Run your car with water

stdreb27

stdreb27

Active Member
Originally Posted by Payton 350
http:///forum/post/2691616
efficient....not to the degree we need it....but my calculator runs great
reliable....last i checked , it rose everyday of my life...seems pretty reliable to me.......
(being a smart@@@)
lol do you know how LITTLE power that calculator uses?
 
stdreb27

stdreb27

Active Member
Eventually we are going to go to some different form of energy and more efficient form of energy, however, the reality is it isn't going to be anything anytime soon, because the technology simply isn't there. And no matter what technological advance we have some wacko tree hugger somewhere is going to get ticked off about it. So why not just burn dino bones till something interesting does come along...
Think about it, dino bones in oil out.
It is interested how earth generated a resource that is more efficient that anything man can think up to this point.
 
bang guy

bang guy

Moderator
Originally Posted by GrouperGenius
http:///forum/post/2691722
Wow. We must be in 2 different worlds. The energy that charges the battery comes from...(I'm typing this as slow as I can so you get it)....the alternator in your vehicle. The alternator is run by the internal combustion engine that moves the vehicle. The hydrogen generator produces hydrogen gas from water, the hydrogen gas helps the internal combustion engine utilize the normal fuel that goes into the engine. In turn making your vehicle need less fuel to get further. Thus creating better MPG.

LOL, type as slow as you want, it still takes more energy to extract Hydrogen from water than you get back when it "assists". The net effect of your "assist" is negative. It's a DRAIN on the engine, you are LOWERING your MPG.
You are basically discussing a device that reduces your engine's efficiency. Good job
 
stdreb27

stdreb27

Active Member
Originally Posted by Bang Guy
http:///forum/post/2691772
LOL, type as slow as you want, it still takes more energy to extract Hydrogen from water than you get back when it "assists". The net effect of your "assist" is negative. It's a DRAIN on the engine, you are LOWERING your MPG.
You are basically discussing a device that reduces your engine's efficiency. Good job

This conclusion would be true, if all the engine energy was used to turn the alternator, however it isn't, so you can't conclude that. Besides, your alternator is oversized for your motor, you car uses say 100 amps and the alternator produces 140 amps. Use the 40 for something else. You aren't going put more demand on the energy it takes to spin the alternator.
 
prime311

prime311

Active Member
A Hydrogen powered car is a real possibility, its already being made by Honda so I really don't understand how to argue that it isn't. It doesn't have the cost efficiency of a Hybrid, even if it didnt cost like 10x as much. The real advantage to fuel cell vehicles though is that they're clean burning and more eco friendly, not that they're more efficient then gas burning engines.
 
oscardeuce

oscardeuce

Active Member
Originally Posted by Payton 350
http:///forum/post/2691583
that energy, like todays cars is coming from the movement of the vehicle. Alternator is run off of a belt, well that belt can be controlled with the movement of the tires, which in turn is your "free" energy.....
how are todays batteries charged (in the car). not by gas, but alternator which is essentially using "free" energy. Also when the car is in a stand still, or parked , there can be a solar panel on the roof, trunk, and hood, that would keep the batteries(gonna need more than one
) charged.
There are ways to do this.. I don't see how you can say it isn't feasible, when in fact it's already being done

That alternater does not use "free" energy, gas is burned to provide the energy.
What you describe is a variation on the perpetual motion machine. This cannot work long term. Is defies too many laws of physicis.
You get about 147 J burning H2 and O2 to form H2O. It takes 147J to separate H2O into H2 and O2. Add in power to move the tires, run the radio, friction heat airconditioning etc. Sure you can recover some E from braking, but eventuall losses to the environment will drain the battery without some form of outside energy source.
 
bang guy

bang guy

Moderator
Originally Posted by stdreb27
http:///forum/post/2691797
This conclusion would be true, if all the engine energy was used to turn the alternator, however it isn't, so you can't conclude that.
Your premise isn't accurate. The amount of energy used to turn the alternator is not a factor in how much energy you receive from splitting water molecules for the Hydrogen vs how much energy is received from burning Hydrogen. You still get less back than what you put in.
 
oscardeuce

oscardeuce

Active Member
Originally Posted by prime311
http:///forum/post/2691801
A Hydrogen powered car is a real possibility, its already being made by Honda so I really don't understand how to argue that it isn't. It doesn't have the cost efficiency of a Hybrid, even if it didnt cost like 10x as much. The real advantage to fuel cell vehicles though is that they're clean burning and more eco friendly, not that they're more efficient then gas burning engines.

Look up water vapor as a greenhouse gas. It is worse than CO2
 
bang guy

bang guy

Moderator
Originally Posted by prime311
http:///forum/post/2691801
A Hydrogen powered car is a real possibility, its already being made by Honda so I really don't understand how to argue that it isn't. It doesn't have the cost efficiency of a Hybrid, even if it didnt cost like 10x as much. The real advantage to fuel cell vehicles though is that they're clean burning and more eco friendly, not that they're more efficient then gas burning engines.
Please tell me the Honda model that is a Gasoline/Hydrogen hybrid...
 
oscardeuce

oscardeuce

Active Member
Originally Posted by Payton 350
http:///forum/post/2691612
you're right ...it should have said something like the energy output would be far greater than the energy input. who knows? too much thinking for me for one day

Not unless you split the nucleus, or fuse nucli. You are pulling energy out of the air.
 
prime311

prime311

Active Member
Originally Posted by oscardeuce
http:///forum/post/2691811
It is a worse greenhouse gas. Like in winter, clear nights are cold, cloudy nights warmer.
Where does it say its a worse greenhouse gas? I see it says its the most common greenhouse gas, but nowhere did I see anything that called it worse then any other. Also, greenhouse effect is only one of many forms of pollution.
 
bang guy

bang guy

Moderator
Originally Posted by oscardeuce
http:///forum/post/2691803
That alternater does not use "free" energy, gas is burned to provide the energy.
What you describe is a variation on the perpetual motion machine. This cannot work long term. Is defies too many laws of physicis.
You get about 147 J burning H2 and O2 to form H2O. It takes 147J to separate H2O into H2 and O2. Add in power to move the tires, run the radio, friction heat airconditioning etc. Sure you can recover some E from braking, but eventuall losses to the environment will drain the battery without some form of outside energy source.

You forgot to add HEAT. A percentage of the combustion turns to waste heat. This is actually the major inefficiency. So, although 147J of ENERGY is returned only 130J is converted to mechanical energy. (example, the actual numbers depend on engine specifics like compression ratio and volume)
 
yerboy

yerboy

Active Member
Im not going to get into if this is possible or if it isn't as i personally have not seen with my own 2 eyes that it does in fact work. However my best friend is going to college with this guy who has built one of these units for his car and he claims he gets an extra 8mpg.
 
groupergenius

groupergenius

Active Member
Originally Posted by Bang Guy
http:///forum/post/2691772
LOL, type as slow as you want, it still takes more energy to extract Hydrogen from water than you get back when it "assists". The net effect of your "assist" is negative. It's a DRAIN on the engine, you are LOWERING your MPG.
You are basically discussing a device that reduces your engine's efficiency. Good job

Do a little research....how is it a drain on your engine??? Obviously you have no clue how a car works.
Explain how it is a drain on the engine in a realistic meaningful way....and I might believe you.
 
bang guy

bang guy

Moderator
Originally Posted by prime311
http:///forum/post/2691810
Its not a hybrid. Its a fuel cell vehicle.
stdreb27, GrouperGenius and I were not discussing a Fuel Cell vehicle so you took my comment out of context. That's fairly evil since I'm a proponent of fuel cell technology.
 
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