reefraff
Active Member
Originally Posted by bionicarm
http:///forum/post/2987789
46 PC §9.33. TEXAS CONCEALED HANDGUN LAWS
(B) to prevent the other's imminent commission of aggravated
kidnapping, murder, sexual assault, aggravated sexual assault,
robbery, or aggravated robbery.
(b) The requirement imposed by Subsection (a)(2) does not apply
to an actor who uses force against a person who is at the time of the
use of force committing an offense of unlawful entry in the habitation of
the actor.
PC §9.33. DEFENSE OF THIRD PERSON. A person is justified in
using force or deadly force against another to protect a third person if:
(1) under the circumstances as the actor reasonably believes
them to be, the actor would be justified under Section 9.31 or 9.32 in
using force or deadly force to protect himself against the unlawful force
or unlawful deadly force he reasonably believes to be threatening the
third person he seeks to protect; and
(2) the actor reasonably believes that his intervention is immediately
necessary to protect the third person.
PC §9.34. PROTECTION OF LIFE OR HEALTH. (a) A person is
justified in using force, but not deadly force, against another when and
to the degree he reasonably believes the force is immediately necessary
to prevent the other from committing suicide or inflicting serious
bodily injury to himself.
(b) A person is justified in using both force and deadly force against
another when and to the degree he reasonably believes the force or
deadly force is immediately necessary to preserve the other's life in an
emergency.
So in the scenario of stopping a r@pe, yes that would be justification to DRAW your weapon. However, what is the ruling for when you are allowed to use that weapon? Let's say you walk up on an attempted r@pe. You pull your gun and tell the guy to back off. If he stops attacking the girl, you can only hold him at bay until the authorities arrive. ONLY if he attempts to cause physical harm on YOU, do you have the right to shoot the individual using deadly force. You just can't shoot the guy because he was r@ping the girl. Now if he grabs the girl and puts a knife or gun to her head, and you draw your weapon and demand he releases her, under Section 9.33, subsection 2b, you do have the right to use deadly force to protect this third person.
What I'm saying about a scenario with a random shooter, is you have to be distinct in knowing that individual is directing physical harm on you or a third person before you are allowed to use deadly force. If you walk into a situation like this, you just can't draw your weapon and start firing at anyone whose holding or aiming a gun at someone. You have to be 100% positive that you need to use deadly force in order to preserve another life in this situation. You make the wrong decision, it's you that will face the murder charge. As stupid as it sounds, you have to give the assailant the opportunity to surrender before you use deadly force.
There are other Texas laws that allow for the use of deadly force to prevent property crimes. You can't just focus on the Concealed Carry law.
This story touches on that
http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcont...ck.6a8cbd.html
" Was the castle law designed to cover those circumstances?
No, said the law's author, state Sen. Jeff Wentworth, R-San Antonio.
"You're supposed to be able to defend your own home, your own family, in your house, your place of business or your motor vehicle," he said – but not your neighbor's.
But Mr. Edmonds said other property laws could provide a defense for Mr. Horn, whose case is under investigation.
"The laws governing the use of force to defend property instead of a person are very broad and very favorable to someone who wants to use that force," Mr. Edmonds said.
Chapter 9 of the Texas Penal Code describes deadly force as justified to prevent arson, robbery, theft or criminal mischief at night, or to prevent a suspect from fleeing if the property owner "reasonably believes the land or property cannot be protected or recovered by any other means; or the use of force other than deadly force to protect or recover the land or property would expose the actor or another to a substantial risk of death or serious bodily injury."
"You hear someone stealing something off your front porch. You come out there with a gun, and they're running off. It's nighttime. The law in Texas allows you to shoot them," said former Dallas County prosecutor Toby Shook"
http:///forum/post/2987789
46 PC §9.33. TEXAS CONCEALED HANDGUN LAWS
(B) to prevent the other's imminent commission of aggravated
kidnapping, murder, sexual assault, aggravated sexual assault,
robbery, or aggravated robbery.
(b) The requirement imposed by Subsection (a)(2) does not apply
to an actor who uses force against a person who is at the time of the
use of force committing an offense of unlawful entry in the habitation of
the actor.
PC §9.33. DEFENSE OF THIRD PERSON. A person is justified in
using force or deadly force against another to protect a third person if:
(1) under the circumstances as the actor reasonably believes
them to be, the actor would be justified under Section 9.31 or 9.32 in
using force or deadly force to protect himself against the unlawful force
or unlawful deadly force he reasonably believes to be threatening the
third person he seeks to protect; and
(2) the actor reasonably believes that his intervention is immediately
necessary to protect the third person.
PC §9.34. PROTECTION OF LIFE OR HEALTH. (a) A person is
justified in using force, but not deadly force, against another when and
to the degree he reasonably believes the force is immediately necessary
to prevent the other from committing suicide or inflicting serious
bodily injury to himself.
(b) A person is justified in using both force and deadly force against
another when and to the degree he reasonably believes the force or
deadly force is immediately necessary to preserve the other's life in an
emergency.
So in the scenario of stopping a r@pe, yes that would be justification to DRAW your weapon. However, what is the ruling for when you are allowed to use that weapon? Let's say you walk up on an attempted r@pe. You pull your gun and tell the guy to back off. If he stops attacking the girl, you can only hold him at bay until the authorities arrive. ONLY if he attempts to cause physical harm on YOU, do you have the right to shoot the individual using deadly force. You just can't shoot the guy because he was r@ping the girl. Now if he grabs the girl and puts a knife or gun to her head, and you draw your weapon and demand he releases her, under Section 9.33, subsection 2b, you do have the right to use deadly force to protect this third person.
What I'm saying about a scenario with a random shooter, is you have to be distinct in knowing that individual is directing physical harm on you or a third person before you are allowed to use deadly force. If you walk into a situation like this, you just can't draw your weapon and start firing at anyone whose holding or aiming a gun at someone. You have to be 100% positive that you need to use deadly force in order to preserve another life in this situation. You make the wrong decision, it's you that will face the murder charge. As stupid as it sounds, you have to give the assailant the opportunity to surrender before you use deadly force.
There are other Texas laws that allow for the use of deadly force to prevent property crimes. You can't just focus on the Concealed Carry law.
This story touches on that
http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcont...ck.6a8cbd.html
" Was the castle law designed to cover those circumstances?
No, said the law's author, state Sen. Jeff Wentworth, R-San Antonio.
"You're supposed to be able to defend your own home, your own family, in your house, your place of business or your motor vehicle," he said – but not your neighbor's.
But Mr. Edmonds said other property laws could provide a defense for Mr. Horn, whose case is under investigation.
"The laws governing the use of force to defend property instead of a person are very broad and very favorable to someone who wants to use that force," Mr. Edmonds said.
Chapter 9 of the Texas Penal Code describes deadly force as justified to prevent arson, robbery, theft or criminal mischief at night, or to prevent a suspect from fleeing if the property owner "reasonably believes the land or property cannot be protected or recovered by any other means; or the use of force other than deadly force to protect or recover the land or property would expose the actor or another to a substantial risk of death or serious bodily injury."
"You hear someone stealing something off your front porch. You come out there with a gun, and they're running off. It's nighttime. The law in Texas allows you to shoot them," said former Dallas County prosecutor Toby Shook"
