Obama supporters. I have one question
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1journeyman
Active Member
Originally Posted by zman1
http:///forum/post/2499259
.... Call him “maverick”, call him “independent,” but please don’t call McCain “conservative.” ....
Zman, you're preaching to the choir...
None of us here have, or would, call McCain a Conservative.
That said, at least he's still slightly to the Right of France...
*Obombus, and now Clinton, both have stated they will abandon the people of Iraq.
*Both believe in "redistribution of wealth"
*Both believe in Universal Health Care (which is ironic, considering many socialist countries with UHC are experimenting with optional privatization....)
*Both want to punish companies for making profits
*Both want to give more Fed. Regulation to the private sector
*Both want to move back towards Protectionism Trade Policies
*Both want amnesty for illegals. Obombus even want Driver licenses for them. At least McCain has learned the lesson.
*Both want to repeal the tax Bush Tax Cuts
http:///forum/post/2499259
.... Call him “maverick”, call him “independent,” but please don’t call McCain “conservative.” ....
Zman, you're preaching to the choir...
None of us here have, or would, call McCain a Conservative.
That said, at least he's still slightly to the Right of France...
*Obombus, and now Clinton, both have stated they will abandon the people of Iraq.
*Both believe in "redistribution of wealth"
*Both believe in Universal Health Care (which is ironic, considering many socialist countries with UHC are experimenting with optional privatization....)
*Both want to punish companies for making profits
*Both want to give more Fed. Regulation to the private sector
*Both want to move back towards Protectionism Trade Policies
*Both want amnesty for illegals. Obombus even want Driver licenses for them. At least McCain has learned the lesson.
*Both want to repeal the tax Bush Tax Cuts
scubadoo
Active Member
Originally Posted by 1journeyman
http:///forum/post/2499436
Zman, you're preaching to the choir...
None of us here have, or would, call McCain a Conservative.
That said, at least he's still slightly to the Right of France...
*Obombus, and now Clinton, both have stated they will abandon the people of Iraq.
*Both believe in "redistribution of wealth"
*Both believe in Universal Health Care (which is ironic, considering many socialist countries with UHC are experimenting with optional privatization....)
*Both want to punish companies for making profits
*Both want to give more Fed. Regulation to the private sector
*Both want to move back towards Protectionism Trade Policies
*Both want amnesty for illegals. Obombus even want Driver licenses for them. At least McCain has learned the lesson.
*Both want to repeal the tax Bush Tax Cuts
Both are weak on terror. I prefer to use the term surrender In Iraq.
http:///forum/post/2499436
Zman, you're preaching to the choir...
None of us here have, or would, call McCain a Conservative.
That said, at least he's still slightly to the Right of France...
*Obombus, and now Clinton, both have stated they will abandon the people of Iraq.
*Both believe in "redistribution of wealth"
*Both believe in Universal Health Care (which is ironic, considering many socialist countries with UHC are experimenting with optional privatization....)
*Both want to punish companies for making profits
*Both want to give more Fed. Regulation to the private sector
*Both want to move back towards Protectionism Trade Policies
*Both want amnesty for illegals. Obombus even want Driver licenses for them. At least McCain has learned the lesson.
*Both want to repeal the tax Bush Tax Cuts
Both are weak on terror. I prefer to use the term surrender In Iraq.
zman1
Active Member
Originally Posted by 1journeymanhttp:///forum/post/2499436
Zman, you're preaching to the choir...
None of us here have, or would, call McCain a Conservative.
That said, at least he's still slightly to the Right of France...
*Whch redistribution are you talking about - to continue in favor of the weathy or stop the trend? McCain tax Flip flop, taxing is not the only way to fix it Both believe in "redistribution of wealth"
*All our allies have a form of UHC (including canada a trading partner) Which is Ironic - Both believe in Universal Health Care (which is ironic, considering many socialist countries with UHC are experimenting with optional privatization....)
*All three want off oil, that's a bust to the oil companies-- Both want to punish companies for making profits
*All three CO2 - enviroment -- Both want to give more Fed. Regulation to the private sector
*So to negotiate a better deal is bad, Huh -Both want to move back towards Protectionism Trade Policies
*Both want amnesty for illegals. Obombus even want Driver licenses for them. At least McCain has learned the lesson For now, could flip flop again
*
Was all three until the election, another McCain flip flop for nowBoth want to repeal the tax Bush Tax Cuts
Not all your points are inclusive...
Zman, you're preaching to the choir...
None of us here have, or would, call McCain a Conservative.
That said, at least he's still slightly to the Right of France...
*Whch redistribution are you talking about - to continue in favor of the weathy or stop the trend? McCain tax Flip flop, taxing is not the only way to fix it Both believe in "redistribution of wealth"
*All our allies have a form of UHC (including canada a trading partner) Which is Ironic - Both believe in Universal Health Care (which is ironic, considering many socialist countries with UHC are experimenting with optional privatization....)
*All three want off oil, that's a bust to the oil companies-- Both want to punish companies for making profits
*All three CO2 - enviroment -- Both want to give more Fed. Regulation to the private sector
*So to negotiate a better deal is bad, Huh -Both want to move back towards Protectionism Trade Policies
*Both want amnesty for illegals. Obombus even want Driver licenses for them. At least McCain has learned the lesson For now, could flip flop again
*
Was all three until the election, another McCain flip flop for nowBoth want to repeal the tax Bush Tax Cuts
Not all your points are inclusive...
reefraff
Active Member
Originally Posted by zman1
http:///forum/post/2499595
Another question
Who would you want to oversee the world's superior military and nuclear arsenal?
Not Obama. I think he has a blind spot where Africa is concerned and will drag our military into the Darfur mess.
I think Clinton would be OK simply because she would select cabinet members from more of a mainstream viewpoint than Obama.
McCain has got to get credit for criticizing Rumsfeld early on whether you liked the job rummy was doing or not. He was also pushing for more troops at a time it wasn't a popular position but it turned out to be the right one. I just wish some of McCains other "Maverick" positions were moving in a different direction. My biggest gripe is with the immigration deal but McCain is still better than Clinton or Obama on it.
http:///forum/post/2499595
Another question
Who would you want to oversee the world's superior military and nuclear arsenal?
Not Obama. I think he has a blind spot where Africa is concerned and will drag our military into the Darfur mess.
I think Clinton would be OK simply because she would select cabinet members from more of a mainstream viewpoint than Obama.
McCain has got to get credit for criticizing Rumsfeld early on whether you liked the job rummy was doing or not. He was also pushing for more troops at a time it wasn't a popular position but it turned out to be the right one. I just wish some of McCains other "Maverick" positions were moving in a different direction. My biggest gripe is with the immigration deal but McCain is still better than Clinton or Obama on it.
zman1
Active Member
The few things about Darfur and this isn't sarcasm. The only thing we would be doing is a humanitarian effort/peacekeeping, there isn't anything we want or need to protect - interest in the area. Unless this counts: petroleum, natural gas, gold, silver, chrome, asbestos, manganese, gypsum, mica, zinc, iron, lead, uranium, copper, kaolin, cobalt, granite, nickel and tin. The other thing is the Arab League doesn't want the UN there either - There are some bad players as members of the league. Is this a potential area for AQ bases?
This is sarcasm - We could fight the war on terrorism there, AQ would surely follow, if they aren't there..
This is sarcasm - We could fight the war on terrorism there, AQ would surely follow, if they aren't there..
stdreb27
Active Member
Originally Posted by zman1
http:///forum/post/2499959
The few things about Darfur and this isn't sarcasm. The only thing we would be doing is a humanitarian effort/peacekeeping, there isn't anything we want or need to protect - interest in the area. The other thing is the Arab League doesn't want the UN there either - There are some bad players as members of the league. Is this a potential area for AQ bases?
This is sarcasm - We could fight the war on terrorism there, AQ would surely follow, if they aren't there..
If you are a concealed hand gun owner and you walk around a corner and see someone being raped. In the correct situation ie you have the ability to stop the situation, you aren't going to keep walking you can't keep walking you have the moral obligation to stop it, preferably by blowing someone's head off. In my mind that is the same at a national level. The problem is you can't single handedly save every victim. If it were my show I would help where we can, but we already have a multi-national organization that international aid is in their purview, that the USA funds 70% the last time I looked. In the interest in "not forcing american solutions" on the world I would expect the UN to take care of it.
Their solutions are the democrat solutions and we can see if you care to connect those dots, how well they work.
http:///forum/post/2499959
The few things about Darfur and this isn't sarcasm. The only thing we would be doing is a humanitarian effort/peacekeeping, there isn't anything we want or need to protect - interest in the area. The other thing is the Arab League doesn't want the UN there either - There are some bad players as members of the league. Is this a potential area for AQ bases?
This is sarcasm - We could fight the war on terrorism there, AQ would surely follow, if they aren't there..
If you are a concealed hand gun owner and you walk around a corner and see someone being raped. In the correct situation ie you have the ability to stop the situation, you aren't going to keep walking you can't keep walking you have the moral obligation to stop it, preferably by blowing someone's head off. In my mind that is the same at a national level. The problem is you can't single handedly save every victim. If it were my show I would help where we can, but we already have a multi-national organization that international aid is in their purview, that the USA funds 70% the last time I looked. In the interest in "not forcing american solutions" on the world I would expect the UN to take care of it.
1journeyman
Active Member
Originally Posted by zman1
http:///forum/post/2499588
Not all your points are inclusive...
Zman, you didn't really address my points...
http:///forum/post/2499588
Not all your points are inclusive...
Zman, you didn't really address my points...
1journeyman
Active Member
Originally Posted by zman1
http:///forum/post/2499595
Another question
Who would you want to oversee the world's superior military and nuclear arsenal?
Not the guy that has a proven track record of pressing the wrong button, that's for sure...
http:///forum/post/2499595
Another question
Who would you want to oversee the world's superior military and nuclear arsenal?
Not the guy that has a proven track record of pressing the wrong button, that's for sure...
zman1
Active Member
Originally Posted by 1journeyman
http:///forum/post/2500022
Not the guy that has a proven track record of pressing the wrong button, that's for sure...
I would rather have someone that would find it hard to make that decision when compared to someone that has a propensity towards flying off the handle and on several occasions was unable to contain and control himself. I would prefer the person sitting over the launch button to be calm and deliberate in his/her actions and not driven by emotion. It's a tell-tale sign of a person's character when under stress, how they handle themselves. It could just be intolerance of age now...
http:///forum/post/2500022
Not the guy that has a proven track record of pressing the wrong button, that's for sure...
I would rather have someone that would find it hard to make that decision when compared to someone that has a propensity towards flying off the handle and on several occasions was unable to contain and control himself. I would prefer the person sitting over the launch button to be calm and deliberate in his/her actions and not driven by emotion. It's a tell-tale sign of a person's character when under stress, how they handle themselves. It could just be intolerance of age now...
1journeyman
Active Member
Originally Posted by zman1
http:///forum/post/2499959
...
This is sarcasm - We could fight the war on terrorism there, AQ would surely follow, if they aren't there..
One of the quaint and interesting facts about the war on terrorism that many on the left seem to be unable to comprehend is that we are fighting radical islamists. Iraq is a key country in the Middle East. That's why Al Qaeda rallied to the battlefield there.
Al Qaeda, like us, has little to gain in Darfur.
http:///forum/post/2499959
...
This is sarcasm - We could fight the war on terrorism there, AQ would surely follow, if they aren't there..
One of the quaint and interesting facts about the war on terrorism that many on the left seem to be unable to comprehend is that we are fighting radical islamists. Iraq is a key country in the Middle East. That's why Al Qaeda rallied to the battlefield there.
Al Qaeda, like us, has little to gain in Darfur.
zman1
Active Member
Originally Posted by 1journeyman
http:///forum/post/2500041
One of the quaint and interesting facts about the war on terrorism that many on the left seem to be unable to comprehend is that we are fighting radical islamists. Iraq is a key country in the Middle East. That's why Al Qaeda rallied to the battlefield there.
Al Qaeda, like us, has little to gain in Darfur.
Iraq (45) too is a member of the Arab league as Sudan (56)...
http:///forum/post/2500041
One of the quaint and interesting facts about the war on terrorism that many on the left seem to be unable to comprehend is that we are fighting radical islamists. Iraq is a key country in the Middle East. That's why Al Qaeda rallied to the battlefield there.
Al Qaeda, like us, has little to gain in Darfur.
Iraq (45) too is a member of the Arab league as Sudan (56)...
1journeyman
Active Member
Originally Posted by Zman
*Whch redistribution are you talking about - to continue in favor of the weathy or stop the trend? McCain tax Flip flop, taxing is not the only way to fix it
*All our allies have a form of UHC (including canada a trading partner) Which is Ironic -
*All three want off oil, that's a bust to the oil companies
*All three CO2 - enviroment
*So to negotiate a better deal is bad, Huh [/B
*For now, could flip flop again
*
Was all three until the election, another McCain flip flop for now
You're trying to redefine what "redistribution" means.... I'm of the opinion that if you work hard and make money it should be yours. You shouldn't have to pay an obscene amount in taxes for those unwilling to do the same. The Constitution calls for every American to have the right to "Life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness". Nowhere does it say sit on your butt on the couch and we'll mail you a check each month. The current system does not favor the wealthy. How many times do we need to post the truth regarding how much the top 10% of wage earners pay in the total Federal Taxes?
Yes, our socialist allies do have UHC. Many of them also come here for medical treatment. Look into the recent Canadian Supreme Court ruling regarding their failing UHC system, the clinics and medical facilities springing up in SE Asia staffed by European medical personal, etc. UHC does not work as well as our private system.
Us being off of oil is a long term goal and in no way effects oil companies. Long after we are off of oil other nations will still be using it. Obama and Clinton want to over tax them now. They both fail to realize oil prices are based on world demand. Furthermore, they conveniently point at the oil companies and blame them for the price of gasoline. Just for fun, take a look the next time you are filling up at how many cents to the gallon you are paying in taxes to the Feds...
I disagree with McCain on the environment. That said, do you really believe he will try to regulate CO2 like Obombus or Clinton? How about the Insurance Industry? How about the M ortgage industry? etc...
Re-negotiating a bad deal? Define "bad deal".... Obombus and Clinton want to cave to the labor unions. Obombus says the lobbyists don't control him, yet when it comes to labor, abortion, etc. he's in lockstep.
I'll take my chances on him "re flopping" on issues over 2 candidates dead set on going in the wrong direction.
...
*Whch redistribution are you talking about - to continue in favor of the weathy or stop the trend? McCain tax Flip flop, taxing is not the only way to fix it
*All our allies have a form of UHC (including canada a trading partner) Which is Ironic -
*All three want off oil, that's a bust to the oil companies
*All three CO2 - enviroment
*So to negotiate a better deal is bad, Huh [/B
*For now, could flip flop again
*
Was all three until the election, another McCain flip flop for now
You're trying to redefine what "redistribution" means.... I'm of the opinion that if you work hard and make money it should be yours. You shouldn't have to pay an obscene amount in taxes for those unwilling to do the same. The Constitution calls for every American to have the right to "Life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness". Nowhere does it say sit on your butt on the couch and we'll mail you a check each month. The current system does not favor the wealthy. How many times do we need to post the truth regarding how much the top 10% of wage earners pay in the total Federal Taxes?
Yes, our socialist allies do have UHC. Many of them also come here for medical treatment. Look into the recent Canadian Supreme Court ruling regarding their failing UHC system, the clinics and medical facilities springing up in SE Asia staffed by European medical personal, etc. UHC does not work as well as our private system.
Us being off of oil is a long term goal and in no way effects oil companies. Long after we are off of oil other nations will still be using it. Obama and Clinton want to over tax them now. They both fail to realize oil prices are based on world demand. Furthermore, they conveniently point at the oil companies and blame them for the price of gasoline. Just for fun, take a look the next time you are filling up at how many cents to the gallon you are paying in taxes to the Feds...
I disagree with McCain on the environment. That said, do you really believe he will try to regulate CO2 like Obombus or Clinton? How about the Insurance Industry? How about the M ortgage industry? etc...
Re-negotiating a bad deal? Define "bad deal".... Obombus and Clinton want to cave to the labor unions. Obombus says the lobbyists don't control him, yet when it comes to labor, abortion, etc. he's in lockstep.
I'll take my chances on him "re flopping" on issues over 2 candidates dead set on going in the wrong direction.
...
1journeyman
Active Member
Originally Posted by zman1
http:///forum/post/2500051
Iraq (45) too is a member of the Arab league as Sudan (56)...
Al Qaeda doesn't care about the Arab League.
What they care about is our presence in the Middle East.
http:///forum/post/2500051
Iraq (45) too is a member of the Arab league as Sudan (56)...
Al Qaeda doesn't care about the Arab League.
What they care about is our presence in the Middle East.
zman1
Active Member
Originally Posted by 1journeyman
http:///forum/post/2500097
You're trying to redefine what "redistribution" means....
...
Besides spending deficits and national debt. This is the latest chart I could find on CBO. I will take a SWAG that it hasn't improved but continued to widen.
The 1% are what 3.X million people. Which a majority are well over 1 mill salaries. This would include a lot, if not all SVP,EVP,CFO and CEOs of corporations. Good ole boy network, sitting on each other's boards, voting raises and slapping each other on the back for reducing cost by exporting jobs and Wall Street loves it. I am not talking just about manufacturing jobs, also white collar engineering jobs. They close the union plants, move to right to work states, and then close those and move to Communist China or did I say Socialist we must love that type of government. I suspect this contributes to the decline in 80% of the AMERICANS on the chart. Also layoff American Engineers while keeping foreign workers (work Visa) from Pakistan, India and China on staff. Of course American will need cheaper products from China, they can't afford the redistribution of wealth. The 1% aren't getting it all, they just get a piece, while the other countries improve their economy. There is just something wrong and unpatriotic to line your pockets while destroying the security of our country and call it capitalism.
We could retrain them for call support - sorry we export those jobs to India and Pakistan too. The world needs ditch diggers as well, that might be why we are now saying illegal immigrants are taking jobs from Americans.
International sellout. How to stop the bleeding and remain an open trading nation that's the challenge. Forbid we ever get into another world war and China be on the opposite side, we would lose our manufacturing import capabilities... TRADE DEALS?
http:///forum/post/2500097
You're trying to redefine what "redistribution" means....
...
Besides spending deficits and national debt. This is the latest chart I could find on CBO. I will take a SWAG that it hasn't improved but continued to widen.
The 1% are what 3.X million people. Which a majority are well over 1 mill salaries. This would include a lot, if not all SVP,EVP,CFO and CEOs of corporations. Good ole boy network, sitting on each other's boards, voting raises and slapping each other on the back for reducing cost by exporting jobs and Wall Street loves it. I am not talking just about manufacturing jobs, also white collar engineering jobs. They close the union plants, move to right to work states, and then close those and move to Communist China or did I say Socialist we must love that type of government. I suspect this contributes to the decline in 80% of the AMERICANS on the chart. Also layoff American Engineers while keeping foreign workers (work Visa) from Pakistan, India and China on staff. Of course American will need cheaper products from China, they can't afford the redistribution of wealth. The 1% aren't getting it all, they just get a piece, while the other countries improve their economy. There is just something wrong and unpatriotic to line your pockets while destroying the security of our country and call it capitalism.
We could retrain them for call support - sorry we export those jobs to India and Pakistan too. The world needs ditch diggers as well, that might be why we are now saying illegal immigrants are taking jobs from Americans.
International sellout. How to stop the bleeding and remain an open trading nation that's the challenge. Forbid we ever get into another world war and China be on the opposite side, we would lose our manufacturing import capabilities... TRADE DEALS?
bdhutier
Member
Originally Posted by stdreb27
http:///forum/post/2499061
and rylan still won't refute or even discuss the issue he proposed...
I'm convinced Rylan just pops on here spouting his (her some have said) hip-shooting nonsense to get everyone spun-up.
Originally Posted by 1journeyman
http:///forum/post/2499436
*Both believe in "redistribution of wealth"
I wonder if they're interested in redistributing their personal wealth?
Originally Posted by zman1
http:///forum/post/2499595
Another question
Who would you want to oversee the world's superior military and nuclear arsenal?
Of the three, McCain. He is the only one of the three who can truly understand the difficulty wartime service really can be. When McCain calls for more troops to deploy, and calls for longer deployments, I don't particularly like it, of course. BUT, at least I know he has looked into his wife's tear-filled eyes, turned away, and boarded the bus.
Maybe I'm being hokey, or emotional in that respect... but the way I see it, I know the decisions he makes as the CinC are not made lightly. He knows the pain of deployment, So he'll understand mine.
http:///forum/post/2499061
and rylan still won't refute or even discuss the issue he proposed...
I'm convinced Rylan just pops on here spouting his (her some have said) hip-shooting nonsense to get everyone spun-up.
Originally Posted by 1journeyman
http:///forum/post/2499436
*Both believe in "redistribution of wealth"
I wonder if they're interested in redistributing their personal wealth?
Originally Posted by zman1
http:///forum/post/2499595
Another question
Who would you want to oversee the world's superior military and nuclear arsenal?
Of the three, McCain. He is the only one of the three who can truly understand the difficulty wartime service really can be. When McCain calls for more troops to deploy, and calls for longer deployments, I don't particularly like it, of course. BUT, at least I know he has looked into his wife's tear-filled eyes, turned away, and boarded the bus.
Maybe I'm being hokey, or emotional in that respect... but the way I see it, I know the decisions he makes as the CinC are not made lightly. He knows the pain of deployment, So he'll understand mine.
1journeyman
Active Member
Originally Posted by zman1
http:///forum/post/2500170
.... How to stop the bleeding and remain an open trading nation that's the challenge..
We have become a "Post Industrial" Nation.
Yes, we are going to lose Industrial jobs.
The American Worker must adapt. As unemployment numbers show, most have.
As for your chart, nothing is stopping people from moving "to the right" on it. It's up to them.
Redistribtution, a la, "Robin Hood" punishes those that work hard to reward those that don't.
Speaking of "outsourcing". What do you think is going to happen when the Dems start talking about raising corporate taxes? Businesses will pack up and head for the border...
http:///forum/post/2500170
.... How to stop the bleeding and remain an open trading nation that's the challenge..
We have become a "Post Industrial" Nation.
The American Worker must adapt. As unemployment numbers show, most have.
As for your chart, nothing is stopping people from moving "to the right" on it. It's up to them.
Redistribtution, a la, "Robin Hood" punishes those that work hard to reward those that don't.
Speaking of "outsourcing". What do you think is going to happen when the Dems start talking about raising corporate taxes? Businesses will pack up and head for the border...