Concealed Carry

[jovial]

Originally Posted by nietzsche
omg hey lets all be big men and try to save the world by buying guns and running through the streets. oh dang, now terrorism is involved? wow. we should just go buy tanks to protect ourselves againsts terrorism.
seriously, so you really seem to want to be a heroe huh? why dont you do something about it and join the police force?????? or hey what about the military and stay there?
point is anyone can suddenly snap, and hey guess what? they have a higher chance of pulling a gun, why? oh look they have a licence so of course now you have a screwball running with a gun because he snapped.
VIOLENCE ISNT THE ANSWER TO VIOLENCE. man really, most of you come with these stories and i bet you dont live an area where people pull out a gun on you constantly. my gf lives in brooklyn, walks the streets at night with her friends coming home late from school after staying up to do projects for her architecture classes, she knows that 9/11 happpened, but shes not going to be a little wuss and go out and buy a gun. her main source of transportation is the s-u-b-w-a-y (retarded emoticons come up when you say s.u.b.w.a.y) and even though the bombings happened overseas where they attacked the s-u-b-w-a-ys, shes not going to be pushed into fear by something stupid as that, and buying a gun to solve that is stupid. its not like youre going to pull a gun out on a bomb. all she has is mace and thought out plans before venturing out. i always tell her that if shes going to go back at late, ask anyone in the studio to walk back with her. i already said that if you live in that bad of an area then you should carry something, but in reality when someone is going to attack you you wont be ready.
btw, just because gang members have guns dont mean you should. if you ever do get involved in a situation where you pull a gun on someone from a gang, how many more are going to show up at your house to kill your family and you? just because you pulled a gun to be a heroe or to prove something, you all of a sudden put other peoples lives in danger, this being your family. word travels fast through the vines, dont be stupid in getting involved. why would you want to live in an area like that btw?
Sorry but this is total nonsense! Wise up..., criminals seek out those with attitudes such as this.

 

[nietzsche]

Originally Posted by Jovial
Sorry but this is total nonsense! Wise up..., criminals seek out those with attitudes such as this.
okay, whatever you say. so im guessing by now i should have been attacked and mugged huh?

 

[reefraff]

Originally Posted by florida joe
if some one brakes into your house put the first in his chest save the second one no need to fire it
Unless you live in Jersey

 

[jovial]

Originally Posted by nietzsche
okay, whatever you say. so im guessing by now i should have been attacked and mugged huh?
I recently wrote a speech about gun control and what I found really changed my perception of guns. I was surprised to learn that in areas where people are allowed to carry concealed firearms crime and violence actually decreased.
Did you know that the campus at Virgina Tech had a no carry policy when the massacre occured there? A similar incident occured at the Appalachian school of law in 2002, except the outcome was very different due to two students who were allowed to use concealed firearms to stop the gunman.
Did you know that it is mandatory for every household in Switzerland to own a gun yet they have very little crime. The opposite is true in England. Stories of guns being used as a deterent without being fired are very seldom mentioned. If your interested I can provide pages of current factual data and statistics that prove concealed weapons carry is a strong deterrent to crime and violence. Criminals dont buy their guns from sporting goods stores and prefer an unarmed public.

 

[veni vidi vici]

Amendment II
A well regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms, shall not be infringed.
It is your natural born right to protect yourself,and you family. Trained or untrained,smart or dumb.
End of discusion

 

[jovial]

It's hard to trust or rely on the govt or the Police to protect you or your family, why would anyone, this is why the second ammendment is so important. They cant even secure our borders and are simply spread too thin. Ironic, yesterday I listened to a documentary on the use of deadly force . If someone breaks into your house and dosent directly threaten you or another person its hard to win the case if you used deadly force to stop them. If you can hold them at gunpoint until the cops show up your better off but if they flee and dont get caught there is nothing you can do.

 

[nietzsche]

Originally Posted by Jovial
I recently wrote a speech about gun control and what I found really changed my perception of guns. I was surprised to learn that in areas where people are allowed to carry concealed firearms crime and violence actually decreased.
Did you know that the campus at Virgina Tech had a no carry policy when the massacre occured there? A similar incident occured at the Appalachian school of law in 2002, except the outcome was very different due to two students who were allowed to use concealed firearms to stop the gunman.
Did you know that it is mandatory for every household in Switzerland to own a gun yet they have very little crime. The opposite is true in England. Stories of guns being used as a deterent without being fired are very seldom mentioned. If your interested I can provide pages of current factual data and statistics that prove concealed weapons carry is a strong deterrent to crime and violence. Criminals dont buy their guns from sporting goods stores and prefer an unarmed public.
yeah criminals might also go after people they think are weak, when you said that people go after people with attitudes like me, first of all, how does a criminal know what my attitude is? second of all what if im sitting here typing and im a 5'11'' mexican with tats all over my body and weigh a lean 210 lbs?? you think a criminal will come after me? im sorry, but my attitude has gone with me everywhere and ive never been mugged. even across the border walking in reynosa where crime has risen because of drug trafficking. who knows why? ive been to places where its bad, i live close to drug dealers, ive probably stood next to someone who has murdered someone and never knew, here its likely. i still live my life the same and nothing has happened to me even when being confronted by people who want to be tough men and fight. i havent seen anything happen to anyone around me yet, i only hear things happening to others, and most of the time people are involved in things they should have never been involved with in the first place. there have been times where a brand new cadillac escalade with 24" chrome rims with limo tinted windows has parked out infront of my house and stayed there. what happened? someone just got lost and needed to use the phone so they pulled over in our driveway. no big thing.
thats great that those places have worked out, but im sorry, i just dont believe i have to carry any weapons on me or in my house and my family members believe the same, and so does my future wife.

 

[thirty5]

Originally Posted by shogun323
That was MichaelTX's post. Florida has the same law. I wasnt aware of it until I took the course. It really caught me off guard. Florida's laws are probably the most relaxed in the country. I think it is way too easy to get a permit down here. The requirements state that in order to obtain a permit that "one must demonstrate comptency with a firearm." Gun shows exploit this and issue a permit after only firing 1 round. It's rediculous! I took a 200 round course taught by a retired army major/former LEO that lasted 6 hours and heavily focused on the responsilbilities of carrying and the potential reprocussions if you have an incident. I think this should be mandatory. Additionally, I think they should implement a "continuing ed" for permit holders.
Finally someone who has a CC permit and agrees and does not do an end around. FL and TX are very very very lax with thier CC permits. I wish more people were like you and realize that it comes down to TRAINING and really knowing why you are carrying a gun.

 

[thirty5]

Originally Posted by florida joe
if some one brakes into your house put the first in his chest save the second one no need to fire it

I do believe that that was a joke, and i agree, but have to comment.
If anyone here, even myself and any military even think that you having a gun will stop someone that breaks into your house, you are definatly drinking way too much kool-aid.
If you are asleep and someone gets into your house and is now in your room and you awake to it, there is NO WAY IN HELL that you are going to be able to have your wepon out to defend yourself. You are gonna be so messed up from waking up that there is no way that you can SAFELY shoot a wepon. And unless you keep the gun loaded and under your pillow you will in no way be able to get it in time. I personally keep my gun loaded at all time being that i carry it off duty. But it remains LOCKED! in my safe in my closet about 15 feet from my bed.
I do have a 95 lb German Shepard (not a police dog unfortunatly ) so she if she starts to get her little growl going or any bark then i am up and one time i actually ran in the DARK into my closet keyed in the right combo and had my gun in my hand and i was not even awake fully yet. It turned out that there were a couple kids jumping fences through the yards. But it kinda scared me when i woke up and i saw that laser pointing at the walls as i walked through my house. I was like wow and i am not even awake.

 

[thirty5]

Originally Posted by Veni Vidi Vici
Amendment II
A well regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms, shall not be infringed.
It is your natural born right to protect yourself,and you family. Trained or untrained,smart or dumb.
End of discusion

HAHAHAH
In my job i do have to uphold the constitution which i do. But don't have to really believe in it. And this is one that I don't believe in, not fully at least.
Do i believe that people should have the right to OWN a wepon to protect themselves in their home, YES! But CC is different.
Here in NJ if you dont already know. That people "have the duty to retreat" unless there is no way to retreat. Meaning that if you are being a victim of a crime and you can just drive away then you SHALL! You are not allowed to stand your ground and fight if you have a way of flight. The only ones who may push forward and fight are the cops. Like or dislike, that is the way that it is. This techinally also applies to your home. I do not believe that, i will never retreat from my own home, even though i dont have too (being a police officer).
You know the old saying shoot the person outside, then drag them inside and put a knife in their hand. (just watch where the puddles of blood are)

But this militia crap was deisigned or HUNDREDS of years ago, cause a militia did take this country over from the RED COATS, so they had to make it legal for a milita to be around.
I would like to say that I am actually enjoying this thread, good discussion, except when people come on and just say STUPID things......

 

[thirty5]

Originally Posted by Jovial
It's hard to trust or rely on the govt or the Police to protect you or your family, why would anyone, this is why the second ammendment is so important. They cant even secure our borders and are simply spread too thin. Ironic, yesterday I listened to a documentary on the use of deadly force . If someone breaks into your house and dosent directly threaten you or another person its hard to win the case if you used deadly force to stop them. If you can hold them at gunpoint until the cops show up your better off but if they flee and dont get caught there is nothing you can do.
Im glad you posed this.... I stated this earlier in a post, and truthfully I don't think that people believed me. There are people here that called me a "wannabe hero". I am a police officer and i have to say that I know my job pretty well. I am here trying to teach people the way that it is. Yes protect yourself but make sure that you do it correctly, cause in the long run you may have protected yourself but you may be the one that ends up in jail or losing your house.
Personal protection def is important, what i dont think that anyone in their "right mind" should be protecting is property. GIVE IT UP! Why risk your life or being injured over a walled, purse, necklace, or CAR.

 

[nigerbang]

Originally Posted by DeltaBlack22
You might be referring to Kennesaw, GA? ...
I live about 15 minutes from Kennesaw...Plenty of crime there....Trust me...
I carry a weapon everyday....At work though..I am a surveyor...I have it with me in the woods..Gotta watch the snakes and other critters...And I have it with me when I work in "not so good areas"..How was it put earlier..Where no normal person has reason to be unless looking for Urban Goods..something like that..

 

[florida joe]

OK so you are out of town your wife is at home with the kids she hears a noise in the middle of the night gets up to investigate and a stranger is standing over your child’s bed, gun or frying pan I vote for gun any day

 

[shogun323]

Originally Posted by florida joe
OK so you are out of town your wife is at home with the kids she hears a noise in the middle of the night gets up to investigate and a stranger is standing over your child’s bed, gun or frying pan I vote for gun any day
Absolutely, that person is commiting a forceable felony in your home against your child. In Florida we have the "castle doctrine" which says we can light 'em up!!!

 

[nietzsche]

Originally Posted by thirty5
Im glad you posed this.... I stated this earlier in a post, and truthfully I don't think that people believed me. There are people here that called me a "wannabe hero". I am a police officer and i have to say that I know my job pretty well. I am here trying to teach people the way that it is. Yes protect yourself but make sure that you do it correctly, cause in the long run you may have protected yourself but you may be the one that ends up in jail or losing your house.
Personal protection def is important, what i dont think that anyone in their "right mind" should be protecting is property. GIVE IT UP! Why risk your life or being injured over a walled, purse, necklace, or CAR.
unfortunately people dont see it that way and they think youre a pansy for letting someone take something stupid as your wallet or necklace.
and again, unfortunately, there probably are people who do keep a gun loaded near their bed and might fire it accidentally. last i heard, a little 4 year old shot himself in the leg because his grandfather had his shotgun in the closet and the little boy's mom was cleaning around and forgot to close the closet. it was somehting like that.
i dont think people are trained enough like you are and all they care about is having a gun to shoot someone or to feel like they are protected by something they dont know how to use under pressure

 

[thirty5]

Originally Posted by florida joe
OK so you are out of town your wife is at home with the kids she hears a noise in the middle of the night gets up to investigate and a stranger is standing over your child’s bed, gun or frying pan I vote for gun any day
I agree with you for me, for my wife NO. In her case i would bet that 99% she would hit the guy with the frying pan.
People still dont realize how hard it is to shoot something. In the heat of the moment, heart pounding. adrenaline FLOWING. There is a better chance that you will miss unless you are point blank. Even 15 feet is far away for someone who does not really have any experience. Now you shoot and miss from 15 feet and you hit your child?? You swing a bat or frying pan better chance that if you miss the crib will stop that item, wont stop a bullet.
I wish that we were all local people to each other, and we could get to a range and do some real excercises to see how difficult it really is.
And shooting standing still, controlled breathing, no distractions, anyone can hit a paper target. I bet if you were to point your gun at someone a majority of the people would have a hard time pulling the trigger unless you really are in DANGER FOR YOUR LIFE. Some of the examples here of when people would shoot are jus stupid, You say you would shoot i would bet that you would not.

 

[thirty5]

Originally Posted by nietzsche
unfortunately people dont see it that way and they think youre a pansy for letting someone take something stupid as your wallet or necklace.
and again, unfortunately, there probably are people who do keep a gun loaded near their bed and might fire it accidentally. last i heard, a little 4 year old shot himself in the leg because his grandfather had his shotgun in the closet and the little boy's mom was cleaning around and forgot to close the closet. it was somehting like that.
i dont think people are trained enough like you are and all they care about is having a gun to shoot someone or to feel like they are protected by something they dont know how to use under pressure
Ya know im surprised I didnt even think of that. "RESPONSIBLE" people will always keep the weapon LOCKED UP. I personally keep mine locked up.
Im sure people have read stories about a kid shooting another kid cause they found daddy's loaded gun. But it is horrific to me to even think about it.
I personally think that it is more important for me to protect my children by makins sure that you never leave a gun where someone who is not allowed can get access to it. And I know that people say that they are responsible, but remember it only takes ONE time for someone to get injured. We are getting a little off CC but this is important.

 

[veni vidi vici]

Originally Posted by thirty5
HAHAHAH
In my job i do have to uphold the constitution which i do. But don't have to really believe in it. And this is one that I don't believe in, not fully at least.
It is my job to make sure my family is safe ,ANYWHERE i go.Not
just inside the walls of my home.It is also my duty as an american citizen to obey the laws of this country.Some of which i think are intrusive to my rights as a american citizen.And i bielive that any gun legislation is intrusive. For instance, in the city of Chicago it is illegal to buy,sell and possese a hand gun.IMO i think this is a travesty and illegal.And by the way it has done nothing for the crime rate ,unless you are a criminal,then its free pickens.
Im just curious though,how many cases of law abideing citizens protecting there lifes or the lives of there family with the use of deadly force have you seen where the citizen has been charged with a crime inside or outside the home? And then how many cases have you seen where a criminal was charged with a violent crime against a person or persons resulting in the death of that person or persons for no other reason other than to take alittle bit of money,or a car,or for no reason at all?
Amendment II
A well regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms, shall not be infringed.
Im asking myself this now"security of a free state " security from who? A invadeing army? Or someone trying to mess with MY constitution and my god givin rights of life and liberty.
Like i said before
YOU CAN PRY MY GUN OUT OF MY COLD DEAD HAND

 

[nietzsche]

Originally Posted by thirty5
Ya know im surprised I didnt even think of that. "RESPONSIBLE" people will always keep the weapon LOCKED UP. I personally keep mine locked up.
Im sure people have read stories about a kid shooting another kid cause they found daddy's loaded gun. But it is horrific to me to even think about it.
I personally think that it is more important for me to protect my children by makins sure that you never leave a gun where someone who is not allowed can get access to it. And I know that people say that they are responsible, but remember it only takes ONE time for someone to get injured. We are getting a little off CC but this is important.
its not off topic, its just part of the responsibility that comes with owning a gun, and just as there are many people who are responsible, there are many more who are not and put their own family in danger, even though its something they wanted to prevent
and i agree with you on shooting under pressure, thats how it is and people refuse to believe that they cant shoot under extreme conditions.

 

[thirty5]

Originally Posted by Veni Vidi Vici
It is my job to make sure my family is safe ,ANYWHERE i go.Not
just inside the walls of my home.It is also my duty as an american citizen to obey the laws of this country.Some of which i think are intrusive to my rights as a american citizen.And i bielive that any gun legislation is intrusive. For instance, in the city of Chicago it is illegal to buy,sell and possese a hand gun.IMO i think this is a travesty and illegal.And by the way it has done nothing for the crime rate ,unless you are a criminal,then its free pickens.
Im just curious though,how many cases of law abideing citizens protecting there lifes or the lives of there family with the use of deadly force have you seen where the citizen has been charged with a crime inside or outside the home? And then how many cases have you seen where a criminal was charged with a violent crime against a person or persons resulting in the death of that person or persons for no other reason other than to take alittle bit of money,or a car,or for no reason at all?
Amendment II
A well regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms, shall not be infringed.
Im asking myself this now"security of a free state " security from who? A invadeing army? Or someone trying to mess with MY constitution and my god givin rights of life and liberty.
Like i said before
YOU CAN PRY MY GUN OUT OF MY COLD DEAD HAND

This thread can go back and forth because there are people who are FAR off on one side and far off on the other. You are far off on one side. Saying that it infringes on your rights. The constitution was written a long time ago and should be re-written. You are against gun control, the way I am reading your posts is that you feel that a criminal should be allowed to walk into 7-11 and get a gun cause they have a kid. And ya know when he is dealing his crack and storing it in his kids diapers that he might have to defend his kid. That is how bizarre some people are. People who think that it is their right to have a gun are the same people who think that it is their right to have a driver's license.
My feeling is that noone should have the "right" to have a gun. If you want a gun you should have to prove that you are able to be responsible and that you can safely have it, and mostly be able to be proficient in using it.
I read before that someone posted that they "had" a cc permit until they got into trouble. But that soone he will be able to get it back. I that responsible. Should he be able to carry a gun if it was taken away.??