Obama supporters. I have one question

[stdreb27]

Originally Posted by Rylan1
http:///forum/post/2566373
What I find interesting here is why can't public figures have faith? Why can't they display it... Republicans don't have a lock on faith... So its okay for Huckabee to talk about faith? My point is that you have no idea what a person has in their heart. Now I know some people do it for show ... but this is neither democratic or republican... its about the individual and the relationship they have with God and they type of life they lead.
On the contrary, I totally thing that faith should have a place in politics, and this "separation of church and state" is simply an attempt to disenfranchise a large constituency group in an attempt by certain groups of thought to gain more power. And these groups of thought mainly reside in the left wing. Such as the ACLU.
I have no way to know for sure, we are suppose to use discernment. To in context quote a scripture.
Matthew 7: 15-20
15Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves.
16Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles?
17Even so every good tree bringeth forth good fruit; but a corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit.
18A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit.
19Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire.
20Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them.
So to argue that "I don't know a man's heart" is true, but I must discern whether he is the right person to lead this country, or the church I attend, or marry me. Or I run the possibility to let a raving wolf into my house.

 

[stdreb27]

Originally Posted by Rylan1
http:///forum/post/2566362
We've been there and done that... lets move on to the current status of this election. The church is not promoting anyone... neither are they responsible for what Hamas does...nor are they associated in anyway with Hamas. If they were they'd be in jail... The fact you keep bringing these sensational untrue stories up... makes me think you may be "bitter". Lets move past it and talk about what is effecting you and I ...this economy, and national security..among other important issues.
YEah,but when we do talk about other serious issues with the left wing and obama you "mysteriously" dissapear... You've said this before.

 

[reefraff]

Originally Posted by Rylan1
http:///forum/post/2566401
As I mentioned .. you failed to state what it said... I also believe this was on a Internet Bulletin in which people can write whatever they want...similar to this one... You mentioned it as not important to what it said...or the relevance it had to the subject matter. Anything and everything can be taken out of context.. if you are going to charge Obama with something (especially something he has no control over)... at least have the proper information to back your claim up.
As far as Farrakhan... lets talk about why he was honored... Farrakhan doesn't have the stigma he has with people like yourself in the black community. We realize he has said some unsensitive things in the past... The whole Jewish came as a result of an attack from Jewish Institutions against Presidential candidate Jackson back in '84.. in which Farrakhan responded... both parties were involved and it was bickering or statements made b/w the two.. Farrakhan has since sought to work directly with Jewish organizations... That is some background.. if you are going to tell the truth ..tell it all.
Now back to the church... Farrakhan has done many positive things in the black community... he was recongized for his prison work and helping ex cons turn there lives around...
this is "typical" america.... we always want to highlight the negatives in a person... we never talk about the good they do or their positive achievements. He did this work in that community.. regardless of his religious belief... or past statements... I have no problem with him being recongized for helping other people.

The past

"In a 2007 interview with Arabic-language television news network Al Jazeera, Farrakhan accused Jews of anti-Semitism, charging that “The real anti-Semites are those who came out of Europe and settled in Palestine, and now they call themselves the true Jews, when in fact, they converted to Judaism"
"Do you know some of these satanic Jews have taken over BET?... Everything that we built, they have. The mind of Satan now is running the record industry, movie industry and television. And they make us look like we’re the murders; we look like we’re the gangsters, but we’re punk stuff.”
“Justifiable Homicide: Black Youth in Peril (Part 3)” speech at Mosque Maryam, 11/11/07
These false Jews promote the filth of Hollywood that is seeding the American people and the people of the world and bringing you down in moral strength…It’s the wicked Jews the false Jews that are promoting Lesbianism, homosexuality. It’s wicked Jews, false Jews that make it a crime for you to preach the word of God, then they call you homophobic!”
Saviours’ Day, Chicago, Illinois, 2/26/06
“I’m not an anti-Semite, I never have been one. I do not hate the Jewish people; put that down! What I hate is the degree of control that they exercise over Black intellectual, cultural expression. I do not think that no human being should determine how high we can go, that can only be determined by God and by us; not by no white man, no black man, no human being [crowd cheers].”
Millions More Movement rally, Philadelphia, Pennsylvania, 8/31/05
Maybe someone should honor Charles Manson for keeping runaway girls off the streets in the 60's

 

[fats71]

Originally Posted by Rylan1
http:///forum/post/2566362
We've been there and done that... lets move on to the current status of this election. The church is not promoting anyone... neither are they responsible for what Hamas does...nor are they associated in anyway with Hamas. If they were they'd be in jail... The fact you keep bringing these sensational untrue stories up... makes me think you may be "bitter". Lets move past it and talk about what is effecting you and I ...this economy, and national security..among other important issues.
Last July, Trinity United Church of Christ reprinted a Hamas manifesto written by a terrorist fugitive wanted by the FBI. It was published across two pages of the "Pastor's Page" section of the church bulletin.
Rev. Jeremiah Wright's name is copyrighted at the bottom of the pages. In his newsletter, the preacher gives Mousa Abu Marzook a platform to justify the Palestinian terrorist group's denial of Israel's right to exist, while defending strikes against Israeli targets
Obama is a Harvard Educated attorney, he should know better, dont you think???
Ok so as you were saying ?
He hates this country and is a wolf in sheep's clothing.
Harvard indoctrinates hatred for the US and promotes
Socialism and Communism. Those who don't research
what they've been told and can't think for themselves,
fall for the hype.
He is a weak minded man, with ideas that have already
been tried and failed thousands of times in past history.
He hates our free way of life. Ironic that he still lives the fight against the past black slavery in this country, but loves the idea of making us all enslaved with taxes and government
rule.
I'd say that makes him a hypocrite.

 

[fats71]

Saying and I quote " The Italians look down their garlic noses and are enemies to "JESUS' will surly win the Jewish and Italian vote don;t ya think Suzy ??

 

[rylan1]

Originally Posted by 1journeyman
http:///forum/post/2566388
The only solution to Al Qaeda is to kill them, obliterate their training camps, and remove any government that supports or hides them.
So, in my opinion, McCain is far better than Obama. Especially if Obama believes like you.
History shows War sometimes is the answer.
That is not the solution because the idealogy can't be killed..with bullets... You can't kill them all either...the issue will move generation to generation. This is the flaw in your philosophy. You can't kill a belief structure by guns and war, when part of the problem is that very thing... and it encourages recruitment against a known and seen enemy. Please tell me from past history when war was an answer with issues of idealogy... you may use WWII as an example... but it is much different than this issue. We were fighting a foreign gov't... and militarily we were able to defeat them based on conventional warfare... this is a new beast based on a thousand years of anti-christian(western) idealogy, which was reborn in the 50's.. this is deep rooted and is as much cultural as it is political and religious. You can make some slight comparisons to nazi Germany... but the situation is very much different
My answer would possibably be to divest in oil... go after bin Laden ... increase aid/education ... revamp foreign policy ... and attempt to find a Israel/Palentine solution ... the latter may not be possible given if you beileve in the Bible... I see no valid reason why the region and city can't be holy for everyone... but unreasonable people are probably unlikely to reason. Divesting in oil will also be difficult because we owe the Saudis so much $$$, and they have the leverage becaue our economy is based on oil. Thats why we are so slow to do it.. we have the technology to do it... but politically it is a risk.

 

[rylan1]

Originally Posted by reefraff
http:///forum/post/2566413

The past

"In a 2007 interview with Arabic-language television news network Al Jazeera, Farrakhan accused Jews of anti-Semitism, charging that “The real anti-Semites are those who came out of Europe and settled in Palestine, and now they call themselves the true Jews, when in fact, they converted to Judaism"
"Do you know some of these satanic Jews have taken over BET?... Everything that we built, they have. The mind of Satan now is running the record industry, movie industry and television. And they make us look like we’re the murders; we look like we’re the gangsters, but we’re punk stuff.”
“Justifiable Homicide: Black Youth in Peril (Part 3)” speech at Mosque Maryam, 11/11/07
These false Jews promote the filth of Hollywood that is seeding the American people and the people of the world and bringing you down in moral strength…It’s the wicked Jews the false Jews that are promoting Lesbianism, homosexuality. It’s wicked Jews, false Jews that make it a crime for you to preach the word of God, then they call you homophobic!”
Saviours’ Day, Chicago, Illinois, 2/26/06
“I’m not an anti-Semite, I never have been one. I do not hate the Jewish people; put that down! What I hate is the degree of control that they exercise over Black intellectual, cultural expression. I do not think that no human being should determine how high we can go, that can only be determined by God and by us; not by no white man, no black man, no human being [crowd cheers].”
Millions More Movement rally, Philadelphia, Pennsylvania, 8/31/05
Maybe someone should honor Charles Manson for keeping runaway girls off the streets in the 60's
Thats your problem... you bring up a valid topic but ruin it by your rhetoric.. Now Farrakhan is murderer? or can be associated with Manson?... this has nothing to do with the conversation, ans shows your lack of insight on the issue.
BET has drasically changed since Viacom.. This is a feeling that many people feel... and they feel that the images seen on TV mostly depict black people in a unsavory light... if you look at tv today... many Christians and even Muslims believe TV has gone to the deep end of unmorality. He states he is not anti-semitic... but basically is upset with these hollywood types who are hypocrites and promote images and stereotypes and is corruptive.
what is wrong with this statment?
" What I hate is the degree of control that they exercise over Black intellectual, cultural expression. I do not think that no human being should determine how high we can go, that can only be determined by God and by us; not by no white man, no black man, no human being"

 

[rylan1]

Originally Posted by Fats71
http:///forum/post/2566421
Last July, Trinity United Church of Christ reprinted a Hamas manifesto written by a terrorist fugitive wanted by the FBI. It was published across two pages of the "Pastor's Page" section of the church bulletin.
Rev. Jeremiah Wright's name is copyrighted at the bottom of the pages. In his newsletter, the preacher gives Mousa Abu Marzook a platform to justify the Palestinian terrorist group's denial of Israel's right to exist, while defending strikes against Israeli targets
........
He hates this country and is a wolf in sheep's clothing.
Harvard indoctrinates hatred for the US and promotes
Socialism and Communism. Those who don't research
what they've been told and can't think for themselves,
fall for the hype.
He is a weak minded man, with ideas that have already
been tried and failed thousands of times in past history.
He hates our free way of life. Ironic that he still lives the fight against the past black slavery in this country, but loves the idea of making us all enslaved with taxes and government
rule.
I'd say that makes him a hypocrite.
Again, what does Obama have to do with the Pastor's Page... its not his page. Second, place the comments in proper context... So now Harvard promotes Socialism and Communism? He is weak minded... He wants to make us slaves? He hates our free way of life? ... Listen to yourself... I mean how do you really feel about Obama? I thought "bitter" may have been an unappropriate word for what Obama was trying to say... but I guess not.

 

[fats71]

Obama has been a member of this church for twenty years hearing this sort of thing and I quote.
The government runs everything form the white house to the schoolhouse from the Capitol to the Klan, white Supremacy is clearly...in charge, but Asa, like Jesus, refused to be defined by an oppressive government because of Asa got his identity from an Omnipotent God
Jesus says that if say you love him and Say you love him then your a liar and the truth is not in you.
The guy is a complete and their is no other way to say it "GOOF"
Their is no way to sit in a church for twenty years call the pastor his Uncle and never hear this rhetoric. He would have left and disavowed that church 20 years ago..
called Jews blood suckers and Judaism a gutter religion...
They gave Louis Farrakhan a lifetime achivment award and thhe pasotr is honoring him the pastor is the CEO and his daughter is the publishes it the trumpet something or other is what it is called and wright writes in it monthly.
Wright is honoring farrakhan after he said "called Jews blood suckers and Judaism a gutter religion..."
WAY TO GO OBAMA !!! Your making it an easy choice to NOT have a leg to stand on.

 

[fats71]

Originally Posted by Rylan1
http:///forum/post/2566434
Again, what does Obama have to do with the Pastor's Page... its not his page. Second, place the comments in proper context... So now Harvard promotes Socialism and Communism? He is weak minded... He wants to make us slaves? He hates our free way of life? ... Listen to yourself... I mean how do you really feel about Obama? I thought "bitter" may have been an unappropriate word for what Obama was trying to say... but I guess not.

How do you goto the churchh for "20" years and call the pastor uncle and his spiritual leader and not belive what he follows and thinks ? I myself amm a christian andd have left many churches due to things not aligning with "THE BIBLE" in which is the reason we goto church to learn and to become spiritualy fed. Obama has been fed ffor twenty years this sort of rhetoric and to stay that long he has to belive it himself or he would disownn the pastor as his "so called uncle" and would have left the church YEARS AGO. He obviously belives in it or he would not have stayed in it for so long is what I am saying for the tenth time but maybe you need it broken down again...

 

[rylan1]

Originally Posted by stdreb27
http:///forum/post/2566412
YEah,but when we do talk about other serious issues with the left wing and obama you "mysteriously" dissapear... You've said this before.
I do have a job... can't respond to everything all the time... nor do I read everything.

 

[rylan1]

Originally Posted by stdreb27
http:///forum/post/2566409
On the contrary, I totally thing that faith should have a place in politics, and this "separation of church and state" is simply an attempt to disenfranchise a large constituency group in an attempt by certain groups of thought to gain more power. And these groups of thought mainly reside in the left wing. Such as the ACLU.
I have no way to know for sure, we are suppose to use discernment. To in context quote a scripture.
Matthew 7: 15-20
15Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves.
16Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles?
17Even so every good tree bringeth forth good fruit; but a corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit.
18A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit.
19Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire.
20Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them.
So to argue that "I don't know a man's heart" is true, but I must discern whether he is the right person to lead this country, or the church I attend, or marry me. Or I run the possibility to let a raving wolf into my house.
agreed... but lets base this on God.. not other biases... like "Dems" as mentioned

 

[fats71]

It has come to the point that it is this simple.
If you believe in Obama and what he stands for you are certainly not for white America, Italian Americans, Jews, Asians etc. If you Say you are then please research Obama and what he himself has written and see where he has made the same sort of statements as his lovely pastor wright has made.
This is a pointless debate as the points have been made over 100 times why obama is a low life but "YOU" have done nothing but defend a guy who will never make it to office.
He has given Hillary so much ammunition against him even if he has more delegates at the end of the day she will say if you wanna beat McCain you will not be able to sustain the attacks the GOP will have against what will come :0 everything you ever did will be revealed and come to light when you run for office and believe me he has some skeletons about to come out ( not like he needs anymore to pop out he has already sunk himself)

 

[rylan1]

Originally Posted by Fats71
http:///forum/post/2566443
How do you goto the churchh for "20" years and call the pastor uncle and his spiritual leader and not belive what he follows and thinks ? I myself amm a christian andd have left many churches due to things not aligning with "THE BIBLE" in which is the reason we goto church to learn and to become spiritualy fed. Obama has been fed ffor twenty years this sort of rhetoric and to stay that long he has to belive it himself or he would disownn the pastor as his "so called uncle" and would have left the church YEARS AGO. He obviously belives in it or he would not have stayed in it for so long is what I am saying for the tenth time but maybe you need it broken down again...
The pastor hasn't said anything anti-christian... it may be anti-social according to your personal social beliefs... but to many black people this is the thoughts and frustrations they have. There is a clear difference.. I myself were not suprised by the comments... I've heard them before ... its just an eye opening to the frustrations of certain parts of the black community in many ways.

 

[fats71]

Originally Posted by Rylan1
http:///forum/post/2566450
The pastor hasn't said anything anti-christian... it may be anti-social according to your personal social beliefs... but to many black people this is the thoughts and frustrations they have. There is a clear difference.. I myself were not suprised by the comments... I've heard them before ... its just an eye opening to the frustrations of certain parts of the black community in many ways.

"Jesus says that if say you love him and Say you love him then your a liar and the truth is not in you"
That is anti christian.
Saying that Jews are scum is anti christian " lets remember Jews are the chosen people and when you accept christ as your Lord you become grafted inn by faith making you an adopted Jew"
If you want to get into where it is anti christian lets please do. I am a student of Vineyard Bible Inst. I have been studyingg the Bible since the age of 5 so around 40 years to date. I read the hebrewic roots bible to the king james to many others. I am studying Hebrew so as to understand the bible and its true meanning not the easy peasy translation we get into englishh ( which is not the exact same thing in most cases) if you want me to start pointing out all the anti things he has said please let me know aand I will certainly start showing you.

 

[fats71]

Originally Posted by Rylan1
http:///forum/post/2566450
The pastor hasn't said anything anti-christian... it may be anti-social according to your personal social beliefs... but to many black people this is the thoughts and frustrations they have. There is a clear difference.. I myself were not suprised by the comments... I've heard them before ... its just an eye opening to the frustrations of certain parts of the black community in many ways.

One more thing start by telling me how most "black people think jews are scum of the earth"?
My 'Black pal" sitting next to me said that is one of the stupidest things he has ever heard lol.

 

[rylan1]

Originally Posted by Fats71
http:///forum/post/2566449
It has come to the point that it is this simple.
If you believe in Obama and what he stands for you are certainly not for white America, Italian Americans, Jews, Asians etc. If you Say you are then please research Obama and what he himself has written and see where he has made the same sort of statements as his lovely pastor wright has made.
This is a pointless debate as the points have been made over 100 times why obama is a low life but "YOU" have done nothing but defend a guy who will never make it to office.
He has given Hillary so much ammunition against him even if he has more delegates at the end of the day she will say if you wanna beat McCain you will not be able to sustain the attacks the GOP will have against what will come :0 everything you ever did will be revealed and come to light when you run for office and believe me he has some skeletons about to come out ( not like he needs anymore to pop out he has already sunk himself)

Hillary is loosing.. instead of worring about attacking Obama she needs to worry about her own issues... This actually may weather the storm and help Obama, since he has faced this now, as opposed to in Nov. I think everything is out... Obama's success speaks for itself... My defending Obama will not change your vote... so who cares... What you forget is these issues are small in the scope of things... What matters at the end of the day is the economy, gas prices, healthcare, education, etc... you fail to give me valid reasons to consider McCain because all you want to do is try to dog Obama with accusations that are mostly false... and things that other people have done. Nothing that he had done... said ... or written... Obama is the only candidate talking about all of America... And no I am not for white america...etc... I believe our goals and dreams are the same... we all want the same things ... so I am for all of America... and I am not... nor is Obama anti-(race/ethnicity) America. The issues we are fighting for affect us all... It seems to me that you think if a black man gets into office... that the racial dynamic will change and he will punish white america... give me a break... that is the assumption you are making... with "making us slaves to the gov't and taxes" statement and the one "If you are for Obama..you are against white America" which are all absurd.

 

[fats71]

seems to me that you think if a black man gets into office... that the racial dynamic will change and he will punish white america... give me a break
I am not white but Italian American Indian. MY wife is black dutch. I have foster kids of many different races. I am not for white America or black America or Italian America. I am for AMERICA On nation under GOD.
Obama is the wolf in sheep's clothing we have all been warned about.
I am not that fond of McCain by any means I am a Sam brown back man but as he is not in the race McCain is the best choice for the job. I wish I could vote for Mickey mouse honestly with the current choices but that is not an option as far as I know.
I am voting for the most qualified for the job and as I do not think any of them are worth much McCain does hold the highest dollar amount. I am a republican and know McCain to be a Dem in sheep's clothing but he is the best demo publican to choose from.

 

[rylan1]

Originally Posted by Fats71
http:///forum/post/2566458
One more thing start by telling me how most "black people think jews are scum of the earth"?
My 'Black pal" sitting next to me said that is one of the stupidest things he has ever heard lol.
I didn't say this... don't take my words and twist them... tell your pal " I said what's up brotha.

Those are your words not mine... I said nothing of that sorts, nor did I make that accusation..
I am saying that many black people, who or who may not include your pal, believe that the television most oftem portrays african americans in a certain light... BET once had shows that talked about news and issues invloving the black communtity that highlighted education and impowerment. Now, it is simply a video channel that shows shake your booty videos, instead of more positive videos or messages as it once did. It was once more educational .. but now it is MTV in which many black households have to censure their children from, and their are also many others who have no problem with it.
But look at television over the past 5-10 years.. Images that are now seen, language heard, themes, and etc... it is poluting our youth which is why we see rises in certain behaviors with our children.

 

[suzy]

Rylan, don't worry too much about Clintons attacks. Right now, it is a good thing. He does not have a lot of experience dealing with negative attacks, so her campaign doing it now will give him experience when the big guns come out in August. He will be stronger. Plus, don't put stock in any of the attacks we see here. The far right is just fishing for anything to try to bring up their candidate. Even they don't like him, so they need an excuse to vote for him. Making up BS about the other side gives them that excuse. In November, the electorate will vote on the issues, and decide if they want 4 more years of the same or if they want to try a different route. It will work out OK.