Obama's Church and ex-paster

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veeraj87

Guest
Originally Posted by alexmir
http:///forum/post/2519154
I can understand that a black american might have a different opinion on the history of america, I can also imagine that native americans would have a very different look on America as a white american also, but because they are a minority (around 2 % i think) they dont seem to have as much of a fight as blacks do. I do know that when people say " White " they are often referring to everyone who is not middle eastern, black, or hispanic. There are lots and lots of ethnicities that make up " White America " and the ancestors of every one of those ethnic groups suffered hatred and wrong doing from another group of people.
I agree with everyone else that slavery was absolutely disgusting, But I dont understand why that would change the opinion of america to a black person. As a pentecostal, (a very modest one, not a back woods snake charmer!!!! haha) many of the older people in my church were beaten, hated, scared out of schools because of their religion, but that doesnt give me a right to have a bad outlook on America. Of course there are idiots that hate black people, but there are idiots that hate asian, south american, mexican, irish and all other kinds of people.
I also feel that if you go to a church, (where you and your congregation share similar beliefs) and hear a man that you look up to (His pastor) scream hatred toward White America and towards America in general, You are very affected by that. And if he says he doesnt agree with his pastor on that subject, then why go for 20 years? You find a church that the pastor and congregation have similar beliefs in God and Life as you, which shows that he may deep down feel the same way. I think Obama would be a really cool guy to hang out with, but it scares me that A man that has been told to hate white America for 20 years is about to be elected president. You can not sit through a chruch appox. 700 church services ( 35 services a year for 20 years) and not be extremely influenced by a man.
Anyways, just my opinion. Hope this didnt offend anyone, i was certainly not trying to. I just have a very strong opinoin about this subject.
(I also have very strong opinions about the other runners, but this thread is about Obama, i am not trying to single him out)

Originally Posted by stdreb27
http:///forum/post/2526604
Which brings me to my next point, how can you lead a country if you don't believe in it?
no one said that i dont believe in it, and it is very similar to killing people off systematically when the countries main military leader says were not counting the number of civilian casualties thats part of war... You my friend are from tx so ur prolly all GUNgho about shooting people up and not giving a crap that were killing people.
 
V

veeraj87

Guest
http://www.nytimes.com/2005/10/30/in...civilians.html
http://www.commondreams.org/headlines04/1031-01.htm
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2004/dec/09/iraq.iraq
http://www.countercurrents.org/iraq-usborne311005.htm
Now if you read these, they have the #'s estimated cuz no one knows becuz weve done a great job of hiding the #, but i would say its enough to know why so many people hate us, we dont support what we say sadly, and that is to bring human rights, where is the human rights for all those that died? 20000+, how many 911's is that ? you dont call that systematic? last time i checked that messed up man you dont kill 20000 + people and say "O, its ok" no its wrong and our nation is ignorant americans who cant even point out Africa on a map thats how dumb our country is becoming. More kids identify Joe camel than Mickey Mouse thats when you know Sh** aint right. but more than anything else ,its people like you that dont realize that theres SOO MANY PEOPLE DIEING, and you dont think its systematic, if it wasnt than we would have reported those #'s if it wasnt than we would appologized, if it wasnt than we woulda pulled out and said we need a better approach, dude thats the same thing, as genocide, its just not telling anyone and no one can do anything to stop us.
 
1journeyman

1journeyman

Active Member

Originally Posted by Veeraj87
http:///forum/post/2526657
http://www.nytimes.com/2005/10/30/in...civilians.html
http://www.commondreams.org/headlines04/1031-01.htm
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2004/dec/09/iraq.iraq
http://www.countercurrents.org/iraq-usborne311005.htm
Now if you read these, they have the #'s estimated cuz no one knows becuz weve done a great job of hiding the #, but i would say its enough to know why so many people hate us, we dont support what we say sadly, and that is to bring human rights, where is the human rights for all those that died? 20000+, how many 911's is that ? you dont call that systematic? last time i checked that messed up man you dont kill 20000 + people and say "O, its ok" no its wrong and our nation is ignorant americans who cant even point out Africa on a map thats how dumb our country is becoming. More kids identify Joe camel than Mickey Mouse thats when you know Sh** aint right. but more than anything else ,its people like you that dont realize that theres SOO MANY PEOPLE DIEING, and you dont think its systematic, if it wasnt than we would have reported those #'s if it wasnt than we would appologized, if it wasnt than we woulda pulled out and said we need a better approach, dude thats the same thing, as genocide, its just not telling anyone and no one can do anything to stop us.
Here's an idea. Please read the very links you posted:
"Extrapolating the daily averages over the months from Jan. 1, 2004, to Sept. 16 this year results in a total of 25,902 Iraqi civilians and security forces killed and wounded by insurgents..."
Killed by insurgents, NOT us.
 
reefraff

reefraff

Active Member

Originally Posted by 1journeyman
http:///forum/post/2526674
Here's an idea. Please read the very links you posted:
"Extrapolating the daily averages over the months from Jan. 1, 2004, to Sept. 16 this year results in a total of 25,902 Iraqi civilians and security forces killed and wounded by insurgents..."
Killed by insurgents, NOT us.

Amazing isn't it. I can't even comment lest I violate the UA and test the limits of the filters
 
jmick

jmick

Active Member
Originally Posted by reefraff
http:///forum/post/2526531
I must call BS
I grew up in SoCal and was the victim of and saw others victimized by black on white and Hispanic on white, Asian on white etc. racism on many, many , many occasions.
A few people I knew in Montana grew up on the Flathead reservation. No Indian on white racism? Are you on crack!!!
Hell I was on the reservation quite a bit for work and while most were really nice I caught crap for no reason on a few occasions. Know anyone from Hawaii? Ask them about kill haole day in the public schools there.
Racism is a two way street. Until people quit trying to blame whitey for all their problems racism isn't going away.
I call BS. Being picked on by black, hispanic or asain kids is not racism...maybe you were an easy mark or just fun to pick on?
Wow, you went to an Indian reservation and caught crap...this I don't believe! All we did was commit genocide on these people and their way of life, you'd never expect for there to be lingering resentment towards whitey the do gooder.
Whitey is too blame for a lot of the problems in this country because it's the country white men have built. How long have blacks been able to vote, go to public schools or even feel they have an equal shot to get a professional job?
Also, even if a minority group has resentment or even feels hatred towards the majority the generally lack the power to do anything about it. It's a much great issue when the majority has these feeling because they can oppress and hold down the given group of people....all you need to do is look at our history.
 
wattsupdoc

wattsupdoc

Active Member
EXCUSE ME! You definitely have a distorted view of racism and as such your comments are worthless. Racism by anybody is racism. when ever someone attacks someone because he's white that's racism. GEEEEZ.
 
suzy

suzy

Member

Originally Posted by 1journeyman
http:///forum/post/2526674
Here's an idea. Please read the very links you posted:
"Extrapolating the daily averages over the months from Jan. 1, 2004, to Sept. 16 this year results in a total of 25,902 Iraqi civilians and security forces killed and wounded by insurgents..."
Killed by insurgents, NOT us.

Yeah, Veera! Geez, you make me want to bang my head on a brick wall! It's not our fault they are killing each other. Just because their gubermint is destabilized and their army got disbanded.It's not our fault some rouge CIA guys are giving money and guns to neighborhood militias so they can kill each other. It's not our fault that these 3 groups that have hated each other forever can't join hands, kiss n make up. Just because the whole world said it was going to be a quagmire, is it our fault it is? Geez, we have nothing to do with these terrible, bad people killing each other with guns we gave them.
Veera, you should watch Faux news so you will see how much good stuff is going on over there. They voted!
But we can still never leave for a hundred years
 
reefraff

reefraff

Active Member
Originally Posted by Jmick
http:///forum/post/2526740
I call BS. Being picked on by black, hispanic or asain kids is not racism...maybe you were an easy mark or just fun to pick on?
Wow, you went to an Indian reservation and caught crap...this I don't believe! All we did was commit genocide on these people and their way of life, you'd never expect for there to be lingering resentment towards whitey the do gooder.
Whitey is too blame for a lot of the problems in this country because it's the country white men have built. How long have blacks been able to vote, go to public schools or even feel they have an equal shot to get a professional job?
Also, even if a minority group has resentment or even feels hatred towards the majority the generally lack the power to do anything about it. It's a much great issue when the majority has these feeling because they can oppress and hold down the given group of people....all you need to do is look at our history.
Wait a minute, Me and many others being harassed, shoved around or jumped based on being white isn't racism? Sorry but that is the most idiotic statement I've ever heard. Getting jumped isn't a matter of being an easy target. You get 3 or 4 on one and anyone is an easy target.
Beyond that had car vandlized once, Scratching FU whitey would seem to indicate racist intent we had the house tagged and egged once. Growing up in a 95% hispanic neighborhood gives you a little perspective.
I supposed when Reginald denny was pulled out of his truck and had his head beat in with a brick during the LA riots, that wasn't racism? Maybe it was just an accident but the guy doing the chicken dance over him while he was bleeding makes me suspect otherwise.
And I see you want to appologize for Indian racism. So the fact my stepfather had to fight his way to and from school everyday through a black ghetto in Cincinatti made it OK for him to be racist against Blacks all of his life? Damn, I've always considered my self to be pretty politically incorrect but I used to call him on that crap all the time.
 
reefraff

reefraff

Active Member
Originally Posted by Suzy
http:///forum/post/2526770
Yeah, Veera! Geez, you make me want to bang my head on a brick wall! It's not our fault they are killing each other. Just because their gubermint is destabilized and their army got disbanded.It's not our fault some rouge CIA guys are giving money and guns to neighborhood militias so they can kill each other. It's not our fault that these 3 groups that have hated each other forever can't join hands, kiss n make up. Just because the whole world said it was going to be a quagmire, is it our fault it is? Geez, we have nothing to do with these terrible, bad people killing each other with guns we gave them.
Veera, you should watch Faux news so you will see how much good stuff is going on over there. They voted!
But we can still never leave for a hundred years
Yeah, the Iraqis were so much better off under Saddam, especially the Kurds and Shiites
 
wattsupdoc

wattsupdoc

Active Member
Thats just another excuse to justify racism. Anybody with any common sense can see that. When a kid gets picked on because he's white, black, brown, green, whatever, it's racism. Because kids do it it's OK? NO! They do it because thats what their parents have taught them.
 
reefraff

reefraff

Active Member
Originally Posted by wattsupdoc
http:///forum/post/2526781
Thats just another excuse to justify racism. Anybody with any common sense can see that. When a kid gets picked on because he's white, black, brown, green, whatever, it's racism. Because kids do it it's OK? NO! They do it because thats what their parents have taught them.

No kidding. Some people's thought process is really boggling to me.
 
stdreb27

stdreb27

Active Member
Originally Posted by Veeraj87
http:///forum/post/2526657
http://www.nytimes.com/2005/10/30/in...civilians.html
http://www.commondreams.org/headlines04/1031-01.htm
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2004/dec/09/iraq.iraq
http://www.countercurrents.org/iraq-usborne311005.htm
Now if you read these, they have the #'s estimated cuz no one knows becuz weve done a great job of hiding the #, but i would say its enough to know why so many people hate us, we dont support what we say sadly, and that is to bring human rights, where is the human rights for all those that died? 20000+, how many 911's is that ? you dont call that systematic? last time i checked that messed up man you dont kill 20000 + people and say "O, its ok" no its wrong and our nation is ignorant americans who cant even point out Africa on a map thats how dumb our country is becoming. More kids identify Joe camel than Mickey Mouse thats when you know Sh** aint right. but more than anything else ,its people like you that dont realize that theres SOO MANY PEOPLE DIEING, and you dont think its systematic, if it wasnt than we would have reported those #'s if it wasnt than we would appologized, if it wasnt than we woulda pulled out and said we need a better approach, dude thats the same thing, as genocide, its just not telling anyone and no one can do anything to stop us.
What about the human rights of the people in saddams mass graves, ---- rooms, and wmd victims?
how can you believe in America yet compare us to Hitler?
 
suzy

suzy

Member
Originally Posted by reefraff
http:///forum/post/2526780
Yeah, the Iraqis were so much better off under Saddam, especially the Kurds and Shiites

They had food, water and homes. Was it what WE think they wanted? Maybe not, but was our invasion wanted? We are trying to tell them they should be like us, have elections and the like. Impose our way of life on them.
Tibet actually wants our help. By your reasoning, we should invade China.
 
sigmachris

sigmachris

Active Member
Originally Posted by Suzy
http:///forum/post/2526803
They had food, water and homes. Was it what WE think they wanted? Maybe not, but was our invasion wanted? We are trying to tell them they should be like us, have elections and the like. Impose our way of life on them.
Tibet actually wants our help. By your reasoning, we should invade China.
Of course we wouldn't invade China and we aren't going to boycott the Olympics. We MAY take a stand and boycott the opening ceromonies though...that will show them.
 
reefraff

reefraff

Active Member
Originally Posted by Suzy
http:///forum/post/2526803
They had food, water and homes. Was it what WE think they wanted? Maybe not, but was our invasion wanted? We are trying to tell them they should be like us, have elections and the like. Impose our way of life on them.
Tibet actually wants our help. By your reasoning, we should invade China.
Maybe you should read up on the UN oil for food scandle. All that oil that was supposed to go to buying food, built palaces and bought expensive cars and stuff.
I don't know where you dug up this we want to impose our way of life on them crap. I've heard it said time and again by US and Iraqi official that an Iraqi democracy will look nothing like a western one. I guess you don't like the idea of them being a democracy?
 
stdreb27

stdreb27

Active Member
Originally Posted by Veeraj87
http:///forum/post/2526657
http://www.nytimes.com/2005/10/30/in...civilians.html
http://www.commondreams.org/headlines04/1031-01.htm
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2004/dec/09/iraq.iraq
http://www.countercurrents.org/iraq-usborne311005.htm
Now if you read these, they have the #'s estimated cuz no one knows becuz weve done a great job of hiding the #, but i would say its enough to know why so many people hate us, we dont support what we say sadly, and that is to bring human rights, where is the human rights for all those that died? 20000+, how many 911's is that ? you dont call that systematic? last time i checked that messed up man you dont kill 20000 + people and say "O, its ok" no its wrong and our nation is ignorant americans who cant even point out Africa on a map thats how dumb our country is becoming. More kids identify Joe camel than Mickey Mouse thats when you know Sh** aint right. but more than anything else ,its people like you that dont realize that theres SOO MANY PEOPLE DIEING, and you dont think its systematic, if it wasnt than we would have reported those #'s if it wasnt than we would appologized, if it wasnt than we woulda pulled out and said we need a better approach, dude thats the same thing, as genocide, its just not telling anyone and no one can do anything to stop us.
you need to go to a holocaust museum. Last I checked we weren't loading entire families into box cars taking them to camps, gassing the ones who couldn't work starving the rest. And no 20,000 people don't compare 11 million.
 
reefraff

reefraff

Active Member
Originally Posted by stdreb27
http:///forum/post/2526824
kid,
you need to go to a holocaust museum. Last I checked we weren't loading entire families into box cars taking them to camps, gassing the ones who couldn't work starving the rest. And no 20,000 people don't compare 11 million.

Is that a kid? I figured older cause most kids today are too young to remeber an ad campaign (joe Camel) that ended 10 years ago.
 
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