Why we are losing the war in Iraq...

[groupergenius]

These debates are all so Hatfield and McCoy. The only way for anyone to change their perspective is to kick back, dump the propaganda, and actually think for themselves. Irregardless of what either side says, think of what YOU think is important. Shove party politics and media aside. We all know the situation, think about all the "absolute" facts and what brought them about. Consider for yourself what it would take to resolve the situation. Dump opinions of others and bring about your own. Then after a few days in sensory deprevation, come back to the table.

 

[rbaldino]

Originally Posted by Oceansidefish
Not that I am trying to bash or contradict but Pat Tillman's case has been brought up by the family relentlessly....It's only being reported on now because of the congressional investigation and the pushing of the coroner who did the autopsy to investigate. The media did not push this and still isn't. They really are just blurbing barely... While the media can be thanked for alot..they can't take the credit for this one.
And you think the media hasn't put pressure on elected officials and government agencies to find the truth? If it were just down to a few family members, they could be ignored quite easily.

 

[oceansidefish]

This has actually recieved little to no media attention as far as I have seen. From all accounts and reports I have heard it has been the hounding of the media by the family to get them to even question it. There are a few radio talk show hosts on it but thats about it. The biggest break in this was a soldier who gave a report on the incident and later found out his story had been changed by an unknown party... That's what I get for being a dork and watching CSPAN2 with like 12 other people in this country. It's intersting stuff and if you are looking for the facts there they are.
Oh and by the way I have a fun new CSPAN drinking game for all you other dorks. Watch all the hearings and for every "i dont recall" you have to do a shot!

 

[1journeyman]

Actually Ocean, I watch quite a bit of news and I've seen a lot of reporting on the Congressional Hearings including the censure and possible demotion of a 3 star General and Former Sec. of Defense Rumsfield testifying before Congress.
The reason you aren't seeing more of this story now is because the story came out months ago. The results now are from the Military's investigations.

 

[rbaldino]

Originally Posted by Oceansidefish
This has actually recieved little to no media attention as far as I have seen. From all accounts and reports I have heard it has been the hounding of the media by the family to get them to even question it. There are a few radio talk show hosts on it but thats about it. The biggest break in this was a soldier who gave a report on the incident and later found out his story had been changed by an unknown party... That's what I get for being a dork and watching CSPAN2 with like 12 other people in this country. It's intersting stuff and if you are looking for the facts there they are.
Oh and by the way I have a fun new CSPAN drinking game for all you other dorks. Watch all the hearings and for every "i dont recall" you have to do a shot!
Well, I suppose you just haven't watched the right channels, read the right magazines. Hell, they even reported it on ESPN.

 

[aztec reef]

Actually the news IS controled by the Goverment..You guys want to know the thruth? You can't handle the truth! We got to remember money is the root of ALL evil.
Rbaldino, you're just a journalist, you have resources right? guess what?your news resourcers have their resources and all media has to go through a process,before the public sees it..its like getting pieces of a puzzle..
" I have a question for you regarding Bin Laden. I know you feel we should be using more resources to find him and remove him. Something you may not know though is the following.....Bin Laden has not been officially charged with the attacks of 9/11. The FBI does not have enough evidence to convict him for this".
So that would mean that we really ARE at war for oil..?
How can Bin Laden be charged for anything if we haven't even seen dust of him? Yes we should DEMAND more resources for his capture..Otherwise why are we STILL at war? If the FBI doesn't have enuff evidence to "charge him" then what are we doing? better yet, what have we been doing? Was the main objective of this war to remove sadam and his regime? well we did that! Now what?
I think the Goverment spends their energy in the wrong ways.. They waste tons of money on nonsense, so it makes sense for the goverment to look for ways to recover the lost dollars..And yes the media is a PUPPET of the goverment, it must follow its rules..a.k.a.$POWER$.
If anything concrete leaks out to the media, it quickly gets ridiculed or some clowns makes up a story to try to debunk it..But thus why people aren't ready for the Truth..

 

[1journeyman]

Originally Posted by Aztec Reef
Actually the news IS controled by the Goverment..You guys want to know the thruth? You can't handle the truth! We got to remember money is the root of ALL evil....
Actually, the quote is "the love of money is the root of all evil..."
Of course Bin Ladin hasn't been charged... Who are you going to call for witnesses? Himself? His videos? The dead terrorists? I don't think Hitler was ever charged by the FBI either. Nor was Admiral Yamamoto.
Targetting Bin Laden is important. Having said that; We didn't get Hitler, or Mussolini, or Emperor Hirohito and we still won WWII (well, at least the Soviets won.) War is not a chess game, or a medieval tournament or a video game; it's real life. You win a war by wiping out the supplies, manpower, resources, and will of the enemy. Taking out the leadership is great in that it hinders the enemy, but it doesn't defeat them.
As for the "truth" Aztec... where do you get your's from? The Mothership?

 

[rbaldino]

Originally Posted by Aztec Reef
Actually the news IS controled by the Goverment..You guys want to know the thruth? You can't handle the truth! We got to remember money is the root of ALL evil.
Rbaldino, you're just a journalist, you have resources right? guess what?your news resourcers have their resources and all media has to go through a process,before the public sees it..its like getting pieces of a puzzle.
Seriously, you have no idea how the media works, and you just shouldn't comment on it at all. I suggest you watch All The President's Men and The China Syndrome to get an idea of how reporting works, and the lengths to which reporters will go to get a story.
For everyone who thinks the government is controlling the media - How does that theory jibe with the fact that most of the news out of Iraq is pretty negative? Most reporting on anything is fairly negative. I've heard from friends who have served in the region that they feel the media ignores a lot of the positive stories. You know why? Not because the government is telling them to, but because bad news sells. The media isn't controlled by the government, they're controlled by the almighty dollar and the need to generate a profit in an increasingly competitive industry.

 

[rbaldino]

Originally Posted by 1journeyman
As for the "truth" Aztec... where do you get your's from? The Mothership?

Classic.

 

[1journeyman]

Originally Posted by rbaldino

Classic.
I enjoy Aztec's perspective, even though I disagree with about 99.999999999% of what he says. His theories on aliens definitely amuse me.

 

[groupergenius]

Wow, I tried to make a profound deep thought statement on how we should approach the thought process and the ancient south american guy friggin blew it out of the water.
Sorry to flame, but that was some craaaazzyyyy idealism.

Government controls media???? Duh de duh....

 

[oceansidefish]

Originally Posted by 1journeyman
Actually Ocean, I watch quite a bit of news and I've seen a lot of reporting on the Congressional Hearings including the censure and possible demotion of a 3 star General and Former Sec. of Defense Rumsfield testifying before Congress.
The reason you aren't seeing more of this story now is because the story came out months ago. The results now are from the Military's investigations.
I agree that lately ie the last few days it has been being reported...But this yes has been going on for months with talk in other outlets than the media. I am glad it is finally being brought to light. I just really wish someone would stand up and tell the truth is all. If friendly fire is the truth then lets hear it. It would not be the first docummented time a soldier has been taken out by friendly fire. Hell I believe if my memory serves me correct the first casualty from desert storm was friendly fire from an aircraft. Accidental in nature of course but friendly fire all the same (may not have been THE first but one of I believe) If dinner wasn't in the oven I would verify.

 

[rbaldino]

Originally Posted by Oceansidefish
I agree that lately ie the last few days it has been being reported...But this yes has been going on for months with talk in other outlets than the media. I am glad it is finally being brought to light. I just really wish someone would stand up and tell the truth is all. If friendly fire is the truth then lets hear it. It would not be the first docummented time a soldier has been taken out by friendly fire. Hell I believe if my memory serves me correct the first casualty from desert storm was friendly fire from an aircraft. Accidental in nature of course but friendly fire all the same (may not have been THE first but one of I believe) If dinner wasn't in the oven I would verify.
Actually, I think I first heard that it might have been friendly fire a couple of years ago. It's certainly not something I've heard about just in the last couple of days. Like I said, ESPN has been covering the story since he was first killed.

 

[aztec reef]

Originally Posted by 1journeyman
Actually, the quote is "the love of money is the root of all evil..."
Of course Bin Ladin hasn't been charged... Who are you going to call for witnesses? Himself? His videos? The dead terrorists? I don't think Hitler was ever charged by the FBI either. Nor was Admiral Yamamoto.
Targetting Bin Laden is important. Having said that; We didn't get Hitler, or Mussolini, or Emperor Hirohito and we still won WWII (well, at least the Soviets won.) War is not a chess game, or a medieval tournament or a video game; it's real life. You win a war by wiping out the supplies, manpower, resources, and will of the enemy. Taking out the leadership is great in that it hinders the enemy, but it doesn't defeat them.
As for the "truth" Aztec... where do you get your's from? The Mothership?

How can you charge someone if you haven't caught him? Bin Laden has been wanted by the US way before 9/11 i don't see what the hold up is! are you getting him or NOT. How long does it take to stabelize Iraq/Afghanistan/Iran whatever..Was hitler caught by the FBI? Well, you have taken out major players.. so isn't that enuf or is there other ineterests out there. Or are you going to wait until Usama comes out of his cave? You guys know so much about the war and what goes on over there.. tell me what its keeping you????
Drown on this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F-HSHAdAnnM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GGqZOlj8Tv0
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IAryZUPbEOg

 

[jennythebugg]

im gonna just continue kicking back reading this one

lol

 

[aztec reef]

Originally Posted by rbaldino
Seriously, you have no idea how the media works, and you just shouldn't comment on it at all.
I suggest you watch this, maybe you'll learn something!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jG07K9eCaVw
Now, I wonder who pays ALL those people??
And when you're done, read this..http://www.sweetliberty.org/issues/s...ewishmedia.htm except they're wrong about JEWISH people, or should we say the Goverment is allowing it???
Now, the "media" NEVER talks about how many barrels of oil we're getting at the end??????or if we have already got some??? If they do report Anything about oil! do you think they will be Generous or Conservative when reporting quantity?

 

[rbaldino]

Originally Posted by Aztec Reef
I suggest you watch this, maybe you'll learn something!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jG07K9eCaVw
Now, I wonder who pays ALL those people??
And when you're done, read this..http://www.sweetliberty.org/issues/s...ewishmedia.htm except they're wrong about JEWISH people, or should we say the Goverment is allowing it???
Now, the "media" NEVER talks about how many barrels of oil we're getting at the end??????or if we have already got some??? If they do report Anything about oil! do you think they will be Generous or Conservative when reporting quantity?
Aztec, all I can say is that you should really crack a book, perhaps enroll in a college class or two, and stop trying to educate yourself with YouTube. As it is now, I feel like I'm beating up a disabled kid.

 

[jennythebugg]

omg!!!!!!burn

 

[reefraff]

Our government controls the media so well that:
The friendly fire in the Tillman case was reported
Prisoner abuse at Abu Garab was reported
Numerous aspects of intellegence gathering methods were printed in the Times DESPITE GOVERNMENT REQUESTS NOT TO.
Can you say Jack Abramoff?
---- Chenney,"Be vewy vewy qwiet, I'm haunting lawyers, Ha-ha-ha-ha"
The Valery Plame case, Hell the media for the most part still isn't reporting the truth on that because it shoots down the theory it was a White House conspiracy to out her.
The claim bush made in the state of the union speech that Iraq was seeking yellow cake from Niger. Another case of the media not reporting the truth because it actually makes the administration look better
AWOL
A few billion dollars missing in Iraq
And how bout the last administration? The blue stained dress, Ron Brown, Henry Cisnaros, Web Hubbel, TravelGate, Magically appearing Rose Law firm billing records, Waco, Ruby Ridge etc.
Yeah, the government sure controls the media

 

[darthtang aw]

I can't believe their are people out there that actually believe the media is controlled by the government......And people say public education is just fine the way it is............