whats wrong w/ america?!

[ophiura]

Originally Posted by seasalt101
the jewish people have been slaves throughout their history, and were even close to being exterminated but they as a whole contribute very positively, because they are taught to excel at anything, and eveything they do, and they do not complain, or have a help the chosen scholarship, or a television network, and there is anti-semitism still, and they are the butt of alot of jokes but they do not complain they just go about there business...tobin
You might find this "interesting." Some of it, at least, should be very disturbing in light of very very recent history, and stands in stark contrast to debating the issue of how many black actors won academy awards.
http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satelli...icle%2FPrinter

 

[shogun323]

Originally Posted by Rylan1
I wasn't including supporting actors.. which is the role we are most subject to.
So I have been sitting back reading through this thread as it progressed and this excerpt caught me. Would you kindly care to elaborate on what you mean by the statement, "the role we are most subject to"?

 

[pontius]

Originally Posted by Rylan1
I knew I forgot somebody, just a slip of the mind.... and yes I could of mentioned Halle Berry... and for Morgan Freeman.. I wasn't including supporting actors.. which is the role we are most subject to. I really don't have time to go into others at this time... because it what take a little research of past winners and years of films. I've seen the films except for the Last King...that a new one...give me a break...
there it goes, 'the role that WE are most subject to". that's an inaccurate statement on a couple of different levels. you say "we" like you are part of this imaginary "black America" that you speak of and you are therefore some kind of spokesman for it. the problem is, when you use such a term as "white America" you are making an assumption that nearly 220 million white Americans are living the same life, having the same experiences and opportunities, and operating by the same set of rules. there are millions of white Americans who have not had the same opportunities that I've had, and there are millions more who've had it a lot better than me. but such a term as "white America" assumes that all white people are in it together like it's some kind of club or conspiracy against other races. using such a blanket term based on stereotypes and pre-judgements is the very definition of racism. same as with a term like "black America" where you assume that because you're black, you speak on behalf of all black Americans and have experienced the same things that all blacks have. these terms are racist terms, and if you believe in their ideologies, then you are racist.
and just as a sidenote, I've never used words like"we" or "my people" to refer
to white Americans. we're all (meaning all Americans) are in it together, so you might as well learn to deal with it or pick a better country.

 

[pontius]

Originally Posted by ophiura
You might find this "interesting." Some of it, at least, should be very disturbing in light of very very recent history, and stands in stark contrast to debating the issue of how many black actors won academy awards.
http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satelli...icle%2FPrinter
what parts are disturbing? a majority of the world outside of the US is anti-semitic and would like to see Israel destroyed. France and Germany (2 European nations) were two of the biggest beneficiaries of Saddam Hussein's regime, so it's understandable that they don't like the US foreign policy in the mideast. most, if not all, of the Arab countries would like to see Israel wiped off the map, so that's not a surprise either.

 

[nigerbang]

There is a book I really think should be read by the majority of ppl in the US..I read it in college....Its called "We were White, We were slaves"
and speaking of history....dig deeper...The illusion of the plantation with 500 slaves is a farce...1 maybe 2 in the entire era of slavery had that many...most was 1 or 2...There were more white slaves than black...They were just called another name which is crazy...To lump black slaves together as slaves while calling the white slaves Indentured Servants...Same difference..why a different name....

 

[pontius]

Originally Posted by NigerBang
There is a book I really think should be read by the majority of ppl in the US..I read it in college....Its called "We were White, We were slaves"
and speaking of history....dig deeper...The illusion of the plantation with 500 slaves is a farce...1 maybe 2 in the entire era of slavery had that many...most was 1 or 2...There were more white slaves than black...They were just called another name which is crazy...To lump black slaves together as slaves while calling the white slaves Indentured Servants...Same difference..why a different name....
that's very true. in SC, the great majority of slaves were owned by just a handful of rich families.

 

[ophiura]

Originally Posted by Pontius
what parts are disturbing? a majority of the world outside of the US is anti-semitic and would like to see Israel destroyed. France and Germany (2 European nations) were two of the biggest beneficiaries of Saddam Hussein's regime, so it's understandable that they don't like the US foreign policy in the mideast. most, if not all, of the Arab countries would like to see Israel wiped off the map, so that's not a surprise either.

Definitely not surprising, but disturbing to me that this can be such recent history and we haven't learned anything, nor does it make much news. We're comparing how many black actors have won academy awards and whether they were supporting actors.

 

[nigerbang]

Originally Posted by ophiura
Definitely not surprising, but disturbing to me that this can be such recent history and we haven't learned anything, nor does it make much news. We're comparing how many black actors have won academy awards and whether they were supporting actors.

I am glad we are...These question about actors are what keep me awake at night and what I truly worry about...Not Gas, War, Famine.....Actors

 

[seasalt101]

and attrocities against slaves did happen VERY RARELY as slaves cost a lot of money, not saying they were treated as guest, but not much abuse as it was detrimental to the work being done...tobin

 

[ophiura]

Well, Hollywood actors and musicians do believe that they know more than you, which is why they can preach to you about all manner of things that they don't do themselves. Many politicians also fall into this. So you should be thinking more about them.
Actually...what is wrong with America? We do think too much about actors and celebrities.

 

[ophiura]

Look, why are we arguing about slavery? Let's not even go down this road of whether they were well treated or not. Come on!
YES it happened
YES according to our current morals it was a terrible thing
There, what does that 'confession' do for ANYONE today? NOTHING.
60 years ago there was a war. Part of that was a methodical attempt to exterminate a race of people. The beliefs that led to it are still very prevalent in parts of the world.
140 years ago there was a war. Part of that, whether stated or not, was a war regarding slavery. The beliefs and practices that led to it are still prevalent in parts of the world.
If the most anyone can point to in the US is the proportion of actors of one race or another...that is, let me say it, pathetic. Just downright pathetic. It demeans people who are truly oppressed in this world.
Try making some real contributions. Lift yourself up by the bootstraps. Make a difference. Believing you can't, or blaming someone else for believing you can't, is nothing more than an excuse to not try IMO.

 

[rylan1]

Originally Posted by Pontius
all these terms, "white America" "black America" "Hispanic America", etc etc are all racist terms because they take on the ideology that there is a different America for different American citizens and you can't provide anything to back that up. 40 years ago, you could, but not now.
one more thing....I work in a job where I deal with all different kinds of people. different races, different ages, people from different economic standings, etc. I have never once heard a black person in their 60s or older complain about how hard they had it growing up. and these are the people alive who actually experienced real racism. the only people I ever hear complaining about racism are the people in your age group, because it's your crutch to blame your problems on somebody else. if you feel excluded, it's most likely your fault more than anybody else's.
Good points by some of you on here. There are bigger issues than movies and so forth, but they all relate to one another and are part of the bigger issue that race is a major problem in this country. Just because you have worked with someone doesnt mean you truly know them... I am not complaining about my childhood... someone mentioned BET, scholarships, and affirmative action and welfare. I feel its my duty to correct that person or at least to let them know about their statements from one who is of a different background. I don't need any crutches, and for another comment about thugs and welfare... you can't tell me that was not a racist remark...however, I can say that there are many more white people on welfare, but again you'll try to spin this. The reality is that there is a different america for everybody espeically along cultural lines, racial lines, and economic lines...what proof do I need to show you?
I believe seasalt mentioned that BET and Black scholarships are reverse racism, which they are not and I gave you proof by telling you reason why they were established. There are scholarships for italian americans, red heads, handicapped people, and so forth...are these reverse racism too?
I am not blaming white people for my current circumstance, for all you know I could be a millionaire. If you'll re-read my post I said you are not responsible for slavery. And for someone to say that africans are just as accountable as slave owners is silly. In my opinion the people who are mostly responding here are shifting the blame... to in some way make them feel better about themselves

 

[pontius]

Originally Posted by ophiura
Definitely not surprising, but disturbing to me that this can be such recent history and we haven't learned anything, nor does it make much news.
well, here's the mideast in a nutshell. you have Israel, who is a civilized and modernized nation that has prospered despite every obstacle that has been thrown at them. then, you have everybody else who are still living in the stone ages. it's hard to attempt to even have a rational discussion with people who are stoning 16 year old girls who commit the grave sin of falling in love with a boy of a different religion or who condone beheading other people.
wasn't Israel formed by the UN? and it's the UN, with the exception of the US, who have wanted to turn their backs on Israel just so they can be attacked and destroyed from all sides.

 

[pontius]

Originally Posted by Rylan1
In my opinion the people who are mostly responding here are shifting the blame... to in some way make them feel better about themselves
exactly, you've been shifting blame to other people to make yourself feel better about your own problems.
even in your last post, you're attributing statements to me that I didn't make. and you justify the welfare argument with "more white people get welfare". yeah, white people are the majority, so what do you expect? per capita, black people get more welfare than whites, but you call that "spin", right?

 

[windmill]

It can all be summed up in one blanketing parental phrase:
"LIFE'S NOT FAIR"
This means everybody's life, at some point in time, may not seem fair. Even though I personally disagree that anybody who makes more than 50K a year per family member ever experiences unfairness.

 

[rylan1]

Originally Posted by seasalt101
and attrocities against slaves did happen VERY RARELY as slaves cost a lot of money, not saying they were treated as guest, but not much abuse as it was detrimental to the work being done...tobin
I hope you are joking.... I see you are from texas and that you may have a southern mentality or you just don't know... but this is sad that you have this opinion. Regardless of where you are from read a book on the topic, a good movie/series is Roots...
Blacks were raped, beaten, killed, simply treated inhumanly. If you want I can recommend some literature. Did you know that there more slaves killed during the route from Africa to America then there were soilders killed in all the modern day American wars? Estimated over 100 million.

 

[seasalt101]

what i was pointing out with the bet and black scholarship points were if a white network got started only showing white only t.v, commercials etc that the black people would scream at the f.c.c. till it was removed, and same with a scholarship for anglos that would be disciminatory, if you think otherwise you are crazy...tobin

 

[ophiura]

Originally Posted by windmill
It can all be summed up in one blanketing parental phrase:
"LIFE'S NOT FAIR"
This means everybody's life, at some point in time, may not seem fair. Even though I personally disagree that anybody who makes more than 50K a year per family member ever experiences unfairness.
In away though it seems you've just made a generalization that supports the fact that pretty much anyone, regardless of income, race, age, etc, can experience unfairness. That comment was not particularly fair in and of itself, IMO. Money doesn't buy that.
What is unfair is often subjective.

 

[seasalt101]

and like stated earlier africans sold africans the spaniards and french did most of the transportation to america and i am familliar with alex haleys book, and movie roots, with my name being tobin i was persecuted as a child because of the slant on the main characters name i was in 7th grade when that came out in a predominately white school, i got in a lot of fights because of that movie, and that movie is fiction...tobin

 

[pontius]

Originally Posted by Rylan1
I hope you are joking.... I see you are from texas and that you may have a southern mentality or you just don't know..
there is one dumb, ignorant statement. ONE person says something you don't like and you attribute it to "southern mentality". how does making such a blind statement make you any better than someone attributing high crime or illiteracy rates to "black mentality". several different times throughout this thread, you've blanketed entire groups of people under rigid terms like "white America" or "southern mentality". these kinds of statements make you no better than the racists that you're supposedly speaking up against.