Wrong information

florida joe

florida joe

Well-Known Member
There I go possibly giving out misinformation. any Sand may very well taste good with vinegar
if you add the very best EVOO you can buy
 
gooch

gooch

Member
Originally Posted by SnakeBlitz33
http:///forum/post/2934362
alright, alright, alright. I didn't want to go into the details because he was dead set on the play sand anyway. If it passes the vinegar test, it has some calcium in it. That does not mean that there aren't other substances in the water which will be harmful to "live aquariums." Just because it passes the vinegar test doesn't mean that it is 100% good.
Or, substances that will create large diatom blooms that will never go away...
Play sand is also much more finer grained then live sand or aragonite. This means that it will compact, almost becoming "cement like." It doesn't allow for some fish to dig holes, it doesn't allow for many microfauna to dig into it, and it does not allow (in my personal opinion) a good enough condition for bacteria to colonize. Also, it is stirred up way too easily, so if you have too much flow, you will constantly have a sand storm, or you water will never be completely clear of a white haze.
It's ultimately your choice to use it or not. I have used it on a couple of systems and it utterly failed. I have had a couple of people use it for their tanks, and it completely failed as well. I have heard of success stories, but they are far and few between.
Besides, I thought the original company of Southdown Play Sand went out of business and you couldn't find it anymore?
Thank you for the detailed response.
Southdown is still under operation under the parent company Old Castle. They still distribute under either the southdown-oldcastle name or even kolorscape but the bags tend to have the same design. The thing that did die with them was their access to "tropical" sand which came from the bahamas so now their sand is not tropical anymore, it is quarried from limestone.
From the oldcastle/southdown rep herself I got sent this info:
TECHNICAL DATA SHEET
WHITE PLAYSAND
SCREENED LIMESTONE
Product Codes
25030250# Bags
4201010.4 C.F.
8201250.5 C.F.
CHEMICAL ANALYSIS – (Typical)
Magnesium Carbonate (MgCO3) 1.0%
Calcium Carbonate (CaCO3)96.0%
PHYSICAL PROPERTIES – (Typical)
FINENESS
% Through No. 10 U.S. Standard Sieve 100%
% Through No. 20 U.S. Standard Sieve 56%
% Through No. 50 U.S. Standard Sieve 3%
% Through No. 100 U.S. Standard Sieve 1%
BULK DENSITY
SETTLED - # / FT395#/ft3
Specific Gravity 2.7
I am curious as to what the fineness of standard aragonite sand is compared to this.
I also wonder what were the brands of playsand that others have used as I wouldnt be suprised if there was a variation in size and fineness between different brands.
Having it muckup and turn to a cement like substance certainly would be something I would like to avoid. I wonder if that can be minimalized if it was offset with some live sand.. which is something I was planning on doing.
 
srfisher17

srfisher17

Active Member
All somewhat controversial; but (IMO & IME) all these are wrong:
1.)Nitrates (at, say 60ppm) hurt fish.
2.) "Nitrate factories"..ammonia/nitrite can't be eliminated without producing nitrate
3.) A new hobbiest must spend $500 on LR, or he can't have a healthy FOWLR tank.
4.) Nothing removes ammonia as well as LR. (ammonia is easy to control; nitrates are not.)
5.) copper is always dangerous and should be avoided at all costs.
6.) copper soaks into silicone sealant and leeches out at dangerous levels.
7.) Triggers & lions make great tankmates.
8.) A CUC is a vital part of any set-up
9) My favorite, and most controversial: everyone, everywhere needs RO/DI.
10) On a moral level, a moorish idol is more important than the tuna in my sandwich.
 
mantisman51

mantisman51

Active Member
I used argonite medium grain sand I have a horseshoe crab and several sand sifting crabs that get along quite well and my goby buries himself in it every night. I washed the sand out in 5 gal buckets, stirring the sand while I rinsed it out. First with boiling water to kill any bad bacteria and clean any petroleum products that might have dripped. Then I rised with a water hose until all the cloudiness was gone. I have tons of zoas, mushrooms and ricordea(just started) and they have easily quadrupled in size and territory since putting them in, in July. I can run my fingers through the sand and there is little to no dust. I added about 30 # of live sand to the 100# of argonite. Has anyone posting his stuff been to the coast of California or Oregon where argonite and granite are the primary shoreline rocks? I wouldn't even try to convince people to do what I did, but I will share that my experience has been great.
 
gooch

gooch

Member
Originally Posted by mantisman51
http:///forum/post/2934705
I used argonite medium grain sand I have a horseshoe crab and several sand sifting crabs that get along quite well and my goby buries himself in it every night. I washed the sand out in 5 gal buckets, stirring the sand while I rinsed it out. First with boiling water to kill any bad bacteria and clean any petroleum products that might have dripped. Then I rised with a water hose until all the cloudiness was gone. I have tons of zoas, mushrooms and ricordea(just started) and they have easily quadrupled in size and territory since putting them in, in July. I can run my fingers through the sand and there is little to no dust. I added about 30 # of live sand to the 100# of argonite. Has anyone posting his stuff been to the coast of California or Oregon where argonite and granite are the primary shoreline rocks? I wouldn't even try to convince people to do what I did, but I will share that my experience has been great.
I am confused, are you saying you used granite based sands along with your aragonite?
 
cleve_seahorse

cleve_seahorse

Member
Gooch;2934220 said:
what is the risk though? I am still trying to figure that out because I havent seen anything yet that says what could be harmful about calcium based playsand.[/QUO
Maybe the first layer playsand and cover it with live sand .....then you'll have a deeper sand bed and a small chance of silicates leaching into the water? Plus being alot cheaper than all live sand
Click to expand...
 
mantisman51

mantisman51

Active Member
No. Argonite mixed with some live sand. I am asking if argonite and granite are bad, why is there a plethora of life all along the coast? Shouldn't the shore be a brown, lifeless place? As I stated earlier, my experience does not reflect the experience of all aquarists and should be taken only as anecdotal evidence of one schlomo's venture into the unknown.
 
mantisman51

mantisman51

Active Member
I don't believe it has been hijacked, I have given enough wrong information to continue the thought. Please carry on.
 
srfisher17

srfisher17

Active Member
Originally Posted by mantisman51
http:///forum/post/2934815
I don't believe it has been hijacked, I have given enough wrong information to continue the thought. Please carry on.
Yeah, Joe has put a lot of effort inti this. Its appreciated, Joe. Here's another myth, IMO.
A good way to get info is to ask a question like' Has anyone ever successfully kept a clown trigger with a peppermint shrimp." Because some has done everything in this hobby; there will always be a yes answer. (Success is often defined as two weeks) If you are really looking for info; ask "Can I keep a CT with a PS"; then you'll get the opinions you need. If you're just trying to get support for doing something that defies all knowledge in the hobby (in other words, stupid); just go ahead and do it.
 
srfisher17

srfisher17

Active Member
Wrong (IMO): Assuming the size of the fish is about the same; carnivores create more waste, increasing the bio-load, than herbivores.
 
spanko

spanko

Active Member
because at the time I posted that at first the thread had evolved into a discussion on the use of play sand. Joe's original thread question had been hijacked.........
 
mantisman51

mantisman51

Active Member
Just trying to lighten the mood. You were right. It was headed to a sand discussion instead of a "wrong info" thread. I got sucked in. I tried to leave and they kept pulling me back in. On the original theme:I was told by the LFS that a two week cycle was plenty for a FO SW setup. Thankfully, I came here and read up first. Five weeks after starting the nitrates were below .50 and I started to add fish.
 
florida joe

florida joe

Well-Known Member
Originally Posted by spanko
http:///forum/post/2934861
because at the time I posted that at first the thread had evolved into a discussion on the use of play sand. Joe's original thread question had been hijacked.........
Thanks Henry for righting the ship, Mr. T keep on brining it
 
gypsana

gypsana

Active Member
The discrepancies on what how deep a deep sand bed really needs to be and the metal halide only attitude. It really gets old especially when people have had great success without them.
 
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