Should College Students Be Allowed To Carry Weapons???

[1journeyman]

Originally Posted by Jmick
http:///forum/post/2580858
How long does it take to pull one shot then the second? Again, this isn't the movies, this is real and it happens in a split second...can you imagine the pandemonium and chaos if 20 students pulled out guns in response to one gunman? They'd more then likely shoot each other, no one would know who the original gunman was...silly.
Anyone trained with a handgun should be able to draw and fire in under 2 seconds.
I'm guessing every student who saw the gunmen walk in and shoot the first guy would know who the original gunmen was.

 

[stdreb27]

Originally Posted by Jmick
http:///forum/post/2580858
How long does it take to pull one shot then the second? Again, this isn't the movies, this is real and it happens in a split second...can you imagine the pandemonium and chaos if 20 students pulled out guns in response to one gunman? They'd more then likely shoot each other, no one would know who the original gunman was...silly.
Your whole argument is based on an imagined "what if" situation. The funny thing is when people have taken it upon themselves to defend themselves it has been successful. No massive accidental shootings.
Lets consider nationwide situations where they waited for the rescue. 3 airplanes on 9-11, Virginia Tech, various mall shootings, a few church shootings.
The church shooting where they had armed guards, even if she was ineffective in actually shooting the shooter, it did curtail his activities. Judging by the amount of bullets he actually had.
Then on an individual level, there are countless situations where carrying by non-professionals has stopped the criminal. These what if situation are simply that "what if" they have no substantation in fact or precident.

 

[jmick]

Originally Posted by 1journeyman
http:///forum/post/2581217
Where are you getting this info?
Typically the shooter wanders around randomly going into classrooms and shooting, then going into another class and doing the same (baed on the school shootings we've seen). They have had multiple weapons, time to reload, etc.
How long does it take to get 75 students out of a room with 2 or 4 doors? Especially if a shooter is at one of them? It takes a lot longer than "a second or two"
Jmick, do a little reading of the Virginia Tech shooting as an example. The shooter chained the main doors to the building shut. He went into multiple rooms.
Again, where are you getting this "one or two seconds" idea? They guy shot almost 200 rounds.
Typical, what's typical about any of this Journey? Take the NIU Shooting, the gunman burst into the class and started shooting into a room full of kids whose backs were to the gunman...do you think this lead to chaos? I guess you have such an inflated and grandious view of yourself you'd take command of the situation as soon as the first bullet was fired? Come on, who are you crappin?

 

[stdreb27]

Originally Posted by Jmick
http:///forum/post/2581346
Typical, what's typical about any of this Journey? Take the NIU Shooting, the gunman burst into the class and started shooting into a room full of kids whose backs were to the gunman...do you think this lead to chaos? I guess you have such an inflated and grandious view of yourself you'd take command of the situation as soon as the first bullet was fired? Come on, who are you crappin?
To use the same qualifications of your "what if" argument, what if say my friend a man now out of the military who is going back to school left his gun at home. He has combat experience in urban environments. And someone walks in and shoots him and others in the class. He dies.
Because he wasn't allowed to carry.

 

[jmick]

Originally Posted by stdreb27
http:///forum/post/2581358
To use the same qualifications of your "what if" argument, what if say my friend a man now out of the military who is going back to school left his gun at home. He has combat experience in urban environments. And someone walks in and shoots him and others in the class. He dies.
Because he wasn't allowed to carry.
What if he was the first person shot and even if he had a gun he would not have been able to use it

 

[crashbandicoot]

Originally Posted by Jmick
http:///forum/post/2580691
And who oversees this? In my circle of friends, I know of no one who owns a gun for self protection. I often wonder if a person feels the need to have a gun and carry it to inflate an ego or because they have a desire to use it?
Reading through this thread, it seems to me as if many of you think you live in a movie and you're some kind of super hero. The real world and real events happen so fast and without warning most of the time. When someone breaks into a lecture hall and opens fire you only have second or two to decide what you are going to do and I'll say it again, I doubt anyone posting in this thread has what it takes to upholster their weapon and drop the shooter. Think about it, moments before you were focused on something else and are taken by surprise. If I were to bet on it, I'd put my money on you running for your lives or seeking cover asap.
Well you would be wrong .

You assume to know a lot when you admit you don't even know anybody with a gun . Granted I am not the average guy but I have before and wont hesitate to again draw my weapon with the intent of ending a life . Its what the other person does in that split second that saves their life or ends it . But you know what I don't mind cowards like you , Its the whole reason that people like me have jobs . Because we are not affraid to do what needs to be done . I thank god everyday for our military men , police and law enforcement , Doctors and emergancy crews that in the face of danger will rush into the fire when everybody else is headed for the exit , People who will with out thought of personal loss will rush to aid and deffend those that can't and even those that won't (like you jmick) .
Originally Posted by oscardeuce
http:///forum/post/2580706
I'm an Emergency Physician, I'm trained to react to surprises every day. In the ED I live in your "real world", I make split second decisions. The NRA actually does a great job training and overseeing. I have no "desire" to use my weapon, yet I will not hesitate to use it should I be forced by the actions of another person to defend myself or my family.
Well, come to think of it you described my job pretty well.

I guess your not a real hero .

Real hero's only exist in a tv world.
Originally Posted by Fats71
o_quote.gif" border="0" alt="View Post">
I would hope everyone would want to seek cover and go that route first.
My father told me when I was very young never ever fight if you can get away from it but if it is going to happen and their is no way out knock them out. Same applies here I think everyone on these boards respect life and are not the "nut vtech nut type" Everyone here would rather preserve life before taking it I am saying this due to the forum we are on... The puppy threads the new baby threads we are all on the same page. I do not see anyone here wanting to go out and play the wild wild west posse out for no reason but in some cases their is no other choice.

I agree . I am not out cruising the streets like some vigilante . But when trouble shows its face around me I will act

I guess that makes me a nut job

Paranoid

Afraid

All the right and wrong political BS goes out the window when the bullets start flying . There are those that run tail between their legs and die under a table or corner , there are the ones that almost taste freedom and die running away down a hall . But at the end of the day do you want to bury 1 coffin or 20 ? How many more people need to be forced to deal with mental issues because some nut job goes on a spree and kills people , Wounds somebody they have never met ? Why can't somebody stand up and stop it in that split second that there is a posability to end it right then and there .

 

[1journeyman]

Originally Posted by Jmick
http:///forum/post/2581367
What if he was the first person shot and even if he had a gun he would not have been able to use it

Well then the students are no worse off are they?
You brought up NIU yet don't have the account accurate. In this case the gunman walked onto the stage and shot the professor first. He then began shooting students as they tried to cram themselves out through the back door of the classroom. (http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/l...,1760508.story)
They were sitting ducks... Had someone in the class have been armed they probably couldn't have prevented the Professor from being shot, but they might very well have limited the further carnage.

 

[kichimark]

We are all going back and forth over this. Some people see the use and importance of it while others don't clearly see it. Cops are a responding force. A crime is done and they respond to it. The importance of having trained mature people carry is that they can hopefully take care of the situation as it develops. I myself have been shot at twice that I can remember and it can be very intimidating. The first time it was in a matter of seconds the other was a minute when someone was shooting down the street and a few rounds went past me.
Gun free zones? BS. Laws in this case are meant to limit the potential victims right to defend him/herself. If anyone doesn't want to defend themselves, hey they can be part of the statistics of people that were murdered unarmed. I for one believe we have the right to protect ourselves. I respect and love life but when someone wants to kill others for whatever reason they obviously do not. Everything else? goes out the window when the first round is shot at you.

 

[kichimark]

Originally Posted by Crashbandicoot
http:///forum/post/2581393
All the right and wrong political BS goes out the window when the bullets start flying .

 

[aquaknight]

I will comment on security on campuses, UCF has an ENTIRE police department, employing 60 full time officers. Do I feel safe? You bet, but it's not because of the 60 officers, but because I know events like VT are extremely rare. A lot can happen before an officer arrives even at our campus.
Do I support removing the 'gun-free' zones? Sort of. I really, really don't think anyone that has a gun should be allowed on campus. If there were some advanced (and I do mean thorough) training, then I'd approve.

 

[veni vidi vici]

9 people killed in 36 shootings over the weekend in Chicago
Tuesday, April 22, 2008
By DON BABWIN, Associated Press Writer
In the city limits of Chicago it is Illegal to own ,sell or posses a handgun.Illinois is NOT a CC state and i hope this will change someday.I think students,teachers,moms,dads....everyone should have the right to protect themselves against criminals who could give a rats behind about gun laws....

 

[jmick]

Well you would be wrong .

You assume to know a lot when you admit you don't even know anybody with a gun . Granted I am not the average guy but I have before and wont hesitate to again draw my weapon with the intent of ending a life . Its what the other person does in that split second that saves their life or ends it . But you know what I don't mind cowards like you , Its the whole reason that people like me have jobs . Because we are not affraid to do what needs to be done . I thank god everyday for our military men , police and law enforcement , Doctors and emergancy crews that in the face of danger will rush into the fire when everybody else is headed for the exit , People who will with out thought of personal loss will rush to aid and deffend those that can't and even those that won't (like you jmick) .

I'm the coward because I feel no need to carry a gun? I know I can handle almost every situation I am without feeling a need to kill someone or even need the threat of a gun and I'm smart enough not to put myself into a situation that could cost me my life. I will guarantee you'd never say that to my face and I doubt you'd even be man enough to look me in the eyes. How easy is it for you to hide behind your computer and say things like that, I actually feel bad for you Crash. You cry when people make personal attacks against you (which is easy to do), yet you have no problem tossing around insults. Keep being the lap dog of the board, you're good at it and please invest in a program that has spell check.

 

[fats71]

Originally Posted by AquaKnight
http:///forum/post/2581444
I will comment on security on campuses, UCF has an ENTIRE police department, employing 60 full time officers. Do I feel safe? You bet, but it's not because of the 60 officers, but because I know events like VT are extremely rare. A lot can happen before an officer arrives even at our campus.
Do I support removing the 'gun-free' zones? Sort of. I really, really don't think anyone that has a gun should be allowed on campus. If there were some advanced (and I do mean thorough) training, then I'd approve.
My wife is a UCF grad and saw this thread and read nothing but UCF and got all hopped up lol.

Originally Posted by Crashbandicoot

http:///forum/post/2581393
Well you would be wrong .

You assume to know a lot when you admit you don't even know anybody with a gun . Granted I am not the average guy but I have before and wont hesitate to again draw my weapon with the intent of ending a life . Its what the other person does in that split second that saves their life or ends it . But you know what I don't mind cowards like you , Its the whole reason that people like me have jobs . Because we are not affraid to do what needs to be done . I thank god everyday for our military men , police and law enforcement , Doctors and emergancy crews that in the face of danger will rush into the fire when everybody else is headed for the exit , People who will with out thought of personal loss will rush to aid and deffend those that can't and even those that won't (like you jmick) .

I'm the coward because I feel no need to carry a gun? I will gaurantee you'd never say that to my face and I doubt you'd even be man enough to look me in the eyes. How easy is it for you to hide behind your computer and say things like that, I actually feel bad for you Crash. You cry when people make personal attacks against you (which is easy to do), yet you have no probelm tossing around insults. Keep being the lap dog of the board, you're good at it.
Stop being a PC tough guy Now your just ---- fighting and it is ridiculous. I'm bigger than you and you would not look me in the eye blah blah blah. C'mon man you do not know him nor does he know you so leave that crap at the door and discuss the issues not turn this into some 10 year old romper room...

 

[crashbandicoot]

Well you would be wrong .

You assume to know a lot when you admit you don't even know anybody with a gun . Granted I am not the average guy but I have before and wont hesitate to again draw my weapon with the intent of ending a life . Its what the other person does in that split second that saves their life or ends it . But you know what I don't mind cowards like you , Its the whole reason that people like me have jobs . Because we are not affraid to do what needs to be done . I thank god everyday for our military men , police and law enforcement , Doctors and emergancy crews that in the face of danger will rush into the fire when everybody else is headed for the exit , People who will with out thought of personal loss will rush to aid and deffend those that can't and even those that won't (like you jmick) .
I'm the coward because I feel no need to carry a gun? I will gaurantee you'd never say that to my face and I doubt you'd even be man enough to look me in the eyes. How easy is it for you to hide behind your computer and say things like that, I actually feel bad for you Crash. You cry when people make personal attacks against you (which is easy to do), yet you have no probelm tossing around insults. Keep being the lap dog of the board, you're good at it.

Poor Jmick You really do have no clue . I would have no problem locking eyes with you , I would have no problems dragging you to the ground and cuffing you up . I deal with low life scumbags for a living so a pretty little middle class white boy with a chip on his should isn't in the least bit a threat to me . I deal with the people that scare you . The crack dealer your afraid to look at . The gangbangers making you uneasy while your in the store together . The Street people in your neighbor hood . The junky you wouldn't touch or look at because he might have some icky kooties . So the only real threat you pose is getting in the way of somebody willing to do what your affraid to do .

 

[crashbandicoot]

Originally Posted by Fats71
http:///forum/post/2581594
Stop being a PC tough guy Now your just ---- fighting and it is ridiculous. I'm bigger than you and you would not look me in the eye blah blah blah. C'mon man you do not know him nor does he know you so leave that crap at the door and discuss the issues not turn this into some 10 year old romper room...

You are so right fats .

 

[jmick]

Originally Posted by Crashbandicoot
http:///forum/post/2581393
Well you would be wrong .

You assume to know a lot when you admit you don't even know anybody with a gun . Granted I am not the average guy but I have before and wont hesitate to again draw my weapon with the intent of ending a life . Its what the other person does in that split second that saves their life or ends it . But you know what I don't mind cowards like you , Its the whole reason that people like me have jobs . Because we are not affraid to do what needs to be done . I thank god everyday for our military men , police and law enforcement , Doctors and emergancy crews that in the face of danger will rush into the fire when everybody else is headed for the exit , People who will with out thought of personal loss will rush to aid and deffend those that can't and even those that won't (like you jmick) .
Poor Jmick You really do have no clue . I would have no problem locking eyes with you , I would have no problems dragging you to the ground and cuffing you up . I deal with low life scumbags for a living so a pretty little middle class white boy with a chip on his should isn't in the least bit a threat to me . I deal with the people that scare you . The crack dealer your afraid to look at . The gangbangers making you uneasy while your in the store together . The Street people in your neighbor hood . The junky you wouldn't touch or look at because he might have some icky kooties . So the only real threat you pose is getting in the way of somebody willing to do what your affraid to do .

Locking? Didn't I say Look? After you cuffed me up would you give me big wet kiss

There are no street people in my neighborhood or crack dealers. Gang bangers, I have no problems with them. When I'm in the city on calls a lot of the places I call on have gang bangers working on site and I have to deal with them, they give me no problems. What am I afraid to do (note, afraid only has one f)? Explain, you lost me? Oh, I don't need a gun to protect myself; that's right and because of that I am less of a man

 

[stdreb27]

Originally Posted by Jmick
http:///forum/post/2581576
Locking? Didn't I say Look? After you cuffed me up would you give me big wet kiss

There are no street people in my neighborhood or crack dealers. Gang bangers, I have no problems with them. When I'm in the city on calls a lot of the places I call on have gang bangers working on site and I have to deal with them, they give me no problems. What am I afraid to do (note, afraid only has one f)? Explain, you lost me? Oh, I don't need a gun to protect myself; that's right and because of that I am less of a man

I didn't read all that was said but no one is requiring that everyone has to carry a weapon. But if we as a law biding american citizen want to, we should be able to.

 

[fats71]

How abot you put away your 'e-peen" and get back on topic

 

[crashbandicoot]

Originally Posted by Jmick
http:///forum/post/2581576
Locking? Didn't I say Look? After you cuffed me up would you give me big wet kiss

There are no street people in my neighborhood or crack dealers. Gang bangers, I have no problems with them. When I'm in the city on calls a lot of the places I call on have gang bangers working on site and I have to deal with them, they give me no problems. What am I afraid to do (note, afraid only has one f)? Explain, you lost me? Oh, I don't need a gun to protect myself; that's right and because of that I am less of a man

I can't spell but its ok because I will still go to work tonight and make sure white middle class people like you sleep safe in your beds with no worries .

 

[fats71]

ROFL, Jmick I just looked at your profile and you threatining people is not such a good idea. I mean look you have to have that lady hold you up in the air. I saw it on your profile stop with the "e-peen" and take your nap./