Republican Candidates

[jerthunter]

Originally Posted by 1journeyman
Fair enough;
First off, while not racist, I have an issue with a presedential candidate going to a church which states "We are an African people, and remain "true to our native land"... Great. Move back then. Where do Obama's allegiances lie? America or Africa?
Secondly, if you go back and read past sermons the pastor clearly is preaching political sermons... the legality of that is certainly in question.
Third, can you imagine the outrage if a Republican candidate went to a church that espoused it's allegiance to Europe and White principles? Or how about;
*Commitment to the White Community
*Commitment to the White Family
*Adherence to the White Work Ethic
*Pledge allegiance to all White leadership who espouse and embrace the White Value System
*Personal commitment to embracement of the White Value System.
Would that not strike you as a racist group? Hopefully it certainly would.
When I would visit my Grandmother in Wisconsin we would always go to her Luthern Church. The majority of the people who atteneded were Scandinavian and the embraced Scandinavian culture many of them had family back in their 'homelands' of Norway and Sweden. I do not consider that church to be a racist church so I cannot consider another church that embraces the culture and ancestral homeland of its community to be racist.
As far as the comment about moving back. Come on, you have more sense then to make a statement like that. Most of our families have come to the US willingly and been permitted to bring with our parts of our ancestral culture. Other groups did not have that same choice and must work much harder to restore the aspects of their culture that were stolen from them.

 

[stdreb27]

Originally Posted by Jerthunter
When I would visit my Grandmother in Wisconsin we would always go to her Luthern Church. The majority of the people who atteneded were Scandinavian and the embraced Scandinavian culture many of them had family back in their 'homelands' of Norway and Sweden. I do not consider that church to be a racist church so I cannot consider another church that embraces the culture and ancestral homeland of its community to be racist.
As far as the comment about moving back. Come on, you have more sense then to make a statement like that. Most of our families have come to the US willingly and been permitted to bring with our parts of our ancestral culture. Other groups did not have that same choice and must work much harder to restore the aspects of their culture that were stolen from them.
The simple fact IS if I started a church touting his tennants but black with white, I'd be lynched as a racist.

 

[jerthunter]

Originally Posted by stdreb27
The simple fact IS if I started a church touting his tennants but black with white, I'd be lynched as a racist.
So if there was a church, with a primarily white congregation that focused on European culture and traditions and addressed the social issues that concerned the people of the church you would say it is racist?

 

[rylan1]

Originally Posted by Jerthunter
So if there was a church, with a primarily white congregation that focused on European culture and traditions and addressed the social issues that concerned the people of the church you would say it is racist?
they already do. and no I wouldn't. You could include mosques and temples into this too.

 

[rylan1]

Originally Posted by J.P
y? because ther racists?
Because of their history of oppression and murder. Their hatred of jews, catholics, and minorities. They are a terrorist organization. So, since you asked... they are more than just racists...

 

[rylan1]

Originally Posted by Jerthunter
When I would visit my Grandmother in Wisconsin we would always go to her Luthern Church. The majority of the people who atteneded were Scandinavian and the embraced Scandinavian culture many of them had family back in their 'homelands' of Norway and Sweden. I do not consider that church to be a racist church so I cannot consider another church that embraces the culture and ancestral homeland of its community to be racist.
As far as the comment about moving back. Come on, you have more sense then to make a statement like that. Most of our families have come to the US willingly and been permitted to bring with our parts of our ancestral culture. Other groups did not have that same choice and must work much harder to restore the aspects of their culture that were stolen from them.
thank you...it seems we are on the same page.

 

[1journeyman]

Originally Posted by Rylan1
Oh, I missed that. The plan would cost $50-$65 billion. In comparison that less than 110 billion that it would cost for Clinton's. which if you want to compare. The cost of the war per month is $9 billion per month without taking into account all the other costs.
First off that is a hopelessly conservative estimate.
Second, that is per year, and will grow EVERY year...

 

[1journeyman]

Originally Posted by Jerthunter
... Most of our families have come to the US willingly and been permitted to bring with our parts of our ancestral culture. Other groups did not have that same choice and must work much harder to restore the aspects of their culture that were stolen from them.
No one has been brought against their will to this country in over 250 years....
Heck, I'd love to know just how many people actually know their heritage that far back.
Regardless, while I know my family was in Transylvania (true story) 250 years ago, I would never join a church that "espoused it's allegiance to Transylvania".

 

[1journeyman]

Originally Posted by Rylan1
Because of their history of oppression and murder. Their hatred of jews, catholics, and minorities. They are a terrorist organization. So, since you asked... they are more than just racists...
Very true. The KKK is could certainly be considered a domestic terrorist group.
Now let's talk about the various terrorist groups operating today in Africa. How about the fact that slavery and religious persecution are rampant in parts of Africa.
Why is it that America is still condemmed today for the salve trade of 300 years ago (which the colonies here actually were statistically a very small participant in) while the ills of Africa then and now are overlooked?
You're either an American or you aren't. As a preacher, that "pastor" should understand the saying "you cannot serve two masters".
It's time we quit dredging up the past and just all be Americans.

 

[jerthunter]

Originally Posted by 1journeyman
No one has been brought against their will to this country in over 250 years....
Heck, I'd love to know just how many people actually know their heritage that far back.
Regardless, while I know my family was in Transylvania (true story) 250 years ago, I would never join a church that "espoused it's allegiance to Transylvania".
Plenty of people are brought here against their will even today, most of them from poorer Asian countries.
Beyond that, it isn't a matter of how long ago people had their culture taken from them. Culture is something that gets passed down from generation to generation and it takes a long to to recover once it is lost.
Different people have different views on the importance of their ancestral culture, to me it isn't a big deal, to others in my family it is huge. I do not share my mother's interest in Norwegian culture but I fully understand that it is important to her.

 

[rylan1]

Originally Posted by 1journeyman
No one has been brought against their will to this country in over 250 years....
Heck, I'd love to know just how many people actually know their heritage that far back.
Regardless, while I know my family was in Transylvania (true story) 250 years ago, I would never join a church that "espoused it's allegiance to Transylvania".
it would be far easier for them to find out... but how are these similar? Point is your family and ancestoral history is available to you if you want to do the research. African slaves don't have that because their families units were broken up.

 

[rylan1]

Originally Posted by Jerthunter
Plenty of people are brought here against their will even today, most of them from poorer Asian countries.
Beyond that, it isn't a matter of how long ago people had their culture taken from them. Culture is something that gets passed down from generation to generation and it takes a long to to recover once it is lost.
Different people have different views on the importance of their ancestral culture, to me it isn't a big deal, to others in my family it is huge. I do not share my mother's interest in Norwegian culture but I fully understand that it is important to her.
And you are right... Asian and Russian ...probably others.

 

[rylan1]

Originally Posted by 1journeyman
Very true. The KKK is could certainly be considered a domestic terrorist group.
Now let's talk about the various terrorist groups operating today in Africa. How about the fact that slavery and religious persecution are rampant in parts of Africa.
Why is it that America is still condemmed today for the salve trade of 300 years ago (which the colonies here actually were statistically a very small participant in) while the ills of Africa then and now are overlooked?
You're either an American or you aren't. As a preacher, that "pastor" should understand the saying "you cannot serve two masters".
It's time we quit dredging up the past and just all be Americans.
You can blame the USA and others for what continues in Africa. It is similar to Iraq and Afghanastan yet we turn a blind eye and its at minimum backpage news. But the slave trade is the worst thing in Americas history, and it still has an effect on today. And you can shorten 300 years to 100. Because sharecropping and reconstruction were still slavery. Most of Africa was occupied by european nation less than 40 years ago. Than you have diamond and oil conflicts, religious and ethnic.

 

[stdreb27]

Originally Posted by Rylan1
You can blame the USA and what is going on in Africa is similar to Iraq and Afghanastan
You have to be kidding me.

did we cover this a couple threads ago? you argue that there is no difference between the power grab of the Stalin and the commies, and the USA's policy of spreading democracy. But then argue that we should spread democracy in Africa. But not in the middle east.

 

[stdreb27]

Do we need to talk about the Democrats record in Africa?
That being said, I agree Africa needs help, but it is not much different than Iraq when it comes to civil war, although the time frame is much shorter, (the muslims haven't been in africa as long as the middle east)

 

[rylan1]

Originally Posted by stdreb27
You have to be kidding me.

did we cover this a couple threads ago? you argue that there is no difference between the power grab of the Stalin and the commies, and the USA's policy of spreading democracy. But then argue that we should spread democracy in Africa. But not in the middle east.
What is the difference... they have one ideolgy they believe to be true and so do we. I also haven't said anything about democracy in Africa. I to believe democracy is a better system because it controls power; however, the idea of a marxist society is not theoritcally bad. But USSR and the USA's power struggle are the same thing. ...
Back to my point... much of the issues in certain african nations are similar to Iraq because they deal w/ power struggles b/w ethnic and religious groups. Funny thing I wonder if a democracy would work because it would be like dems and repubs on steroids...instead vetoing a bill or not accomplishing much because of partisanship...over there your whole party my get bombed. Someone with absolute rule may would work better...but power is corrupt.

 

[rylan1]

Originally Posted by stdreb27
Do we need to talk about the Democrats record in Africa?
That being said, I agree Africa needs help, but it is not much different than Iraq when it comes to civil war, although the time frame is much shorter, (the muslims haven't been in africa as long as the middle east)
we'll yes... Islam started in middle east,but much of africa is considered the middle east. But muslims have been in Africa and Europe for 1000 years or more.

 

[rylan1]

This thread has taken a lot of twists and turns.
Where does your candidate stand in N.H? Polls closed 15min ago.

 

[jerthunter]

Originally Posted by Rylan1
This thread has taken a lot of twists and turns.
Where does your candidate stand in N.H? Polls closed 15min ago.
Well they already announced that McCain won the N.H. Republican primary as I would have expected. Last I heard Clinton was ahead of Obama in the democratic side which is suprising.. I guess its true... Men just cannot stand to see a women cry...

 

[reefraff]

And by the way, the church embrasses the black value system
NOUN:
The belief that race accounts for differences in human character
Seems to fit right in with this definition