Do you believe in evolution?
- Thread starter darknes
- Start date
socal57che
Active Member
Originally Posted by 1journeyman
God could have spoke and unicorns could have ridden out of Heaven and sprinlked fairy dust on the earth, giving rise to large eggs popping out of the ground, which hatched into goghers whivh began to mate and create new life.
A goofy example, but... you get the point.
Just a reminder......unicorns are mentioned in...
1. Twice in Numbers
2. Once in Deuteronomy
3. Twice in Job
4. In three different Psalms
5. Once in Isaiah
Maye not such a goofy example, although we all know gophers grow on trees. (not from eggs)
God could have spoke and unicorns could have ridden out of Heaven and sprinlked fairy dust on the earth, giving rise to large eggs popping out of the ground, which hatched into goghers whivh began to mate and create new life.
A goofy example, but... you get the point.
Just a reminder......unicorns are mentioned in...
1. Twice in Numbers
2. Once in Deuteronomy
3. Twice in Job
4. In three different Psalms
5. Once in Isaiah
Maye not such a goofy example, although we all know gophers grow on trees. (not from eggs)
ophiura
Active Member
Originally Posted by MIKE22cha
All I got to say is that Darwin himself said his "theory"(which isn't a theory because it can't be tested and stand the test of time which is the scientific defintion for theory) was highly unlikely.
Sorry, this is often a "revisionist" argument and fails to consider an important fact.
Remember that they had an inaccurate concept of genetics at the time. His understanding of genetics was a "blending." That if you had a favorable trait in an animal, and it reproduced with an animal lacking it, that the trait would be diluted 50%. He realized this was not long enough and would not sustain the trait...rather it would be lost in only a few short generations.
However, our knowledge of genetics is FAR different now. He was very close, of course, as Mendel's research was at a similar time. I have often joked, but maybe not
that Mendel was blessed by God - a monk, choosing the absolute best type of plant to study, keeping meticulous notes and having a basic grasp of numbers??? Wow.)
So this "Darwin thought he was wrong" idea is not accurate. He doubted it based on limited knowledge at the time.
All I got to say is that Darwin himself said his "theory"(which isn't a theory because it can't be tested and stand the test of time which is the scientific defintion for theory) was highly unlikely.
Sorry, this is often a "revisionist" argument and fails to consider an important fact.
Remember that they had an inaccurate concept of genetics at the time. His understanding of genetics was a "blending." That if you had a favorable trait in an animal, and it reproduced with an animal lacking it, that the trait would be diluted 50%. He realized this was not long enough and would not sustain the trait...rather it would be lost in only a few short generations.
However, our knowledge of genetics is FAR different now. He was very close, of course, as Mendel's research was at a similar time. I have often joked, but maybe not
So this "Darwin thought he was wrong" idea is not accurate. He doubted it based on limited knowledge at the time.
socal57che
Active Member
Originally Posted by Jovial
Interesting thread, Im actually learning something from it.
This is one of, i not THE most intelligent post in this entire thread.
I applaud you, sir.
Interesting thread, Im actually learning something from it.
This is one of, i not THE most intelligent post in this entire thread.
I applaud you, sir.
A
awakened2life
Guest
Let me make one thing clear.
Scientists(falsely so called) date the bones by where they are found in the geological column which is based on: older on bottom younger on top(which is not true). and they date the columns by how old the bones are.
And I'd like to see some flak on the star issue:
There are 70 sextillion visible stars but no one has ever seen one born, only die.
they say if 20 stars explode around space dust it could compact it into a new star but then we would lose 20 to gain one.
in 20 billion years or so there would have to be millions of stars born each day to reach 70 sextillion. only dieing stars
Scientists(falsely so called) date the bones by where they are found in the geological column which is based on: older on bottom younger on top(which is not true). and they date the columns by how old the bones are.
And I'd like to see some flak on the star issue:
There are 70 sextillion visible stars but no one has ever seen one born, only die.
they say if 20 stars explode around space dust it could compact it into a new star but then we would lose 20 to gain one.
in 20 billion years or so there would have to be millions of stars born each day to reach 70 sextillion. only dieing stars
ozmar
Member
Originally Posted by socal57che
Just a reminder......unicorns are mentioned in...
1. Twice in Numbers
2. Once in Deuteronomy
3. Twice in Job
4. In three different Psalms
5. Once in Isaiah
Maye not such a goofy example, although we all know gophers grow on trees. (not from eggs)
Please quote chapter and verse. That would constitute proof. I think someone is tossing about promises of big rewards for such.
Without the quotation, I call your bluff: there are no unicorns mentioned in the Bible! You made that up! (Or you're repeating something someone else made up.)
Ozmar the Skeptic
Just a reminder......unicorns are mentioned in...
1. Twice in Numbers
2. Once in Deuteronomy
3. Twice in Job
4. In three different Psalms
5. Once in Isaiah
Maye not such a goofy example, although we all know gophers grow on trees. (not from eggs)
Please quote chapter and verse. That would constitute proof. I think someone is tossing about promises of big rewards for such.
Without the quotation, I call your bluff: there are no unicorns mentioned in the Bible! You made that up! (Or you're repeating something someone else made up.)
Ozmar the Skeptic
ozmar
Member
Originally Posted by kjr_trig
But religion has given us plenty of wars!!!
There is good religion, and bad religion.
War is, sadly, a human condition. And all reasons have been brought to bear to support engaging in it.
As an aside, purely "secular" ideologies have been responsible for more death or suffering in all human history than all religions combined. I offer, as proof, the genocidal campaigns of the 20th century: World War 2 (caused by the secular totalitarian ambitions of Hitler, Mussolini, Tojo, etc...), Nazism (responsible for 6+ million deaths in the Holocaust alone, to say nothing of being the primary ideology that drove WW2), Communism (50+ million killed by Stalin over half a century), Maoism, the Khmer Rouge, the Kim Jong "Ilk" of North Korea, etc...
Although religion has been the cause celebre of many evil people throughout history (cf. Islamofascism today), don't make the mistake of conflating evils done in the name of God with the great good that religion has brought to civilization.
Good religion has been a tremendous force for stability, peace, humanitarianism, ethical and moral development, and, yes, even scientific and philosophical progress.
Ozmar the Pro-Religion
But religion has given us plenty of wars!!!
There is good religion, and bad religion.
War is, sadly, a human condition. And all reasons have been brought to bear to support engaging in it.
As an aside, purely "secular" ideologies have been responsible for more death or suffering in all human history than all religions combined. I offer, as proof, the genocidal campaigns of the 20th century: World War 2 (caused by the secular totalitarian ambitions of Hitler, Mussolini, Tojo, etc...), Nazism (responsible for 6+ million deaths in the Holocaust alone, to say nothing of being the primary ideology that drove WW2), Communism (50+ million killed by Stalin over half a century), Maoism, the Khmer Rouge, the Kim Jong "Ilk" of North Korea, etc...
Although religion has been the cause celebre of many evil people throughout history (cf. Islamofascism today), don't make the mistake of conflating evils done in the name of God with the great good that religion has brought to civilization.
Good religion has been a tremendous force for stability, peace, humanitarianism, ethical and moral development, and, yes, even scientific and philosophical progress.
Ozmar the Pro-Religion
kjr_trig
Active Member
Originally Posted by Ozmar
There is good religion, and bad religion.
Ozmar the Pro-Religion
Good religion and bad religion....c'mon....I assume you consider your religion to be "the good", right? Whom exactly do you think considers their religion to be "the bad". The problem with religion is everyone considers theirs to be "the good religion", thats where the wars come from. How arrogant of you.
There is good religion, and bad religion.
Ozmar the Pro-Religion
Good religion and bad religion....c'mon....I assume you consider your religion to be "the good", right? Whom exactly do you think considers their religion to be "the bad". The problem with religion is everyone considers theirs to be "the good religion", thats where the wars come from. How arrogant of you.
reefreak29
Active Member
Originally Posted by kjr_trig
Good religion and bad religion....c'mon....I assume you consider your religion to be "the good", right? Whom exactly do you think considers their religion to be "the bad". The problem with religion is everyone considers theirs to be "the good religion", thats where the wars come from. How arrogant of you.
satanisms bad
Good religion and bad religion....c'mon....I assume you consider your religion to be "the good", right? Whom exactly do you think considers their religion to be "the bad". The problem with religion is everyone considers theirs to be "the good religion", thats where the wars come from. How arrogant of you.
satanisms bad
jerthunter
Active Member
Originally Posted by AwAkeNeD2LifE
Let me make one thing clear.
Scientists(falsely so called) date the bones by where they are found in the geological column which is based on: older on bottom younger on top(which is not true). and they date the columns by how old the bones are.
And I'd like to see some flak on the star issue:
There are 70 sextillion visible stars but no one has ever seen one born, only die.
they say if 20 stars explode around space dust it could compact it into a new star but then we would lose 20 to gain one.
in 20 billion years or so there would have to be millions of stars born each day to reach 70 sextillion. only dieing stars
Well I'm no geologist but my base level knowledge of how they date bones is this.
They look for certain layers of rock, not just any layer, but layers like volcanic layers. They make the crazy assumption that stuff between the two layers of volcanic rock must have gotten there after the one layer formed and before the second formed. They then try to date these layers using isotopes and our knowledge of the halflifes of isotopes.
You claimed that they only determine the age of the rock column by the age of the bones, which is not really true. Occationally they do not have nice layers of rock that they can date for whatever reason but if enough data is gathered about a certain species from areas that can be dated they use that as a reference to estimate the age of the region they are looking in.
Let me make one thing clear.
Scientists(falsely so called) date the bones by where they are found in the geological column which is based on: older on bottom younger on top(which is not true). and they date the columns by how old the bones are.
And I'd like to see some flak on the star issue:
There are 70 sextillion visible stars but no one has ever seen one born, only die.
they say if 20 stars explode around space dust it could compact it into a new star but then we would lose 20 to gain one.
in 20 billion years or so there would have to be millions of stars born each day to reach 70 sextillion. only dieing stars
Well I'm no geologist but my base level knowledge of how they date bones is this.
They look for certain layers of rock, not just any layer, but layers like volcanic layers. They make the crazy assumption that stuff between the two layers of volcanic rock must have gotten there after the one layer formed and before the second formed. They then try to date these layers using isotopes and our knowledge of the halflifes of isotopes.
You claimed that they only determine the age of the rock column by the age of the bones, which is not really true. Occationally they do not have nice layers of rock that they can date for whatever reason but if enough data is gathered about a certain species from areas that can be dated they use that as a reference to estimate the age of the region they are looking in.
b bauer
Member
Originally Posted by Ozmar
Please quote chapter and verse. That would constitute proof. I think someone is tossing about promises of big rewards for such.
Without the quotation, I call your bluff: there are no unicorns mentioned in the Bible! You made that up! (Or you're repeating something someone else made up.)
Ozmar the Skeptic
just one example luke 1:69 but there are many more.
Please quote chapter and verse. That would constitute proof. I think someone is tossing about promises of big rewards for such.
Without the quotation, I call your bluff: there are no unicorns mentioned in the Bible! You made that up! (Or you're repeating something someone else made up.)
Ozmar the Skeptic
just one example luke 1:69 but there are many more.
clown boy
Active Member
Jerhunter and Jmick, PLEASE take the time to read through this:
EVIDENCE FOR CREATION
1. The Fossil Record...Evolutionists have constructed the Geologic Column in order to illustrate the supposed progression of "primitive" life forms to "more complex" systems we observe today. Yet, "since only a small percentage of the earth's surface obeys even a portion of the geologic column the claim of their having taken place to form a continuum of rock/life/time over the earth is therefore a fantastic and imaginative contrivance.1" "[T]he lack of transitional series cannot be explained as being due to the scarcity of material. The deficiencies are real, they will never be filled."2 This supposed column is actually saturated with "polystrate fossils" (fossils extending from one geologic layer to another) that tie all the layers to one time-frame. "[T]o the unprejudiced, the fossil record of plants is in favor of special creation." 3
2. Decay of Earth's Magnetic Field... Dr. Thomas Barnes, Emeritus Professor of Physics at the University of Texas at El Paso, has published the definitive work in this field.4 Scientific observations since 1829 have shown that the earth's magnetic field has been measurably decaying at an exponential rate, demonstrating its half-life to be approximately 1,400 years. In practical application its strength 20,000 years ago would approximate that of a magnetic star. Under those conditions many of the molecules necessary for life processes could not form. These data demonstrate that earth's entire history is young, within a few thousand of years.
3. The Global Flood... The Biblical record clearly describes a global Flood during Noah's day. Additionally, there are hundreds of Flood traditions handed down through cultures all over the world. 5 M.E. Clark and Henry Voss have demonstrated the scientific validity of such a Flood providing the sedimentary layering we see on every continent. 6 Secular scholars report very rapid sedimentation and periods of great carbonate deposition in earth's sedimentary layers..7 It is now possible to prove the historical reality of the Biblical Flood.8
4. Population Statistics...World population growth rate in recent times is about 2% per year. Practicable application of growth rate throughout human history would be about half that number. Wars, disease, famine, etc. have wiped out approximately one third of the population on average every 82 years. Starting with eight people, and applying these growth rates since the Flood of Noah's day (about 4500 years ago) would give a total human population at just under six billion people. However, application on an evolutionary time scale runs into major difficulties. Starting with one "couple" just 41,000 years ago would give us a total population of 2 x 1089. 9 The universe does not have space to hold so many bodies.
5. Radio Halos...Physicist Robert Gentry has reported isolated radio halos of polonuim-214 in crystalline granite. The half-life of this element is 0.000164 seconds! To record the existence of this element in such short time span, the granite must be in crystalline state instantaneously.10 This runs counter to evolutionary estimates of 300 million years for granite to form.
6. Human Artifacts throughout the Geologic Column...Man-made artifacts - such as the hammer in Cretaceous rock, a human sandal print with trilobite in Cambrian rock, human footprints and a handprint in Cretaceous rock – point to the fact that all the supposed geologic periods actually occurred at the same time in the recent past.11
7. Helium Content in Earth's Atmosphere... Physicist Melvin Cook, found that helium-4 enters our atmosphere from solar wind and radioactive decay of uranium. At present rates our atmosphere would accumulate current helium-4 amounts in less than 10,000 years.12
8. Expansion of Space Fabric...Astronomical estimates of the distance to various galaxies gives conflicting data.13 The Biblical Record refers to the expansion of space by the Creator14. Astrophysicist Russell Humphries demonstrates that such space expansion would dilate time in distant space.15 This could explain a recent creation with great distances to the stars.
9. Design in Living Systems...A living cell is so awesomely complex that its interdependent components stagger the imagination and defy evolutionary explanations. A minimal cell contains over 60,000 proteins of 100 different configurations.16 The chance of this assemblage occurring by chance is 1 in 10 4,478,296 .17
EVIDENCE FOR CREATION
1. The Fossil Record...Evolutionists have constructed the Geologic Column in order to illustrate the supposed progression of "primitive" life forms to "more complex" systems we observe today. Yet, "since only a small percentage of the earth's surface obeys even a portion of the geologic column the claim of their having taken place to form a continuum of rock/life/time over the earth is therefore a fantastic and imaginative contrivance.1" "[T]he lack of transitional series cannot be explained as being due to the scarcity of material. The deficiencies are real, they will never be filled."2 This supposed column is actually saturated with "polystrate fossils" (fossils extending from one geologic layer to another) that tie all the layers to one time-frame. "[T]o the unprejudiced, the fossil record of plants is in favor of special creation." 3
2. Decay of Earth's Magnetic Field... Dr. Thomas Barnes, Emeritus Professor of Physics at the University of Texas at El Paso, has published the definitive work in this field.4 Scientific observations since 1829 have shown that the earth's magnetic field has been measurably decaying at an exponential rate, demonstrating its half-life to be approximately 1,400 years. In practical application its strength 20,000 years ago would approximate that of a magnetic star. Under those conditions many of the molecules necessary for life processes could not form. These data demonstrate that earth's entire history is young, within a few thousand of years.
3. The Global Flood... The Biblical record clearly describes a global Flood during Noah's day. Additionally, there are hundreds of Flood traditions handed down through cultures all over the world. 5 M.E. Clark and Henry Voss have demonstrated the scientific validity of such a Flood providing the sedimentary layering we see on every continent. 6 Secular scholars report very rapid sedimentation and periods of great carbonate deposition in earth's sedimentary layers..7 It is now possible to prove the historical reality of the Biblical Flood.8
4. Population Statistics...World population growth rate in recent times is about 2% per year. Practicable application of growth rate throughout human history would be about half that number. Wars, disease, famine, etc. have wiped out approximately one third of the population on average every 82 years. Starting with eight people, and applying these growth rates since the Flood of Noah's day (about 4500 years ago) would give a total human population at just under six billion people. However, application on an evolutionary time scale runs into major difficulties. Starting with one "couple" just 41,000 years ago would give us a total population of 2 x 1089. 9 The universe does not have space to hold so many bodies.
5. Radio Halos...Physicist Robert Gentry has reported isolated radio halos of polonuim-214 in crystalline granite. The half-life of this element is 0.000164 seconds! To record the existence of this element in such short time span, the granite must be in crystalline state instantaneously.10 This runs counter to evolutionary estimates of 300 million years for granite to form.
6. Human Artifacts throughout the Geologic Column...Man-made artifacts - such as the hammer in Cretaceous rock, a human sandal print with trilobite in Cambrian rock, human footprints and a handprint in Cretaceous rock – point to the fact that all the supposed geologic periods actually occurred at the same time in the recent past.11
7. Helium Content in Earth's Atmosphere... Physicist Melvin Cook, found that helium-4 enters our atmosphere from solar wind and radioactive decay of uranium. At present rates our atmosphere would accumulate current helium-4 amounts in less than 10,000 years.12
8. Expansion of Space Fabric...Astronomical estimates of the distance to various galaxies gives conflicting data.13 The Biblical Record refers to the expansion of space by the Creator14. Astrophysicist Russell Humphries demonstrates that such space expansion would dilate time in distant space.15 This could explain a recent creation with great distances to the stars.
9. Design in Living Systems...A living cell is so awesomely complex that its interdependent components stagger the imagination and defy evolutionary explanations. A minimal cell contains over 60,000 proteins of 100 different configurations.16 The chance of this assemblage occurring by chance is 1 in 10 4,478,296 .17
clown boy
Active Member
10. Design in the Human Brain...The human brain is the most complicated structure in the known universe.18 It contains over 100 billion cells, each with over 50,000 neuron connections to other brain cells.19 This structure receives over 100 million separate signals from the total human body every second. If we learned something new every second of our lives, it would take three million years to exhaust the capacity of the human brain. 20 In addition to conscious thought, people can actually reason, anticipate consequences, and devise plans - all without knowing they are doing so.21
1Woodmorappe, John, "The Essential Non-Existence of the Evolutionary Uniformitarian Geologic Column: A Quantitative Assessment," Creation Research Society Quarterly, vol. 18, no.1 (Terre Haute, Indiana, June 1981),pp. 46-71
2 Nilsson, N. Heribert, as quoted in Arthur C. Custance, The Earth Before Man, Part II, Doorway Papers, no. 20 (Ontario, Canada: Doorway Publications), p. 51
3Corner, E.J.H., Contemporary Botanical Thought, ed. A.M. MacLeod and L.S. Cobley (Chicago: Quadrangle Books, 1961), p. 97
4Barnes, Thomas, ICR Technical Monograph #4, Origin and Destiny of the Earth's Magnetic Field (2nd edition, 1983)
5Blick, Edward, A Scientific Analysis of Genesis (Oklahoma City: Hearthstone, 1991) p. 103
6Clark, M.E. and Voss, H.D., "Fluid Mechanic Examination of the Tial Mechanism for Producing Mega-Sedimantary Layering" (Third International Conference on Creation, Pittsburg, July 1994)
7Ager, Derek, The Nature of the Stratigraphical Record (New York: John Wiley and Sons) p. 43 and p. 86
8West, John Anthony, Serpent in the Sky: The High Wisdom of Ancient Egypt (New York: Julian Press, 1987) pp. 13-14
9 See Morris, Henry, Scientific Creationism (El Cajon, CA: Master Books)
10Gentry, Robert, Creation's Tiny Mystery (Knoxville, Tenn.: Earth Science Assoc.,1988)
11 Baugh, Carl, Why Do Men Believe Evolution AGAINST ALL ODDS? (Oklahoma City: Hearthstone, 1999)
12Cook, Melvin, "Where is The Earth's Radiogenic Helium?" Nature, Vol. 179, p. 213
13Cowan, R., "Further Evidence of a Youthful Universe," Science News, Vol. 148, p. 166
14Psalm 104:2; Isaiah 40:22
15Humphries, Russell, Starlight and Time (Green Forest, AR: Master Books, 1994)
16Denton, Michael, Evolution: A Theory in Crisis (Bethesda, Maryland: Adler & Adler, 1986) p. 263
17 Mastropaolo, Joseph, "Evolution Is Biologically Impossible," Impact # 317 (El Cajon, CA: Institute For Creation Research,1999) p. 4
18Restak, Richard, The Brain: The Last Frontier, 1979, p. 390
19The Brain, Our Universe Within, PBS Video
20Wonders of God's Creation, Moody Video Series
21Weiss, Joseph, "Unconscious Mental Functioning," Scientific American, March 1990, p. 103
1Woodmorappe, John, "The Essential Non-Existence of the Evolutionary Uniformitarian Geologic Column: A Quantitative Assessment," Creation Research Society Quarterly, vol. 18, no.1 (Terre Haute, Indiana, June 1981),pp. 46-71
2 Nilsson, N. Heribert, as quoted in Arthur C. Custance, The Earth Before Man, Part II, Doorway Papers, no. 20 (Ontario, Canada: Doorway Publications), p. 51
3Corner, E.J.H., Contemporary Botanical Thought, ed. A.M. MacLeod and L.S. Cobley (Chicago: Quadrangle Books, 1961), p. 97
4Barnes, Thomas, ICR Technical Monograph #4, Origin and Destiny of the Earth's Magnetic Field (2nd edition, 1983)
5Blick, Edward, A Scientific Analysis of Genesis (Oklahoma City: Hearthstone, 1991) p. 103
6Clark, M.E. and Voss, H.D., "Fluid Mechanic Examination of the Tial Mechanism for Producing Mega-Sedimantary Layering" (Third International Conference on Creation, Pittsburg, July 1994)
7Ager, Derek, The Nature of the Stratigraphical Record (New York: John Wiley and Sons) p. 43 and p. 86
8West, John Anthony, Serpent in the Sky: The High Wisdom of Ancient Egypt (New York: Julian Press, 1987) pp. 13-14
9 See Morris, Henry, Scientific Creationism (El Cajon, CA: Master Books)
10Gentry, Robert, Creation's Tiny Mystery (Knoxville, Tenn.: Earth Science Assoc.,1988)
11 Baugh, Carl, Why Do Men Believe Evolution AGAINST ALL ODDS? (Oklahoma City: Hearthstone, 1999)
12Cook, Melvin, "Where is The Earth's Radiogenic Helium?" Nature, Vol. 179, p. 213
13Cowan, R., "Further Evidence of a Youthful Universe," Science News, Vol. 148, p. 166
14Psalm 104:2; Isaiah 40:22
15Humphries, Russell, Starlight and Time (Green Forest, AR: Master Books, 1994)
16Denton, Michael, Evolution: A Theory in Crisis (Bethesda, Maryland: Adler & Adler, 1986) p. 263
17 Mastropaolo, Joseph, "Evolution Is Biologically Impossible," Impact # 317 (El Cajon, CA: Institute For Creation Research,1999) p. 4
18Restak, Richard, The Brain: The Last Frontier, 1979, p. 390
19The Brain, Our Universe Within, PBS Video
20Wonders of God's Creation, Moody Video Series
21Weiss, Joseph, "Unconscious Mental Functioning," Scientific American, March 1990, p. 103
ozmar
Member
Originally Posted by kjr_trig
Good religion and bad religion....c'mon....I assume you consider your religion to be "the good", right? Whom exactly do you think considers their religion to be "the bad". The problem with religion is everyone considers theirs to be "the good religion", thats where the wars come from. How arrogant of you.
[sarcasm]Uh, no, I believe in bad religion.[/sarcasm]
Of course I consider my religion to be "the good". If I didn't, I'd change my allegiance to whichever philosophy/religion I judged to be correct. As would, I hope, all rational people. So I doubt anyone considers their own religion to be "the bad". We consider other religions to be "bad", or at least mistaken in certain beliefs.
This is not arrogance. This is rational. Everyone does it. (Or should.)
The problem with religion (as you put it) is not that everyone considers their own to be "good", it would be when some people consider that their religion ordains them to force their beliefs on others at the point of a sword.
Live and let live. I am perfectly capable of respecting (for example) Jews and their right to practice their religion. I am even capable of recognizing and appreciating the positive contributions of Judaism (and there are many) without agreeing with every aspect of the religion. I'm not a Jew, and that's fine. My Christian beliefs seem to me to be correct (that's why I hold them), but the fact that I think Judaism is not the whole truth doesn't mean that I have to treat my fellow human beings with any less respect or kindness.
Ozmar the Kind and Respectful
Good religion and bad religion....c'mon....I assume you consider your religion to be "the good", right? Whom exactly do you think considers their religion to be "the bad". The problem with religion is everyone considers theirs to be "the good religion", thats where the wars come from. How arrogant of you.
[sarcasm]Uh, no, I believe in bad religion.[/sarcasm]
Of course I consider my religion to be "the good". If I didn't, I'd change my allegiance to whichever philosophy/religion I judged to be correct. As would, I hope, all rational people. So I doubt anyone considers their own religion to be "the bad". We consider other religions to be "bad", or at least mistaken in certain beliefs.
This is not arrogance. This is rational. Everyone does it. (Or should.)
The problem with religion (as you put it) is not that everyone considers their own to be "good", it would be when some people consider that their religion ordains them to force their beliefs on others at the point of a sword.
Live and let live. I am perfectly capable of respecting (for example) Jews and their right to practice their religion. I am even capable of recognizing and appreciating the positive contributions of Judaism (and there are many) without agreeing with every aspect of the religion. I'm not a Jew, and that's fine. My Christian beliefs seem to me to be correct (that's why I hold them), but the fact that I think Judaism is not the whole truth doesn't mean that I have to treat my fellow human beings with any less respect or kindness.
Ozmar the Kind and Respectful
ozmar
Member
Originally Posted by b bauer
just one example luke 1:69 but there are many more.
A quick Google on that reference turns up the following passage from a King James Version of the Bible. There is no unicorn here. I assume you refer to the "horn of salvation"? Reading this as a unicorn's horn seems like quite a stretch to me...
Originally Posted by KJV Bible
Luke 1:67: And his father Zacharias was filled with the Holy Ghost, and prophesied, saying,
68 Blessed be the Lord God of Israel; for he hath visited and redeemed his people,
69 And hath raised up an horn of salvation for us in the house of his servant David;
70 As he spake by the mouth of his holy prophets, which have been since the world began:
71 That we should be saved from our enemies, and from the hand of all that hate us;
72 To perform the mercy promised to our fathers, and to remember his holy covenant;
73 The oath which he sware to our father Abraham,
74 That he would grant unto us, that we being delivered out of the hand of our enemies might serve him without fear,
75 In holiness and righteousness before him, all the days of our life.
76 And thou, child, shalt be called the prophet of the Highest: for thou shalt go before the face of the Lord to prepare his ways;
77 To give knowledge of salvation unto his people by the remission of their sins,
78 Through the tender mercy of our God; whereby the dayspring from on high hath visited us,
79 To give light to them that sit in darkness and in the shadow of death, to guide our feet into the way of peace.
80 And the child grew, and waxed strong in spirit, and was in the deserts till the day of his shewing unto Israel.
reefreak29
Active Member
the simple statement that God created the heavens and the earth is one of the most challenging concepts confronting the moder mind. the vast galaxy we live in is spinning at 490000 miles an hour. and there are over 1 billion galaxys just like ours in the universe. scientists say that the number of stars in creation is equal to all the grains of sand in all the beaches of the world. yet this complex sea of spinning stars function with remarkable order and efficientcy. to say that the universe just happened or evolved requires much more faith then to believe that God is behind this. God did not need to create the universe, he chose to create it . why , God is love and love is best expressed towards something or someone else, so God created the world and people as an expression of love.WE SHOULD AVOID REDUCEING GODS CREATION TO MERELY SCIENTIFIC TERMS. remember that God created the universe because he loves us
ozmar
Member
Clown_Boy: Is it possible to post links on this forum? Yes, it is. Cool.
I'd like to see some linked sources for some of the stuff you posted. I can see you posted references, which leads me to think that you're cut-n-pasting the whole list from somewhere online. Or are you copying it from a printed source? Or did you (*gasp*) do all this research yourself? (If so, impressive...
-Ozmar the Web Researcher
I'd like to see some linked sources for some of the stuff you posted. I can see you posted references, which leads me to think that you're cut-n-pasting the whole list from somewhere online. Or are you copying it from a printed source? Or did you (*gasp*) do all this research yourself? (If so, impressive...
-Ozmar the Web Researcher