you think flight attendants and first responders would fair better?
You say the War would never be fought in the USA. What are you basing that on? Look at Israel. How tight is their security? How small are their borders in relation to ours? Do terrorists ever manage a successful suicide bombing in Tel Aviv???
Terrorists don't need to smuggle RPGs into the country. They didn't on 9-11. And, as you will recall, Oklahoma City was hit by a homegrown bomb that was quite devastating...
You say my post is "dumb", yet all you offer is complete conjecture as to the fact that "terrorists could never get into the USA so we're safe". I ask again, how many illegals enter our country every day?

The problem with your logic is the 'terrorists' you feel we should fight over there, aren't the one's we need to worry about. It's the one's that HAVE already infiltrated our borders that are hanging around waiting for the next orders are the one's you should be concerned with. You want to fight the 'Global War On Terror'? At least do it where it counts. Al-Qaeda operatives may have been in Iraq at some point in time, but the one's we should be concerned with have been sitting in Afghanistan or Pakistan even before we went in and took out Sadaam. Our troops have been fighting Shiites, Kurds, or whichever the one's that hate us over there. What to they have to do with terroristic attacks against the US? They just want their ideologies they believe in back, and don't want to follow the doctrines the US has helped implement after Sadaam was killed. I doubt any of those factions, regimes, tribes, whichever term you want to use, would even attempt to retaliate against us on our own soil. They're too busy trying to protect or get what was once theirs back.
 
veni vidi vici

veni vidi vici

Active Member

Originally Posted by bionicarm
http:///forum/post/2968619
I'm not 'rearranging' my argument, just interpreting the "Law Of The Land" correctly. Yes, I know where the statement is coming from. Look at the PUNCTUATION of that statement. There is a comma after both 'natural born citizen' AND 'citizen of the United States', which would imply EITHER are acceptable as conditions for being qualified to run for President. You seem to want to use this statement as a way to suit your argument. Do you realize that there's nowhere in the Constitution that clearly defines what a 'natural born citizen' is?
Ever look at Section 1 of the 14th Amendment?
Section 1. All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside. No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.
So AGAIN, since Obama was BORN in Hawaii, he is considered a Natural Born Citizen AND a Citizen of the United States.
So your conspiracy theory is that Obama wasn't actually BORN in Hawaii? As I stated, even if he was born in Kenya, since his mother was a LEGAL citizen of the US, he becomes one as well. The U.S. Code was created to clearly define what a 'natural born citizen' and a 'citizen of the US' is, since it isn't defined in the Constitution.
OK let me put it to you this way"Section 1 of the 14th Amendment" Does not apply to the seat of the Presidency.However it is stated clearly in Article 2, Section 1. of the US constitution that trumps any and all other laws not in line with .So if for the sake of argument Captain America was not born on US soil he cannot run for POTUS.Period ,end of story............
I cant say without doubt that Obama was born on US soil ,Their are to many voids and gray areas that could be put to bed if he would just comply and show proof other than a copy of a birth certificate.
I love my country but i dont trust my Government.
Originally Posted by bionicarm
http:///forum/post/2968619
Look at the PUNCTUATION of that statement. There is a comma after both 'natural born citizen' AND 'citizen of the United States', which would imply EITHER are acceptable as conditions for being qualified to run for President.
at the time of the adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the office of President;
"At the time of the adoption the constitution"
Key important words you are missing.
 
bionicarm

bionicarm

Active Member
Originally Posted by Veni Vidi Vici
http:///forum/post/2969060
OK let me put it to you this way"Section 1 of the 14th Amendment" Does not apply to the seat of the Presidency.However it is stated clearly in Article 2, Section 1. of the US constitution that trumps any and all other laws not in line with .So if for the sake of argument Captain America was not born on US soil he cannot run for POTUS.Period ,end of story............
I cant say without doubt that Obama was born on US soil ,Their are to many voids and gray areas that could be put to bed if he would just comply and show proof other than a copy of a birth certificate.
I love my country but i dont trust my Government.
I guess that's your interpretaion of the Constitution. Unfortunately, pretty much everyone who actually counts in the matter disagrees with you. The 14th Amendment helps clarify what a 'citizen of the US' is. Show me in the 2nd Amendment, or any other Amendment in the Constitution that clearly defines what a 'natural born citizen' is. McCain wasn't born on US soil. He was born in a military installation in the Panama Canal. So by your logic, he wasn't eligible either. Period, end of story...
 
socal57che

socal57che

Active Member
Originally Posted by bionicarm
http:///forum/post/2969064
I guess that's your interpretaion of the Constitution. Unfortunately, pretty much everyone who actually counts in the matter disagrees with you. The 14th Amendment helps clarify what a 'citizen of the US' is. Show me in the 2nd Amendment, or any other Amendment in the Constitution that clearly defines what a 'natural born citizen' is. McCain wasn't born on US soil. He was born in a military installation in the Panama Canal. So by your logic, he wasn't eligible either. Period, end of story...
http://faculty.maxwell.syr.edu/jying...nitiatives.htm
 
veni vidi vici

veni vidi vici

Active Member
Originally Posted by bionicarm
http:///forum/post/2969064
I guess that's your interpretaion of the Constitution. Unfortunately, pretty much everyone who actually counts in the matter disagrees with you. The 14th Amendment helps clarify what a 'citizen of the US' is. Show me in the 2nd Amendment, or any other Amendment in the Constitution that clearly defines what a 'natural born citizen' is. McCain wasn't born on US soil. He was born in a military installation in the Panama Canal. So by your logic, he wasn't eligible either. Period, end of story...
If this zone was military installation and had status like one of our Embassy's (Sovereign US territory) then yes if not no.If John McCain was President and this argument came to be, I would feel the same way.It is clearly stated what the qualification is to run for the office of POTUS.
 
moprint

moprint

Member
It was a military installation, so there fore it was Sovereign US territory. So no argument about McCain unless you are just so full of kool-aid you can't see.
 
veni vidi vici

veni vidi vici

Active Member

Originally Posted by socal57che
http:///forum/post/2969073
http://faculty.maxwell.syr.edu/jying...nitiatives.htm
Status:
Occurred: IntroducedJul 10, 2003
Occurred: Referred to CommitteeView Committee Assignments
Not Yet Occurred: Reported by Committee(did not occur)
Not Yet Occurred: Voted on in Senate(did not occur)
Not Yet Occurred: Voted on in House(did not occur)
So basicly it is dead in the water since 2003 and that means
If you werent born on US soil you CANNOT be POTUS
 
socal57che

socal57che

Active Member

Originally Posted by Veni Vidi Vici
http:///forum/post/2969088
Status:
Occurred: IntroducedJul 10, 2003
Occurred: Referred to CommitteeView Committee Assignments
Not Yet Occurred: Reported by Committee(did not occur)
Not Yet Occurred: Voted on in Senate(did not occur)
Not Yet Occurred: Voted on in House(did not occur)
So basicly it is dead in the water since 2003 and that means
If you werent born on US soil you CANNOT be POTUS
I just posted the link to show the guy the difference between NATURALIZED and NATURAL BORN. Obummer is not the first one to deal with it. There is a difference. God knows why, but there is a difference. I would vote for Henry Kissinger in a heartbeat.
 
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