cowfishrule
Active Member
vent cleanly...
this is a good thread and i would hate to see it closed....
this is a good thread and i would hate to see it closed....
whats wrong w/ america?!
- Thread starter sharkboy13
- Start date
darthtang aw
Active Member
Ok, time for the "chime" that Tizzo missed in the past. Here it is.
Everyone has a lot of good arguments about the illegal immigration. However If we automatically deported all of them or didn't figure out a way to keep them our economy would crash. Here is why. Our Unemployment rate is as low as it ever was during the Clinton administration which is the lowest in history if memory serves correctly. The service industry has had a huge boom, this is primarily where many illegals serve. To not figure a way to keep them would cause your restaurants and other service industries to fail as they have to find a way to fully employ their business.
Now, if we could slow down the abortion rate in this country we wouldn't need immigrant workers. But that is not going to happen. So we have forced our country to rely on them. Period, point blank. We do not have the man power in this country to sustain every employer. It is simple numbers.
Further proof that this will not hinder the economy is back in the 1980's Reagan's administration did the same thing. It actually helped boost the economy and the government was able to increase it's budget through the new Tax influx and income.
While I disagree with the way they are doing it, I see no other choice but to find a way to keep them. However I would also require a military service of minimum 4 years be required from one member of each family wanting to stay in the country. This is coming from a conservative as well...so don't get confused thinking I am some liberal defending their right to come here illegally.....I totally disagree with that.
Everyone has a lot of good arguments about the illegal immigration. However If we automatically deported all of them or didn't figure out a way to keep them our economy would crash. Here is why. Our Unemployment rate is as low as it ever was during the Clinton administration which is the lowest in history if memory serves correctly. The service industry has had a huge boom, this is primarily where many illegals serve. To not figure a way to keep them would cause your restaurants and other service industries to fail as they have to find a way to fully employ their business.
Now, if we could slow down the abortion rate in this country we wouldn't need immigrant workers. But that is not going to happen. So we have forced our country to rely on them. Period, point blank. We do not have the man power in this country to sustain every employer. It is simple numbers.
Further proof that this will not hinder the economy is back in the 1980's Reagan's administration did the same thing. It actually helped boost the economy and the government was able to increase it's budget through the new Tax influx and income.
While I disagree with the way they are doing it, I see no other choice but to find a way to keep them. However I would also require a military service of minimum 4 years be required from one member of each family wanting to stay in the country. This is coming from a conservative as well...so don't get confused thinking I am some liberal defending their right to come here illegally.....I totally disagree with that.
triga22
Active Member
I dont think America is bad for this. I think we should stop using money on other countries and help out our own first. There are homeless people here and we are 7 trillion in debt. We should leave other alone untill we are stable. To start off build a wall across the border.
pontius
Active Member
Originally Posted by Darthtang AW
Ok, time for the "chime" that Tizzo missed in the past. Here it is.
Everyone has a lot of good arguments about the illegal immigration. However If we automatically deported all of them or didn't figure out a way to keep them our economy would crash. Here is why. Our Unemployment rate is as low as it ever was during the Clinton administration which is the lowest in history if memory serves correctly. The service industry has had a huge boom, this is primarily where many illegals serve. To not figure a way to keep them would cause your restaurants and other service industries to fail as they have to find a way to fully employ their business.
Now, if we could slow down the abortion rate in this country we wouldn't need immigrant workers. But that is not going to happen. So we have forced our country to rely on them. Period, point blank. We do not have the man power in this country to sustain every employer. It is simple numbers.
Further proof that this will not hinder the economy is back in the 1980's Reagan's administration did the same thing. It actually helped boost the economy and the government was able to increase it's budget through the new Tax influx and income.
While I disagree with the way they are doing it, I see no other choice but to find a way to keep them. However I would also require a military service of minimum 4 years be required from one member of each family wanting to stay in the country. This is coming from a conservative as well...so don't get confused thinking I am some liberal defending their right to come here illegally.....I totally disagree with that.
finding employees for a business is competitive and is usually based on what the employer pays. if the employer cannot pay a legal worker a wage that will make the worker want to stay at that job, that employer does not need to be in business. the economy is NOT going to collapse if there is no illegal alien washing dishes at Applebees or picking oranges in Florida. it is a fact that illegal aliens pay approximately $1 in taxes for every $3 that they cost in healthcare, education, and social services. the baby boom generation is going to be retiring very soon, and when the last baby boomer retires, there will be 1 worker for every 2 retirees. if you couple that cost with the millions who are paying little or no taxes, it is a recipe for an absolute disaster from which this country will never recover.
I don't care if stopping illegals from coming here will cause the price of carrots to skyrocket. I can choose whether or not I buy carrots. and the economy isn't controlled by carrots. but I have no choice on whether or not I pay taxes. there needs to be, or is going to be, a middle class revolt if the people will wake up.
this economy does NOT depend on illegal immigrants. I agree that you can't feasibly round up 15 million people and send them back, but you also can't just give them blanket amnesty, which is what this newest bill basically is. and you also can't let them continue to stroll into the country unchecked, which is what Bush and his cronies want. this new bill will not be enforced, just like the 1986 law was not enforced.
Ok, time for the "chime" that Tizzo missed in the past. Here it is.
Everyone has a lot of good arguments about the illegal immigration. However If we automatically deported all of them or didn't figure out a way to keep them our economy would crash. Here is why. Our Unemployment rate is as low as it ever was during the Clinton administration which is the lowest in history if memory serves correctly. The service industry has had a huge boom, this is primarily where many illegals serve. To not figure a way to keep them would cause your restaurants and other service industries to fail as they have to find a way to fully employ their business.
Now, if we could slow down the abortion rate in this country we wouldn't need immigrant workers. But that is not going to happen. So we have forced our country to rely on them. Period, point blank. We do not have the man power in this country to sustain every employer. It is simple numbers.
Further proof that this will not hinder the economy is back in the 1980's Reagan's administration did the same thing. It actually helped boost the economy and the government was able to increase it's budget through the new Tax influx and income.
While I disagree with the way they are doing it, I see no other choice but to find a way to keep them. However I would also require a military service of minimum 4 years be required from one member of each family wanting to stay in the country. This is coming from a conservative as well...so don't get confused thinking I am some liberal defending their right to come here illegally.....I totally disagree with that.
finding employees for a business is competitive and is usually based on what the employer pays. if the employer cannot pay a legal worker a wage that will make the worker want to stay at that job, that employer does not need to be in business. the economy is NOT going to collapse if there is no illegal alien washing dishes at Applebees or picking oranges in Florida. it is a fact that illegal aliens pay approximately $1 in taxes for every $3 that they cost in healthcare, education, and social services. the baby boom generation is going to be retiring very soon, and when the last baby boomer retires, there will be 1 worker for every 2 retirees. if you couple that cost with the millions who are paying little or no taxes, it is a recipe for an absolute disaster from which this country will never recover.
I don't care if stopping illegals from coming here will cause the price of carrots to skyrocket. I can choose whether or not I buy carrots. and the economy isn't controlled by carrots. but I have no choice on whether or not I pay taxes. there needs to be, or is going to be, a middle class revolt if the people will wake up.
this economy does NOT depend on illegal immigrants. I agree that you can't feasibly round up 15 million people and send them back, but you also can't just give them blanket amnesty, which is what this newest bill basically is. and you also can't let them continue to stroll into the country unchecked, which is what Bush and his cronies want. this new bill will not be enforced, just like the 1986 law was not enforced.
nigerbang
Active Member
Originally Posted by Pontius
do you know the difference between LEGAL and ILLEGAL immigration? ILLEGAL immigration is a MAJOR PROBLEM in this country. I could list a lot of reasons why it's problem. it's apparent though that you are one of the many who wants to view opponents of ILLEGAL immigration as racist but probably can't come up with any good grounds to debate an issue on other than crying "racist racist". I like the "southern mentality" comment, have you ever set foot in a southern state? being in CA, I'd like to know how you propose to know "southern mentality"
Southern Mentality...
I have no problem with Immigrants who are willing to be Naturalized and are willing to pay taxes just as I and most working Americans do...I DO have a problem with those who take OUR money send it home so it can be spent elsewhere....Spending money in Mexico or anywhere else doesnt really help the American economy..Well atleast in GA it doesnt seem to make much sense..
do you know the difference between LEGAL and ILLEGAL immigration? ILLEGAL immigration is a MAJOR PROBLEM in this country. I could list a lot of reasons why it's problem. it's apparent though that you are one of the many who wants to view opponents of ILLEGAL immigration as racist but probably can't come up with any good grounds to debate an issue on other than crying "racist racist". I like the "southern mentality" comment, have you ever set foot in a southern state? being in CA, I'd like to know how you propose to know "southern mentality"
Southern Mentality...
I have no problem with Immigrants who are willing to be Naturalized and are willing to pay taxes just as I and most working Americans do...I DO have a problem with those who take OUR money send it home so it can be spent elsewhere....Spending money in Mexico or anywhere else doesnt really help the American economy..Well atleast in GA it doesnt seem to make much sense..
seasalt101
Active Member
ok my turn, if the larger cities and smaller one's too, would limit the welfare to minorities as they are the one's that collect most of it, to say 2 years unless disabled, and while on the systems dollars, get educated while daycare is provided(for the single mothers) the system could create enough workers, go down any ghetto and just see how many freeloaders/drug dealers/criminals are just hangin out doin nothing when they could get a job, but think the gangsta lifestyle is the way to go, harsher, much harsher prison sentences, public execution, and crimes that when commited the guilty is made an example out of instead of the neighborhood's local heroe, just my.02...tobin
triga22
Active Member
I agree. Half of the people on welfare dont deserve it. They would just deal drugs, commit crimes while they can get a job and work. We shouldnt be paying for these thugs to live here. They need to be shot or put in jail. I hate paying for the worthless people that could make a living or get a job instead of living off of my hard earned money, that I went to school and college for. Who is with me!
darthtang aw
Active Member
Originally Posted by Pontius
finding employees for a business is competitive and is usually based on what the employer pays. if the employer cannot pay a legal worker a wage that will make the worker want to stay at that job, that employer does not need to be in business. the economy is NOT going to collapse if there is no illegal alien washing dishes at Applebees or picking oranges in Florida. it is a fact that illegal aliens pay approximately $1 in taxes for every $3 that they cost in healthcare, education, and social services. the baby boom generation is going to be retiring very soon, and when the last baby boomer retires, there will be 1 worker for every 2 retirees. if you couple that cost with the millions who are paying little or no taxes, it is a recipe for an absolute disaster from which this country will never recover.
I don't care if stopping illegals from coming here will cause the price of carrots to skyrocket. I can choose whether or not I buy carrots. and the economy isn't controlled by carrots. but I have no choice on whether or not I pay taxes. there needs to be, or is going to be, a middle class revolt if the people will wake up.
this economy does NOT depend on illegal immigrants. I agree that you can't feasibly round up 15 million people and send them back, but you also can't just give them blanket amnesty, which is what this newest bill basically is. and you also can't let them continue to stroll into the country unchecked, which is what Bush and his cronies want. this new bill will not be enforced, just like the 1986 law was not enforced.
k, if we are at around 5% unemployement. There are guesstimat around 20 million illegals ( I firmly believe more) where do we find the U.S. citizens. I am not saying Illegal imigration is good, it is a bad thing and causes problems, 25% of our prisons in some states are illegals. But wherte do we find the warm bodies to fill the jobs, it isn't a matter of wages like many say, as a business owner and looking for employees myself it is a matter of having the people to do the work now
finding employees for a business is competitive and is usually based on what the employer pays. if the employer cannot pay a legal worker a wage that will make the worker want to stay at that job, that employer does not need to be in business. the economy is NOT going to collapse if there is no illegal alien washing dishes at Applebees or picking oranges in Florida. it is a fact that illegal aliens pay approximately $1 in taxes for every $3 that they cost in healthcare, education, and social services. the baby boom generation is going to be retiring very soon, and when the last baby boomer retires, there will be 1 worker for every 2 retirees. if you couple that cost with the millions who are paying little or no taxes, it is a recipe for an absolute disaster from which this country will never recover.
I don't care if stopping illegals from coming here will cause the price of carrots to skyrocket. I can choose whether or not I buy carrots. and the economy isn't controlled by carrots. but I have no choice on whether or not I pay taxes. there needs to be, or is going to be, a middle class revolt if the people will wake up.
this economy does NOT depend on illegal immigrants. I agree that you can't feasibly round up 15 million people and send them back, but you also can't just give them blanket amnesty, which is what this newest bill basically is. and you also can't let them continue to stroll into the country unchecked, which is what Bush and his cronies want. this new bill will not be enforced, just like the 1986 law was not enforced.
k, if we are at around 5% unemployement. There are guesstimat around 20 million illegals ( I firmly believe more) where do we find the U.S. citizens. I am not saying Illegal imigration is good, it is a bad thing and causes problems, 25% of our prisons in some states are illegals. But wherte do we find the warm bodies to fill the jobs, it isn't a matter of wages like many say, as a business owner and looking for employees myself it is a matter of having the people to do the work now
jennythebugg
Active Member
I have traveled all over this country and have seen the same desperation in a mothers eyes here as you see on the feed the children informercials,the same hungry children the same squallid living conditions ,shanties and lean to's in west virginia,whole families living under overpasses in atlanta, and families living in tents because they cannot afford a home, i am ashamed of americans that send hundreds and thousands each year overseas when our own brothers here at home are struggling to survive, and americans that adopt from overseas instead of right here in our own country where there are hundreds of thousands of american children living in foster care or on the streets because an american finds it 'easier or faster ' to adopt from another country,or because it is now so stylish to have their little 'rainbow tribe" as i've heard it called,I myself would never give to a charity that the money doesn't stay in the states i believe we need to solve our own problems before we run out and try to save the rest of the world , but thats just one girls opinion...bugg
seasalt101
Active Member
and for all the bush bashers, he was dealt a crappy hand with 9/11 clinton could have got bin laden but didn't because of political image, if the war were to end today, which is what the terrorist want, their would be another attack on this country in a short period of time, so what if the war is not popular here, what the hell kind of war was popular, i sure as hell would rather take it to them before another attack on this country happened again, and since the war has there been an attack on our country no, this means we are fighting the right enemy i don't like to hear about any americans losing there life in any war but they know the risk and all of the replies i have heard from the soldiers is they believe in what we are doing is right and they are on the front, and even the one's that get injured want to go back and finish the job, because theyknow what is really going on and the media downplays, and demoralises the citizens here with their doom and gloom agenda...tobin
1journeyman
Active Member
Originally Posted by jennythebugg
I have traveled all over this country and have seen the same desperation in a mothers eyes here as you see on the feed the children informercials,...
Then we have traveled to different parts of the world.... I've seen the poor in America. I've also seen the poor in Eastern Europe and South America.
Orphanages with no power? Mentally disabled children tied down in cribs? 6 year olds sleeping in filthy gutters on the side of the street? 85% unemployment rates with no government assistance? Families making their homes in the city dump?
The poor in America are in bad shape. It's sad to see Americans live like that. Don't compare them, however, to the poor of the rest of the world...
I have traveled all over this country and have seen the same desperation in a mothers eyes here as you see on the feed the children informercials,...
Then we have traveled to different parts of the world.... I've seen the poor in America. I've also seen the poor in Eastern Europe and South America.
Orphanages with no power? Mentally disabled children tied down in cribs? 6 year olds sleeping in filthy gutters on the side of the street? 85% unemployment rates with no government assistance? Families making their homes in the city dump?
The poor in America are in bad shape. It's sad to see Americans live like that. Don't compare them, however, to the poor of the rest of the world...
seasalt101
Active Member
barry bonds? man sports and global conflicts are worlds apart, no comparison at all, and the barry thing i'm a giants fan through and through, but being sick the last 2 years meaning basically i'm stuck at home hence no life i gotta have something...tobin
1journeyman
Active Member
Originally Posted by Beth
Someone start a topic about "What's right with America?"
Freedom. That will be at the top of the list of answers.
Amen. (and I hope that doesn't offend anyone who feels religious comments like "amen" should be removed from the public square...)
What's wrong with America is that we've forgotten what made our country great. What's wrong with America is that we have generations of folks who have no idea what "hard work" means. What's wrong with America is that we have a group of people who refuse to learn lessons from history and want to go back into "isolationism" mode. What's wrong with America is that we are surrounded by Americans who feel the government should hold their hands and take care of them.
Socialism doesn't work. Isolationism doesnt work. Having an open border doesn't work. Chanting the mantra "seperation of church and state" over and over with the hope it will somehow magically appear in the Constitution doesn't work.
Furthermore; Capitalism is a good thing. If you want to make something of yourself this Country provides you the greatest opportunity to do so.
Someone start a topic about "What's right with America?"
Freedom. That will be at the top of the list of answers.
Amen. (and I hope that doesn't offend anyone who feels religious comments like "amen" should be removed from the public square...)
What's wrong with America is that we've forgotten what made our country great. What's wrong with America is that we have generations of folks who have no idea what "hard work" means. What's wrong with America is that we have a group of people who refuse to learn lessons from history and want to go back into "isolationism" mode. What's wrong with America is that we are surrounded by Americans who feel the government should hold their hands and take care of them.
Socialism doesn't work. Isolationism doesnt work. Having an open border doesn't work. Chanting the mantra "seperation of church and state" over and over with the hope it will somehow magically appear in the Constitution doesn't work.
Furthermore; Capitalism is a good thing. If you want to make something of yourself this Country provides you the greatest opportunity to do so.
jennythebugg
Active Member
i was in no way saying that it was ok that the rest of the world was having problems ,but wouldn't our country be better suited to help the rest of the world if ours was in better condition itself first?
seasalt101
Active Member
reverse racism is another thing, let a white person try to start a television network called WITE to compete with BET or a whites only scholarship fund or have white history month, i am not racist but they want me to feel guilty about their history, not happening i did not do this, none of us have, i see it now as affirmative action, because of them attempting to force me to feel guilty for my great great great grandfathers life...tobin
seasalt101
Active Member
oh man i don't know what started this but another thing, the metric system, we don't even use it except in 2 litre cokes and, what's wrong with saying a 302 cubic in. engine i like to think my engine is bigger than 2 1/2 litres of coke...tobin
dr. evil
Member
Whats wrong with America? um were not perfect? So What who is. And i'm so sick of hearing the whining "we dont give enough" Bullcrap we give more than anyone and what do we get for it a slap in the face? and then were told how evil and greedy we are what a crock I for one am all for isolationism. Well not really but I am sick of hearing how much we suck from AT HOME and abroad especially from the people that live here they always get on thier soapbox and talk about how much this country sucks and when they are finished go and buy thier $8.00 cup of frickin coffee screw them. I say whats wrong with America hey we have our faults but I love my country,I love our military thank you God so much for our brave Men and women and thank God for America.
