My first time in jail...

aw2x3

Active Member
...and it sucked.
About a week and a half ago, I had someone email me, interested in buying my pair of Cobras.
Back and forth, through email, I asked for proof of his permits, experiance, blah blah blah and a few days ago, we finally found a place to meet.
I show up, at 10am, to make the deal and everything is great. He showed up with a buddy and we talked for a while...snakes, the weather and whatever else.
As soon as he saw the Cobras, his buddy pulls out a cell and about 10 seconds later, Federal Conservation Officers are everywhere. Yes...I said Federal...not State.
The cop I talked to informed me what was going on, said I was in violation of the Illinois Injurous Animals Act and that I was NOT under arrest and that they were going to site me $100, confiscate my Cobras and just talk with me. Then, I'd be on my way, he said.
He said they were going to have to come back to my house, search it and verify there were no other venomous snakes and they'd be out of my hair.
I fully cooperated, even chit chatted with them, on the ride back to my house (Heather followed us, in her car, while I rode with two officers).
We get back to my house and before we walk in the door, more Federal boys show up. They were everywhere. I showed them the snakes I had, they took a written inventory, assured me nothing else would be confiscated and what not. They bummed cigarettes from me, I offered them something to drink, we laughed and talked and everything seemed just fine.
Then, they started asking me the name of my friend I got them from, where he lives, what his number was, how we got them, etc. I refused to narc and they weren't so nice anymore. It wasn't that I was afraid that my friend would get in trouble, because I know he wont, but I'm the type of person that won't sell someone else out. I don't want to cause trouble for other people, over some BS.
They searched my home, my computer, etc. and found my friends name and said that since I allowed them in the house, they didn't need a warrant, to search my computer.
Then, I was arrested...after they told me 15 times I wasn't going to be. Guys were in my snake room, alone and I was sure they packing stuff up and taking it but they didn't take anything else. They informed me that my 18' Burm was "a dangerous animal" but my 14' female and my 13' male wasn't and that I was going to have to get rid of Brutus...to which I replied..."Ummm...F off".
Heather and I both were booked into county jail and since she's from this area, she got bail quicker than I did. Plus, they were pretty much only after me. I sat in jail from 11am to 5pm and my mom had to drive 3.5 hours, to come bail me out.
Since they didn't find anymore venomous snakes, in my house (which is what they were looking for), they cited me for everything under the sun.
I'm being charged with:
1 count unlawful possession of an injurous animal (male albino Monocled Cobra)
1 count unlawful possession of an injurous animal (female albino Monocled Cobra)
1 count unlawful possession of an injurous animal (18' Burmese Python) - which is not illegal to own
1 count driving without insurance (because Heather couldn't find her insurance card)
1 count driving on a suspended license (which it isn't)
1 count unlawful possestion of a suspended license (because I had the actual license in my pocket)
The suspended license, insurance and unlawful possession of license will be dropped. I don't know what they're going to do about Brutus but I'm not giving him up. They didn't give two craps about my permits, for the Cobras, so I don't know how that's going to turn out.
My court date is the 22nd, of next month. I'm going to hire a lawyer...mainly, because I know how the judicial system works and I'm not a moron. I've been screwed one too many times.
What pisses me off the most is that the dude set me up, for this "sting operation". Almost 2 weeks of banter, back and forth. Him, being nice, talking about his wife and how much he loved snakes and this and that. I told them all if they would've just shown up, at my door or called me, I would've been just as cooperative and said "Here are the Cobras, where is my fine?"
$1100, in fines and bail. I'm also out the $1000 (aprox. what the Cobras were worth).
Sorry for the rant...I'm eating today, for the first time (8.13pm) and I'm considering not even eating...just going out and getting hammered drunk.
 

jaxfishgirl

Active Member
oh geez, that sucks. i could not even imagine. Are you going to try and get those ones taken off your record? The ones that are'nt true?
if you get hammered, take a taxi home. dont drive
 

veni vidi vici

Active Member
1. You have the right to remain silent.
2. Anything you say can and will be used against you in a court of law.
3. You have the right to an attorney.
4. If you cannot afford an attorney, one will be appointed for you.
Never ever,ever make a statement to law enforcement until you have a lawyer present!
Law enforcement dosent have the authority to make deals with you no matter what they say,and if you have broken any laws the are obligated to arrest you.
Remember this...."No Confession ,No Crime"
Bummer dude, I would be pissed that they B.S'ed their way right into your house without a warrant. Consent i would guess.
 

aw2x3

Active Member
Oh, I was thinking the same thing, because of how many times they told me I WASN'T under arrest.
Then, at the last minute, they slapped the cuffs on...and THEN, I had to remind them, that they had to read me my rights.
As soon as they did that, I clammed up.
 

veni vidi vici

Active Member
Originally Posted by AW2x3
http:///forum/post/3214643
Oh, I was thinking the same thing, because of how many times they told me I WASN'T under arrest.
Then, at the last minute, they slapped the cuffs on...and THEN, I had to remind them, that they had to read me my rights.
As soon as they did that, I clammed up.
As soon as the badge came out...Zippppppp
Bummer.
Here is some info that you may find comforting though,they are going to always throw as many charges at you as possible for a couple of reasons.
1. And the obvious is because you are being acused of breaking them
2.Its easier to get you to agree to a plea bargain and thus a conviction.
or
3. something most likely will stick.
If none of your charges are felonies I wouldn't worry, just bring your checkbook.
Maybe a illegal entrapment dismissal.
 

lovethesea

Active Member
holy carps.
Get a good lawyer (speciality in those laws) AND start hitting up your other professionals who handle these animals and know the laws. So did they take Brutus and the cobras? You KNOW I hat....um don't care for snakes..but I also don't like animals in the wrong hands. Its funny that they didn't mention your care/handling/cages/homes for these animals. I think the only tree you have to bark up is the cobras???? Why is Brutus ileagal? Just because he is BIG????? Also check the legalities of them searching your comp. Just because they were in your home, I think comps and phones may fall under a different search.
Aren't you in Collinsville??
ugh, I hope this works out sooner rather than later for you and your animals.
 

reefraff

Active Member
Not sure them going through your computer was legal even though you let them in the house. That might help your friend but isn't going to help you out if you were breaking the law having those cobras.
 

aw2x3

Active Member
Originally Posted by Veni Vidi Vici
http:///forum/post/3214657
As soon as the badge came out...Zippppppp
Bummer.
Here is some info that you may find comforting though,they are going to always throw as many charges at you as possible for a couple of reasons.
1. And the obvious is because you are being acused of breaking them
2.Its easier to get you to agree to a plea bargain and thus a conviction.
or
3. something most likely will stick.
If none of your charges are felonies I wouldn't worry, just bring your checkbook.
Maybe a illegal entrapment dismissal.
I actually never saw a badge, for the first 20 minutes of talking. I had to ask what agency were with. None of the charges, from what the county tells me, are federal. The county cops were insanely pissed because they brought me in. Then, on top of that, they sat around, taking up space, getting as many charges as they could, because they didn't get anything big on me.
Originally Posted by lovethesea

http:///forum/post/3214658
holy carps.
Get a good lawyer (speciality in those laws) AND start hitting up your other professionals who handle these animals and know the laws. So did they take Brutus and the cobras? You KNOW I hat....um don't care for snakes..but I also don't like animals in the wrong hands. Its funny that they didn't mention your care/handling/cages/homes for these animals. I think the only tree you have to bark up is the cobras???? Why is Brutus ileagal? Just because he is BIG????? Also check the legalities of them searching your comp. Just because they were in your home, I think comps and phones may fall under a different search.
Aren't you in Collinsville??
ugh, I hope this works out sooner rather than later for you and your animals.
They didn't take Brutus...only told me I had to "relocate" him, meaning they'll be back to check and make sure I got rid of him. I knew more about the state laws than these jackasses did and I know's he not illegal. Even if he was, an 18 footer wouldn't be illegal, while a 14 footer would be legal.
And, I'm in Jerseyville...just north of Alton.
I read a report, when I got home, that states that 95% of all animals, confiscated by Conservation, die because of improper care. I told them that I personally know the head reptile keeper, of St Louis Zoo and I only cared that my snakes went to a good home. Told them all I had to do was make a call and they'd come get them. But, they didn't care.
Originally Posted by socal57che
http:///forum/post/3214660
They didn't "manhandle" your firearms, did they?
We had to lock our dog, in the bedroom, because he'll bite. I informed them of this, they let me lock him up and thankfully, all of my firearms were in the gunsafe, in the bedroom walk in closet. I'm sure they would've tried sticking me with Federal Firearms charges too, since they couldn't get anything else out of me.
My thinking is that they thought they were gonna get some big time venomous snake hoarder. That they were going to come back to my house and find 50 other different types of hots and they were gonna be on the nightly news. When they realized I didn't have anything else illegal, they wanted to make sure their superiors knew they hit me with whatever they could, to justify spending the cash on the 2 week long sting operation, on me.
 

reefraff

Active Member
Some years ago a guy I knew was caught in something like this. He was selling guns, a lot. He would buy and sell to add to his collection so the cops set up a sting to try to bust him for selling without a FFL. Once they did their bust they discovered he in fact was just a collector but decided to try to nail him on a different change just to save face. Some states, maybe all require you don't sell to people from out of state so you have to ask for ID. This guy didn't so they charged him with that lest their expensive investigation comes up with nothing to show for it.
Guy hired a lawyer, lawyer got charges dropped in less than a minute. The guy he sold to was a cop. Law, for some dumb reason said cops didn't have to show ID to buy a gun.
Moral of our story is don't scrimp on the lawyer. With all those charges they might give you some jail time. You are hosed on the Cobras but should be able to get off the rest.
 

flower

Well-Known Member

I know this is just my opinion….nobody else seems to think you did anything wrong.

Two dangerous venomous cobras! Are you nuts or something? I understand your other snakes, but cobras? 18 footers and 14 footers….I think you have some kind of macho thing going on and as long as you don’t have small children to be in danger, that’s your right…but not poison ones.
The cops were trying to find a keeper and seller of dangerous animals…If you weren’t doing something wrong you would not have been fined or arrested.
Sorry but I had to vent on this one.
 

tangman99

Active Member
Sorry to hear man. They are always going to "stack" charges. It's a side effect of rampant plea bargaining. It's like negotiating a deal. You ask for a lot knowing the price is going to be negotiated. Lawyer up and let them handle it. Cops are experts at manipulating the situation to get you where they want you. When you threw up the road block, they dropped the hammer and loaded you up. Another day at the office. Good luck man and hope it all works out for you.
Just curious, how did they come across you to run a sting on you?
 

keri

Active Member
Originally Posted by Flower
http:///forum/post/3214690

I know this is just my opinion….nobody else seems to think you did anything wrong.

Two dangerous venomous cobras! Are you nuts or something? I understand your other snakes, but cobras? 18 footers and 14 footers….I think you have some kind of macho thing going on and as long as you don’t have small children to be in danger, that’s your right…but not poison ones.
The cops were trying to find a keeper and seller of dangerous animals…If you weren’t doing something wrong you would not have been fined or arrested.
Sorry but I had to vent on this one.

Flower, not everybody will agree on what is "right" to keep as pets, so long as the animal's needs are being properly met it's a personal choice... are you so sure you don't have anything venomous in your own aquarium?
Venomous reptiles are legal to keep in many states, as well as large snakes, and yeah, they are dangerous so you have to be CAREFUL... but you know what else harms WAY more people? Horses. (and no permit needed for those!) I don't keep HOTS, they aren't legal here, but I have no problem with the people who do that house them securely and handle them properly.
AW I'm sorry it went down like that but hopefully you get a good lawyer and they drop it now that they've figured out you're not the "big fish" they were after. I do truely hope the pair of cobras end up with Someone taking good care of them.
 

aw2x3

Active Member

Originally Posted by Flower
http:///forum/post/3214690

I know this is just my opinion….nobody else seems to think you did anything wrong.

Two dangerous venomous cobras! Are you nuts or something? I understand your other snakes, but cobras? 18 footers and 14 footers….I think you have some kind of macho thing going on and as long as you don’t have small children to be in danger, that’s your right…but not poison ones.
The cops were trying to find a keeper and seller of dangerous animals…If you weren’t doing something wrong you would not have been fined or arrested.
Sorry but I had to vent on this one.
I get this alot and you're welcome, to your opinion. No, I don't have a small pee pee, no I don't drive a crazy sports car, no I'm not having a midlife crisis and no, I don't have a girlfriend who's 10 years younger than I am. I have nothing to prove to anyone.
I've been handling venomous snakes for a better part of 10 years. I've done it in public facilities and know EXACTLY what I'm doing.
I keep snakes for the same reason you keep dogs, or cats, or hamsters or whatever your choice of pets are...I enjoy them. There are hundreds, if not thousands, of people across the US, who keep venomous snakes.
And yes...even if I had kids, I'd still have my snakes. They don't eat people and with the right education, training and experiance, they are amazing pets.
Originally Posted by TangMan99
http:///forum/post/3214701
Sorry to hear man. They are always going to "stack" charges. It's a side effect of rampant plea bargaining. It's like negotiating a deal. You ask for a lot knowing the price is going to be negotiated. Lawyer up and let them handle it. Cops are experts at manipulating the situation to get you where they want you. When you threw up the road block, they dropped the hammer and loaded you up. Another day at the office. Good luck man and hope it all works out for you.
Just curious, how did they come across you to run a sting on you?
I posted the pair for sale, on a venomous reptiles classifed forum. In my post and my emails, I grilled the guy, telling him I would not sell to him if I did not think he was qualified or if he did not have the proper permits.
The "buyer" emailed me, from that website and that's where it all started.
Originally Posted by meowzer

http:///forum/post/3214704
So let me get this straight....they took the cobras???? ANdthe cobras are
illegal??
They took the Cobras, yes. And yes, they are illegal, in Illinois...but not if you have your proper permits, through the state, which I have. It took me over a year to get them. Interviews, questions, stacks of paperwork and more than enough fees.
 

meowzer

Moderator
Originally Posted by AW2x3
http:///forum/post/3214727
.
They took the Cobras, yes. And yes, they are illegal, in Illinois...but not if you have your proper permits, through the state, which I have. It took me over a year to get them. Interviews, questions, stacks of paperwork and more than enough fees.
Sorry to hear that....Do you think you will get them back? How did they justify taking them when you had all the papers???/
 

keri

Active Member
Whaaat?? What is the point of requiring permits and then not honouring them??!!
BUNK!!!
 

veni vidi vici

Active Member
Originally Posted by AW2x3
http:///forum/post/3214727
They took the Cobras, yes. And yes, they are illegal, in Illinois...but not if you have your proper permits, through the state, which I have. It took me over a year to get them. Interviews, questions, stacks of paperwork and more than enough fees.
HUH? How could they charge you with:
1 count unlawful possession of an injurous animal (male albino Monocled Cobra)
1 count unlawful possession of an injurous animal (female albino Monocled Cobra)
If you have valid permits?
 
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