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jdragunas
Guest
how about forgiveness and redemption, does that person not have the right to repent for their sins and turn their life around?
Death Row to Harsh? what you guys think
- Thread starter caomt
- Start date
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jdragunas
Guest
Originally Posted by Darth Tang
It also says "an eye for an eye"...............
this is taken out of context...
It also says "an eye for an eye"...............
this is taken out of context...
darth tang
Active Member
"Whoso sheddeth man's blood, by man shall his blood be shed: for in the image of God made he man."
Genesis 9:6
Genesis 9:6
darth tang
Active Member
It clearly states god has decreed that man shall punish man for murder with the same act. The only individuals in the bible to stay the hand of death for crimes punishable by death by god's laws was GOD and Jesus Christ. What does that tell you?
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jdragunas
Guest
you can throw all the quotes you want at me, i still think it is not our right or duty to kill people for their crimes... imprison them for life, yes, but not to kill them. And if the tax dollars is such a big deal, maybe they shouldn't give prisoners a life in the lap of luxury... the bare necessities to survive is all they need... no cable TV and all of the crap they give them...
darth tang
Active Member
Originally Posted by jdragunas
how about forgiveness and redemption, does that person not have the right to repent for their sins and turn their life around?
The thief on the cross with jesus repented and asked for forgiveness. Jesus forgave him and stated he would be in the kingdom of heaven with him. Yet Jesus did not spare his life.......why?
how about forgiveness and redemption, does that person not have the right to repent for their sins and turn their life around?
The thief on the cross with jesus repented and asked for forgiveness. Jesus forgave him and stated he would be in the kingdom of heaven with him. Yet Jesus did not spare his life.......why?
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jdragunas
Guest
I do believe, however, that there are people appointed by god to kill evil... but that's a different story.
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jdragunas
Guest
because the guy didn't ask for his life to be spared...
puffer24/7
Active Member
Originally Posted by jdragunas
how about forgiveness and redemption, does that person not have the right to repent for their sins and turn their life around?
child malesters keep on doing the same thing over and over until they are put to death, also ur telling me than bin laden has the right to repent for his sins, all of america backs me up on this one HELL NO
how about forgiveness and redemption, does that person not have the right to repent for their sins and turn their life around?
child malesters keep on doing the same thing over and over until they are put to death, also ur telling me than bin laden has the right to repent for his sins, all of america backs me up on this one HELL NO
darth tang
Active Member
Originally Posted by jdragunas
you can throw all the quotes you want at me, i still think it is not our right or duty to kill people for their crimes... imprison them for life, yes, but not to kill them. And if the tax dollars is such a big deal, maybe they shouldn't give prisoners a life in the lap of luxury... the bare necessities to survive is all they need... no cable TV and all of the crap they give them...
Wait a minute, you were using scripture as your basis. Now that I have shown you how scripture approves, you state you don't care? Why even use the defense in the first place? Don't take offense...I am just trying to understand why some people use something as their reasoning and when shown it isn't exactly correct they still refuse to even consider the other possibilty.
you can throw all the quotes you want at me, i still think it is not our right or duty to kill people for their crimes... imprison them for life, yes, but not to kill them. And if the tax dollars is such a big deal, maybe they shouldn't give prisoners a life in the lap of luxury... the bare necessities to survive is all they need... no cable TV and all of the crap they give them...
Wait a minute, you were using scripture as your basis. Now that I have shown you how scripture approves, you state you don't care? Why even use the defense in the first place? Don't take offense...I am just trying to understand why some people use something as their reasoning and when shown it isn't exactly correct they still refuse to even consider the other possibilty.
darth tang
Active Member
Originally Posted by jdragunas
because the guy didn't ask for his life to be spared...
The other thief asked and he wasn't spared.....why?
because the guy didn't ask for his life to be spared...
The other thief asked and he wasn't spared.....why?
darth tang
Active Member
Jen, I am still waiting your bin laden thoughts.
tangman99
Active Member
Originally Posted by Darth Tang
Tang man. It is nice getting a percpective on prisons from someone on the inside. From the way you describe it, death row itself is no cake walk when compared to those that get life sentences. Now if we treated all life sentence people the way we treat the death row one's I would be fine withou a death penalty......but I wonder how much THAT would cost.
That was my life for a long time. Not a bad job really if you can handle it. There are just so many misconceptions of how prison really is that most people can speak intelligently about it. Most prisons are majority open dormitories just like the military. It is like living in a small city that you just can't leave. They have gymnasiums, churches, recreation facilites with weights, tracks, softball fields, etc. Each prison has a lock down facility but usually for temporary disciplinary housing, protective custody or investigations.
The facility I worked at with Death row was unique in that we did not have any open dormitories. All of our housing was cellblocks (actually one huge building with 13 wings) and we housed the worst inmates in the state. We had about 1400 inmates of which about 75% were 24 hour lockdown. The others were there to work the kitchens, laundry and house cleaning. A little over 300 were death row and about 500+ were what we called Close Management I and Close Management II. CMII was the tightest security we had next to death row. These are the ones that are severe disciplinary problems and are the worst wings to work. If you made it to CMII, it took up to 2 years of no incidents just to get moved down to CMI. These have nothing to do with how much time you are serving. We had them that were serving a couple of years but liked to assault officers.
Most movies are poor depictions of what a prison is really like. If you really want the most accurate depiction of what it is really like, the best movie that most closely resembles it is Shawshank Redemption.
Tang man. It is nice getting a percpective on prisons from someone on the inside. From the way you describe it, death row itself is no cake walk when compared to those that get life sentences. Now if we treated all life sentence people the way we treat the death row one's I would be fine withou a death penalty......but I wonder how much THAT would cost.
That was my life for a long time. Not a bad job really if you can handle it. There are just so many misconceptions of how prison really is that most people can speak intelligently about it. Most prisons are majority open dormitories just like the military. It is like living in a small city that you just can't leave. They have gymnasiums, churches, recreation facilites with weights, tracks, softball fields, etc. Each prison has a lock down facility but usually for temporary disciplinary housing, protective custody or investigations.
The facility I worked at with Death row was unique in that we did not have any open dormitories. All of our housing was cellblocks (actually one huge building with 13 wings) and we housed the worst inmates in the state. We had about 1400 inmates of which about 75% were 24 hour lockdown. The others were there to work the kitchens, laundry and house cleaning. A little over 300 were death row and about 500+ were what we called Close Management I and Close Management II. CMII was the tightest security we had next to death row. These are the ones that are severe disciplinary problems and are the worst wings to work. If you made it to CMII, it took up to 2 years of no incidents just to get moved down to CMI. These have nothing to do with how much time you are serving. We had them that were serving a couple of years but liked to assault officers.
Most movies are poor depictions of what a prison is really like. If you really want the most accurate depiction of what it is really like, the best movie that most closely resembles it is Shawshank Redemption.
darth tang
Active Member
I have a friend that works in corrections here. He says much of the same things you do about criminal privleges.
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jdragunas
Guest
The other theif wasn't spared because he didn't repent.
and YES, even bin laden has the right to repent for his sins... everyone on the earth has that right.
and as for that bible quote you used, i again believe it's been taken out of context.
and if it's ok for the government to take lives, why is it so looked down on when another civilian takes a life? That's double standards...
and YES, even bin laden has the right to repent for his sins... everyone on the earth has that right.
and as for that bible quote you used, i again believe it's been taken out of context.
and if it's ok for the government to take lives, why is it so looked down on when another civilian takes a life? That's double standards...
tangman99
Active Member
Originally Posted by jdragunas
we do, because the bible doesn't say "thou shalt not punish criminals for their wrongdoings", however it does say "thou shalt not kill"...
Well, all I can say is if that is a fact then God sure set a good example when he wipe out Sodom and Gamorah for a little to much partying (and other things) and didn't he wipe out the whole world except for Noah and few choses animals just because the world was wicked? I'm not trying to open a religious debate and let's please not go there. Those never go anywhere.
we do, because the bible doesn't say "thou shalt not punish criminals for their wrongdoings", however it does say "thou shalt not kill"...
Well, all I can say is if that is a fact then God sure set a good example when he wipe out Sodom and Gamorah for a little to much partying (and other things) and didn't he wipe out the whole world except for Noah and few choses animals just because the world was wicked? I'm not trying to open a religious debate and let's please not go there. Those never go anywhere.
puffer24/7
Active Member
Originally Posted by jdragunas
The other theif wasn't spared because he didn't repent.
and YES, even bin laden has the right to repent for his sins... everyone on the earth has that right.
and as for that bible quote you used, i again believe it's been taken out of context.
and if it's ok for the government to take lives, why is it so looked down on when another civilian takes a life? That's double standards...
not at all, when a man kills another man for twenty bucks and ruins his family forever and your tellin me thats the same as giving him the lethal injection, and for bin laden he can never repent his sins bc he believes that is what he does reaks havoc among many people and believes his god wanted him to do that, he is a whack job end of story
The other theif wasn't spared because he didn't repent.
and YES, even bin laden has the right to repent for his sins... everyone on the earth has that right.
and as for that bible quote you used, i again believe it's been taken out of context.
and if it's ok for the government to take lives, why is it so looked down on when another civilian takes a life? That's double standards...
not at all, when a man kills another man for twenty bucks and ruins his family forever and your tellin me thats the same as giving him the lethal injection, and for bin laden he can never repent his sins bc he believes that is what he does reaks havoc among many people and believes his god wanted him to do that, he is a whack job end of story
darth tang
Active Member
Originally Posted by jdragunas
The other theif wasn't spared because he didn't repent.
and YES, even bin laden has the right to repent for his sins... everyone on the earth has that right.
and as for that bible quote you used, i again believe it's been taken out of context.
and if it's ok for the government to take lives, why is it so looked down on when another civilian takes a life? That's double standards...
So for example Tookie Williams. Not once did he repent or express remorse, even at the end. Should he have been put to death?
Bin laden has threatened with more death...doesn't seem very remorseful or likely to repent.
If you want I will post the entire section the Genesis verse is from. It is NOT out of context. Again, if sparing life for a captal punishment was what God or Jesus wanted, they would have done it to both thieves whether they asked or not.
Our government takes a life for punishment or when at war, and only when fired upon first in war circumstances. A murder takes a life for selfish reason unprovoked. There is a slight difference.
The other theif wasn't spared because he didn't repent.
and YES, even bin laden has the right to repent for his sins... everyone on the earth has that right.
and as for that bible quote you used, i again believe it's been taken out of context.
and if it's ok for the government to take lives, why is it so looked down on when another civilian takes a life? That's double standards...
So for example Tookie Williams. Not once did he repent or express remorse, even at the end. Should he have been put to death?
Bin laden has threatened with more death...doesn't seem very remorseful or likely to repent.
If you want I will post the entire section the Genesis verse is from. It is NOT out of context. Again, if sparing life for a captal punishment was what God or Jesus wanted, they would have done it to both thieves whether they asked or not.
Our government takes a life for punishment or when at war, and only when fired upon first in war circumstances. A murder takes a life for selfish reason unprovoked. There is a slight difference.
darth tang
Active Member
9:1
And God blessed Noah and his sons, and said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth.
9:2
And the fear of you and the dread of you shall be upon every beast of the earth, and upon every fowl of the air, upon all that moveth upon the earth, and upon all the fishes of the sea; into your hand are they delivered.
9:3
Every moving thing that liveth shall be meat for you; even as the green herb have I given you all things.
9:4
But flesh with the life thereof, which is the blood thereof, shall ye not eat.
9:5
And surely your blood of your lives will I require; at the hand of every beast will I require it, and at the hand of man; at the hand of every man's brother will I require the life of man.
9:6
Whoso sheddeth man's blood, by man shall his blood be shed: for in the image of God made he man.
9:7
And you, be ye fruitful, and multiply; bring forth abundantly in the earth, and multiply therein.
9:8
And God spake unto Noah, and to his sons with him, saying,
9:9
And I, behold, I establish my covenant with you, and with your seed after you;
9:10
And with every living creature that is with you, of the fowl, of the cattle, and of every beast of the earth with you; from all that go out of the ark, to every beast of the earth.
9:11
And I will establish my covenant with you, neither shall all flesh be cut off any more by the waters of a flood; neither shall there any more be a flood to destroy the earth.
And God blessed Noah and his sons, and said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth.
9:2
And the fear of you and the dread of you shall be upon every beast of the earth, and upon every fowl of the air, upon all that moveth upon the earth, and upon all the fishes of the sea; into your hand are they delivered.
9:3
Every moving thing that liveth shall be meat for you; even as the green herb have I given you all things.
9:4
But flesh with the life thereof, which is the blood thereof, shall ye not eat.
9:5
And surely your blood of your lives will I require; at the hand of every beast will I require it, and at the hand of man; at the hand of every man's brother will I require the life of man.
9:6
Whoso sheddeth man's blood, by man shall his blood be shed: for in the image of God made he man.
9:7
And you, be ye fruitful, and multiply; bring forth abundantly in the earth, and multiply therein.
9:8
And God spake unto Noah, and to his sons with him, saying,
9:9
And I, behold, I establish my covenant with you, and with your seed after you;
9:10
And with every living creature that is with you, of the fowl, of the cattle, and of every beast of the earth with you; from all that go out of the ark, to every beast of the earth.
9:11
And I will establish my covenant with you, neither shall all flesh be cut off any more by the waters of a flood; neither shall there any more be a flood to destroy the earth.
J
jdragunas
Guest
how do you know that tookie williams wouldn't have repented had he been given more time?
And how do you know that bin laden won't repent. You cannot and never will. It's impossible to be able to tell that becaus we're not giving these people the chance...
And you're not listening to me!!! GOD AND JESUS HAVE THE RIGHT TO TAKE LIVES BECAUSE THEY'RE GOD AND JESUS!!!! we do not, because we are not... end of story
and i'm not going to comment on the government and their right to take lives in the form of punishment or war...
and not all murderers take lives for a selfish reason. What about the ones that say they were told by god to take the life of another? what about the ones that take anothers life because they believed the other was evil? They still get the same punishment as rapists and child molestors, but their motives weren't selfish.
And how do you know that bin laden won't repent. You cannot and never will. It's impossible to be able to tell that becaus we're not giving these people the chance...
And you're not listening to me!!! GOD AND JESUS HAVE THE RIGHT TO TAKE LIVES BECAUSE THEY'RE GOD AND JESUS!!!! we do not, because we are not... end of story
and i'm not going to comment on the government and their right to take lives in the form of punishment or war...
and not all murderers take lives for a selfish reason. What about the ones that say they were told by god to take the life of another? what about the ones that take anothers life because they believed the other was evil? They still get the same punishment as rapists and child molestors, but their motives weren't selfish.