Republican Candidates

[stdreb27]

Originally Posted by Rylan1
Face it... reducing taxes is going to be an empty promise. Think about... if the war in Iraq continues... if we build the fence along the border...reduce the defecit....invest in new and domestic energy. A "fair tax" will reduce the tax base... So where are we going to get the money to fund these projects... Social Security... think about it.
Idealogy is just different, you look for government for help. I want them to stay the heck out of my kitchen.
You know what else is funny, every time in the last 50 years we have had a "tax cut" like with Regan, Bush. The actual income of the IRS goes up? You can look at the numbers.

 

[1journeyman]

Originally Posted by Rylan1
.... I think an overhaul of the system would lower costs and while lowering expenses for hospitals.
Can you name a single time when the government has regulated anything (on the scale Obama is proposing) where the efficiency went up while costs went down?
That's delusional Rylan. What will occur is the same thing that has occurred in every other nation with "universal" care. Efficiency will skyrocket, the medical field will lose needed employees, waiting lines will appear, and quality of care will diminish.
Let's face it; "Universal health care" is a bribe to get votes. It will do nothing but hurt our country long term. If he really cared about the system he'd revamp Medicare/Cade and be done.

 

[darthtang aw]

Originally Posted by 1journeyman
ish.
Let's face it; "Universal health care" is a bribe to get votes. It will do nothing but hurt our country long term. If he really cared about the system he'd revamp Medicare/Cade and be done.

Considering some of the top donations obama and Hilary have received come from pharmacutical companies and some HMO's, I will be surprised if they go ahead with their healthcare plans anyway...lol.

 

[darthtang aw]

I do have one more point to make as well, which actually sides with Rylan on this. Our taxes will go up no matter who is in office. In the entire history of this country we have never fought a war that lasted over 1 year without eventually having to raise taxes or the government campaign for government bonds. We will do one of the two soon as Iraq/afghanistan/war on terror, is putting a small strain on us now. Plus the american people have yet to truly sacrifice of themselves yet for these conflicts, which appalls me, with the exception of those families with troops in the campaign.
To those that support this war, I propose you a question, do you believe in what we are doing so much to allow your taxes to be raised a bit to continue funding it? I know I do.
Sorry, but McCain has been right about this one issue. You can't go to war without your ENTIRE country sacrificing somehow and someway....we have yet to do that. Of course many don't support the Iraq war....we have no vested interest in it personally.....tax us and we do.

 

[jennythebugg]

canada is really suffering up there with their healthcare system

 

[stdreb27]

Originally Posted by Darthtang AW
To those that support this war, I propose you a question, do you believe in what we are doing so much to allow your taxes to be raised a bit to continue funding it? I know I do.
I would support a streamlining of the Federal Government, to help pay. Instead of funding pork. I think it is silly it insinuate that the only way to fund this war is to raise taxes. It assumes that there is no other place to divert the money from. You know like NOT bailing out already rich lenders from their bad lending practices, or not bailing out people foolish enough to buy a bigger house then they can afford.

 

[rudedog40]

Originally Posted by stdreb27
I would support a streamlining of the Federal Government, to help pay. Instead of funding pork. I think it is silly it insinuate that the only way to fund this war is to raise taxes. It assumes that there is no other place to divert the money from. You know like NOT bailing out already rich lenders from their bad lending practices, or not bailing out people foolish enough to buy a bigger house then they can afford.

How about taking the war money and using it for something else? If they can find money to support a country (Iraq), why not support the homeland first? Look at the billions of dollars that have been spent on this war so far. How much in healthcare services would that have paid for the citizens of THE UNITED STATES? We've been through the 'war mess' in numerous other threads, but I've personally seen no benefit from this 'war' (and please don't say 'your security from terrorism and your democratic freedom.'

)

 

[rudedog40]

Originally Posted by Rylan1
First the system would cost $50-$65 billion which would be federal. The plan would have monthly premiums and copays like private ins. The plan would be targeted towards people with no insurance. It would also be open to others who wanted to switch and pay for it. It also would be deducted from payroll like other ins. This is Obama's plan... Hilary's is a more true univeral plan.
Face it... reducing taxes is going to be an empty promise. Think about... if the war in Iraq continues... if we build the fence along the border...reduce the defecit....invest in new and domestic energy. A "fair tax" will reduce the tax base... So where are we going to get the money to fund these projects... Social Security... think about it.

Social Security? I've been paying into that system for over 40 years, and most likely won't see a dime of it. I'm the last of the Baby Boomers, and they've pretty much said that it's a tossup right now if any of us get anything back from Social Security. The only reason I haven't complained is because I'm essentially paying my mother's SS and Medicare/Medicaid with the money I still put in today...

 

[1journeyman]

Originally Posted by Darthtang AW
To those that support this war, I propose you a question, do you believe in what we are doing so much to allow your taxes to be raised a bit to continue funding it? I know I do.
Sorry, but McCain has been right about this one issue. You can't go to war without your ENTIRE country sacrificing somehow and someway....we have yet to do that. Of course many don't support the Iraq war....we have no vested interest in it personally.....tax us and we do.
I agree. I have no problem with higher taxes as long as it's for the war and not the war + a horde of failing social programs.

 

[1journeyman]

Originally Posted by jennythebugg
canada is really suffering up there with their healthcare system
Despite the fact that Canada has a much smaller population, and despite the fact that they don't have the illegal immigration issue we have, there has been a lot of recent press about the failings of the Canadian system.

 

[stdreb27]

lol, How about, after the war ends, and we win, We stop burning the money funding more federal programs, and let me keep more of my own, hard earned money?

 

[reefraff]

You see the Hillerbeast's "economic stimulus package"?
For all the moaning and whining about how much Bush has ran up the debt this package is a giveaway to low income people. 30 billion to people too stupid to figure out they were tanking out a

[hr]
they couldn't afford to pay and another 40 billion in mostly programs for poor folks. Sorry but my disabled butt already pays enough taxes for the poor.

 

[stdreb27]

Originally Posted by reefraff
You see the Hillerbeast's "economic stimulus package"?
For all the moaning and whining about how much Bush has ran up the debt this package is a giveaway to low income people. 30 billion to people too stupid to figure out they were tanking out a

[hr]
they couldn't afford to pay and another 40 billion in mostly programs for poor folks. Sorry but my disabled butt already pays enough taxes for the poor.
As what was said on the news, might as well fly around in a Helicopter dropping baskets of money. The problem is that Bush and congress will prolly be proposing something simular in the comming weeks for our mythical resession.

 

[stdreb27]

Originally Posted by 1journeyman
Despite the fact that Canada has a much smaller population, and despite the fact that they don't have the illegal immigration issue we have, there has been a lot of recent press about the failings of the Canadian system.
I'll taking suffering to pay for my medicine then living with a painful condition for 9 months waiting for a procedure. Because of the govt's inefficiancy.
Rylan, will you please name me ONE federal government program that after being nationalized is more efficient?

 

[darthtang aw]

Originally Posted by rudedog40
How about taking the war money and using it for something else? If they can find money to support a country (Iraq), why not support the homeland first? Look at the billions of dollars that have been spent on this war so far. How much in healthcare services would that have paid for the citizens of THE UNITED STATES? We've been through the 'war mess' in numerous other threads, but I've personally seen no benefit from this 'war' (and please don't say 'your security from terrorism and your democratic freedom.'

)

Ok here is a break down of how the budget was spent for this 2007 year as of right now.
These are rough numbers and not exact. As the total figures are not quite in yet.
Under 15 billion dollars-corp of engineers---up from all previous years.
under 5 billion executive office of the president---down from 3 previous years
Legislative branch under 10 billion, the same as previous years
national science foundation, 10 billion the same as previous years
department of commerce just over 12 billion---up from previous years
departmentt of state 15 billion the same
EPA-10 billion the same as previous
Dept. of ********--11 billion the same
International assistance programs- 15 billion up from previous years
nasa 15 billion the same
Independent agencies 20 billion up from previous years
Homeland security around 70 billion, DOWN from 2006
Department of energy 20 billion up from previous years
Judicial branch 50 billion a little higher than last year
HUD---50 billion up from previous years
Department of education 61 billion, not as high as 2006's 80 billion but higher than all previous years
Department of labor 45 billion up from 2 previous years
Dept of transportation around 60 billion, up from all previous years
VA 75 billion, more than any other previous year
Personnel management office 60 billion up from other years
Department of agriculture, 80 billion, down from last year but still greatly higher than other previous years
Department of defense right around 550 billion higher than the past three years
DEPARTMANT OF HEALTH AND HUMAN SERVICES 680 BILLION DOLLARS. UP FROM LAST YEARS 580 BILLION AND HIGHER THAN ANY OTHER PREVIOUS YEAR IN OUR HISTORY...HOW MUCH MORE DO YOU WANT TO SPEND?
TREASURY DEPARTMENT (INCLUDES OUR INTEREST FOR THE DEBT WE OWE. 500 billion 406 billion of which is interest paid.
the only other agency close to what we spend on health and human service was the soicial securit administration which received 620 billion dollars. Higher than any other previous year.
So between social security and health and human services we have spent 1.3 trillion dollars, how much more do you want to spend here?

 

[bang guy]

Originally Posted by stdreb27
I'll taking suffering to pay for my medicine then living with a painful condition for 9 months waiting for a procedure. Because of the govt's inefficiancy.
Rylan, will you please name me ONE federal government program that after being nationalized is more efficient?
The IRS.

 

[rudedog40]

Originally Posted by Darthtang AW
Ok here is a break down of how the budget was spent for this 2007 year as of right now.
These are rough numbers and not exact. As the total figures are not quite in yet.
Under 15 billion dollars-corp of engineers---up from all previous years.
under 5 billion executive office of the president---down from 3 previous years
Legislative branch under 10 billion, the same as previous years
national science foundation, 10 billion the same as previous years
department of commerce just over 12 billion---up from previous years
departmentt of state 15 billion the same
EPA-10 billion the same as previous
Dept. of ********--11 billion the same
International assistance programs- 15 billion up from previous years
nasa 15 billion the same
Independent agencies 20 billion up from previous years
Homeland security around 70 billion, DOWN from 2006
Department of energy 20 billion up from previous years
Judicial branch 50 billion a little higher than last year
HUD---50 billion up from previous years
Department of education 61 billion, not as high as 2006's 80 billion but higher than all previous years
Department of labor 45 billion up from 2 previous years
Dept of transportation around 60 billion, up from all previous years
VA 75 billion, more than any other previous year
Personnel management office 60 billion up from other years
Department of agriculture, 80 billion, down from last year but still greatly higher than other previous years
Department of defense right around 550 billion higher than the past three years
DEPARTMANT OF HEALTH AND HUMAN SERVICES 680 BILLION DOLLARS. UP FROM LAST YEARS 580 BILLION AND HIGHER THAN ANY OTHER PREVIOUS YEAR IN OUR HISTORY...HOW MUCH MORE DO YOU WANT TO SPEND?
TREASURY DEPARTMENT (INCLUDES OUR INTEREST FOR THE DEBT WE OWE. 500 billion 406 billion of which is interest paid.
the only other agency close to what we spend on health and human service was the soicial securit administration which received 620 billion dollars. Higher than any other previous year.
So between social security and health and human services we have spent 1.3 trillion dollars, how much more do you want to spend here?
Hey, I won't disagree with you the government has spent billions supporting medicare/medicade. The main reason those figures are so high is because the doctors, hospitals, and any other medical providers have inflated their bills ten-fold, or charged the same procedure 10 times for one patient to make those costs so high. One of the biggest frauds against the government is cheating the medicare/medicaid system. If they would regulate and audit that department more efficiently, you'd probably see that 680 billion cut in half, if not a third.
As far as the Dept. of Defense, I imagine more than half that budget went to support rebuilding Iraq. Imagine what private health organizations could do with 250 billion. That could provide quite a few free services for people who go to county hospitals.

 

[mfp1016]

Originally Posted by Bang Guy
The IRS.
Thats probably the funniest joke I'e heard today. Thanks

 

[mfp1016]

Originally Posted by rudedog40
How about taking the war money and using it for something else? If they can find money to support a country (Iraq), why not support the homeland first? Look at the billions of dollars that have been spent on this war so far. How much in healthcare services would that have paid for the citizens of THE UNITED STATES? We've been through the 'war mess' in numerous other threads, but I've personally seen no benefit from this 'war' (and please don't say 'your security from terrorism and your democratic freedom.'

)
I personally see no benefit in pouring money into social programs that consistently fail.

 

[rylan1]

Originally Posted by rudedog40
Hey, I won't disagree with you the government has spent billions supporting medicare/medicade. The main reason those figures are so high is because the doctors, hospitals, and any other medical providers have inflated their bills ten-fold, or charged the same procedure 10 times for one patient to make those costs so high. One of the biggest frauds against the government is cheating the medicare/medicaid system. If they would regulate and audit that department more efficiently, you'd probably see that 680 billion cut in half, if not a third.
As far as the Dept. of Defense, I imagine more than half that budget went to support rebuilding Iraq. Imagine what private health organizations could do with 250 billion. That could provide quite a few free services for people who go to county hospitals.
I wonder whats going to happen to the budget and taxes as baby bommers retire?