Same Sex Marriage Okayed In New York ... Your Thoughts?
- Thread starter bigarn
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teresaq
Active Member
I have one question for those who oppose. What if it was your child. A child you raised and loved. What would you do. Would you disown them for the way they were born. Would you hurt the child you love because they were born gay.
T ( love other as you would want to be loved)
T ( love other as you would want to be loved)
old hickory
Member
And you can add homosexual priests, who adorn themselves with holier than though religious trinkets, preaching about morality while sexually abusing alter boys to that list.
Quote:
Originally Posted by smartorl http:///forum/thread/386373/same-sex-marriage-okayed-in-new-york-your-thoughts/80#post_3393481
Let us not forget the KKK members that sat in church feeling holier than thou only to burn crosses, commit murder and promote the suffering of innocent people because they had the misfortune of being born black and in their community.
Quote:
Originally Posted by smartorl http:///forum/thread/386373/same-sex-marriage-okayed-in-new-york-your-thoughts/80#post_3393481
Let us not forget the KKK members that sat in church feeling holier than thou only to burn crosses, commit murder and promote the suffering of innocent people because they had the misfortune of being born black and in their community.
scott t
Active Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bang Guy http:///forum/thread/386373/same-sex-marriage-okayed-in-new-york-your-thoughts/100#post_3393483
I'll have to admit that for a Democrat, Governor Cuomo has quite a few positive accomplishments under his belt already. I didn't vote for him as I didn't trust him. He has shown I made an error (so far).
Yes, I was also worried about him and did not trust him because he came from the house of Cuomo, I did vote for him, and I am also hoping that he will not disappoint, but yes he has done well so far also. Also, bang Guy I like the new Avatar!!!!!
Originally Posted by Bang Guy http:///forum/thread/386373/same-sex-marriage-okayed-in-new-york-your-thoughts/100#post_3393483
I'll have to admit that for a Democrat, Governor Cuomo has quite a few positive accomplishments under his belt already. I didn't vote for him as I didn't trust him. He has shown I made an error (so far).
Yes, I was also worried about him and did not trust him because he came from the house of Cuomo, I did vote for him, and I am also hoping that he will not disappoint, but yes he has done well so far also. Also, bang Guy I like the new Avatar!!!!!
rslinger
Member
Wow I love this debate. I am sad to say I live in a state were same sex marriage is against the state constitution. There is a civil union registration though. I applaud all you homosexual people out there who have to fight for a place in this world to feel normal. I am also appalled by other heterosexuals as myself who find it easier to be bigots than to open there eyes and admit the truth.
scott t
Active Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rslinger http:///forum/thread/386373/same-sex-marriage-okayed-in-new-york-your-thoughts/100#post_3393488
Wow I love this debate. I am sad to say I live in a state were same sex marriage is against the state constitution. There is a civil union registration though. I applaud all you homosexual people out there who have to fight for a place in this world to feel normal. I am also appalled by other heterosexuals as myself who find it easier to be bigots than to open there eyes and admit the truth.
I love this Debate also, I love to debate issues no matter what they are, I will always stand up for what I believe in and will not back down from anyone, but on the same token I will always be respectful of others and their opinions.
It is a struggle, on that I have battled with for a lot of years, not to mention one that was also an internal battle, when discovering who I was i have open about who I am for 20 years. It is a hard thing to deal with and think about, that in the very moment that you say those three words to people who are close to you, People that you love that in that very moment that you say,"I am Gay". that you can lose everything that has meaning in your life. You just learn to live, you learn to go on, you learn to persevere, because it is the most liberating thing, that you do not have to live with lies, with deceit any longer. You can live free from that internal battle that has been raging inside of you, you can finally live your life. We who can overcome that battle are the lucky ones, the one that can not, that feel there is no other way out but to live with the lie to live with the deceit and choose never to be happy, or to take their own life are the one who are unlucky.
Originally Posted by Rslinger http:///forum/thread/386373/same-sex-marriage-okayed-in-new-york-your-thoughts/100#post_3393488
Wow I love this debate. I am sad to say I live in a state were same sex marriage is against the state constitution. There is a civil union registration though. I applaud all you homosexual people out there who have to fight for a place in this world to feel normal. I am also appalled by other heterosexuals as myself who find it easier to be bigots than to open there eyes and admit the truth.
I love this Debate also, I love to debate issues no matter what they are, I will always stand up for what I believe in and will not back down from anyone, but on the same token I will always be respectful of others and their opinions.
It is a struggle, on that I have battled with for a lot of years, not to mention one that was also an internal battle, when discovering who I was i have open about who I am for 20 years. It is a hard thing to deal with and think about, that in the very moment that you say those three words to people who are close to you, People that you love that in that very moment that you say,"I am Gay". that you can lose everything that has meaning in your life. You just learn to live, you learn to go on, you learn to persevere, because it is the most liberating thing, that you do not have to live with lies, with deceit any longer. You can live free from that internal battle that has been raging inside of you, you can finally live your life. We who can overcome that battle are the lucky ones, the one that can not, that feel there is no other way out but to live with the lie to live with the deceit and choose never to be happy, or to take their own life are the one who are unlucky.
reefraff
Active Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by WangoTango http:///forum/thread/386373/same-sex-marriage-okayed-in-new-york-your-thoughts/80#post_3393469
Because it is illegal. As far as I knew, same-sex marriage was not illegal, it just plain wasn't recognized as anything. Had it been illegal prior to this bill then I think this debate would be different. Should polygamy be re-legalized on just pure matters of law? Or on moral issues; is it more/as/less destructive as same-sex marriage or even heterosexual marriage? Is it destructive period?
Point is if the government can tell churches they can't perform polygamous marriages why can't they say they must perform same sex marriages? Like I said upthread, with the current supreme court I think ultimately any such order wouldn't stand but it could be a costly court fight.
Originally Posted by WangoTango http:///forum/thread/386373/same-sex-marriage-okayed-in-new-york-your-thoughts/80#post_3393469
Because it is illegal. As far as I knew, same-sex marriage was not illegal, it just plain wasn't recognized as anything. Had it been illegal prior to this bill then I think this debate would be different. Should polygamy be re-legalized on just pure matters of law? Or on moral issues; is it more/as/less destructive as same-sex marriage or even heterosexual marriage? Is it destructive period?
Point is if the government can tell churches they can't perform polygamous marriages why can't they say they must perform same sex marriages? Like I said upthread, with the current supreme court I think ultimately any such order wouldn't stand but it could be a costly court fight.
reefraff
Active Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bang Guy http:///forum/thread/386373/same-sex-marriage-okayed-in-new-york-your-thoughts/100#post_3393483
I'll have to admit that for a Democrat, Governor Cuomo has quite a few positive accomplishments under his belt already. I didn't vote for him as I didn't trust him. He has shown I made an error (so far).
Yeah, been following some of what he's done. Definitely a surprise.
Originally Posted by Bang Guy http:///forum/thread/386373/same-sex-marriage-okayed-in-new-york-your-thoughts/100#post_3393483
I'll have to admit that for a Democrat, Governor Cuomo has quite a few positive accomplishments under his belt already. I didn't vote for him as I didn't trust him. He has shown I made an error (so far).
Yeah, been following some of what he's done. Definitely a surprise.
darthtang aw
Active Member
Is it possible to con tinue the debate from a legal standpoint? To many bring in personal feelings about morality and unfortunately, through our own laws we created this is purely a legal argument. I ask again, if it was called civil union and was a federal law would you be ok with that scot? Not a marriage but a civil union....would this end the debate for you on this subject? Would your rights then be equal?
darthtang aw
Active Member
no... they would focus on something else rediculous. I understand your views and concerns regarding this issue Scott. Do I believe there should be gay marriage? Why not. Where is the harm in love, as for the topic of God..... god is all about love, love this love that....DO NOT JUDGE!! however, unfortunently opinions are like butt holes every one has one and some, some, want to push their beliefs, opinions, and of coarse take topics like this in other directions. Like Darth tang stated, it's about the laws and the laws are made by the law makers, gay or not. I work in the medical field and knew of a nurse that is gay. He was great to work with and was very trustworthy and lives his life just as "normal" as every body else. I mean come on people... Define NORMAL today this isn't Mayberry.So when I say it's of no concern of mine or I mean it. (unable to multi quote, sorry)
You need to reread the bible...your comments are wrong regarding it. I dislike when those not versed in it try to use it as their defense........
The only person that should be using god as a debate in this forum is flower.............the rest just manage to screw it up.
scott t
Active Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by Darthtang AW http:///forum/thread/386373/same-sex-marriage-okayed-in-new-york-your-thoughts/100#post_3393499
Is it possible to con tinue the debate from a legal standpoint? To many bring in personal feelings about morality and unfortunately, through our own laws we created this is purely a legal argument. I ask again, if it was called civil union and was a federal law would you be ok with that scot? Not a marriage but a civil union....would this end the debate for you on this subject? Would your rights then be equal?
For me Darthtang, If it was then I could live with that for others in the Homosexual community I am sure it would not, am I going to rush out tomorrow and get Married because the law in NY says I can, Prob. Not. Will I ever get married I do not know that either. Does it change things because it is legal here in NY on the Federal level, it does not. Does it make it easier in NY for Homosexual couples, on some level it does. Does it mean that Homosexuality is considered Valid, No it does not. Does it mean that I have more standing as a Homosexual Legally in some aspects it does, and in others it does not. Legally marriage is a contract between two people that holds weight in the eyes of the law, that affords them privileges in the way things are handled legally. Does it change the fact of the way they are treated as Homosexuals, no it does not. There are injustices against many people in this country, and I would fight for any of them, no just the Homosexual community. I am not that narrow minded, I am not that closed about other issues that affect the lives of many. I care about Issues that have to deal with the elderly, children, women, education, taxes, healthcare. My views are broad, my way of thinking everyone should be treated EQUAL no matter who you are...
Originally Posted by Darthtang AW http:///forum/thread/386373/same-sex-marriage-okayed-in-new-york-your-thoughts/100#post_3393499
Is it possible to con tinue the debate from a legal standpoint? To many bring in personal feelings about morality and unfortunately, through our own laws we created this is purely a legal argument. I ask again, if it was called civil union and was a federal law would you be ok with that scot? Not a marriage but a civil union....would this end the debate for you on this subject? Would your rights then be equal?
For me Darthtang, If it was then I could live with that for others in the Homosexual community I am sure it would not, am I going to rush out tomorrow and get Married because the law in NY says I can, Prob. Not. Will I ever get married I do not know that either. Does it change things because it is legal here in NY on the Federal level, it does not. Does it make it easier in NY for Homosexual couples, on some level it does. Does it mean that Homosexuality is considered Valid, No it does not. Does it mean that I have more standing as a Homosexual Legally in some aspects it does, and in others it does not. Legally marriage is a contract between two people that holds weight in the eyes of the law, that affords them privileges in the way things are handled legally. Does it change the fact of the way they are treated as Homosexuals, no it does not. There are injustices against many people in this country, and I would fight for any of them, no just the Homosexual community. I am not that narrow minded, I am not that closed about other issues that affect the lives of many. I care about Issues that have to deal with the elderly, children, women, education, taxes, healthcare. My views are broad, my way of thinking everyone should be treated EQUAL no matter who you are...
reefraff
Active Member
One mess that will have to be sorted out is federal tax status. If a couple marries in New York and moves to a state that doesn't recognize gay marriage what happens to the tax treatment? Wouldn't be able to file as married in the new state so I assume couldn't on Federal either.
bionicarm
Active Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by reefraff http:///forum/thread/386373/same-sex-marriage-okayed-in-new-york-your-thoughts/100#post_3393507
One mess that will have to be sorted out is federal tax status. If a couple marries in New York and moves to a state that doesn't recognize gay marriage what happens to the tax treatment? Wouldn't be able to file as married in the new state so I assume couldn't on Federal either.
Does bring up an interesting point. I assume if you are legally married in New York, then your Federal Tax status would follow you no matter where you lived in the country. But then again, you'd have to read the entire New York resolution to see if it adresses Federal Tax status. As far as other states? They can move to Texas. We don't have a state income tax.
Originally Posted by reefraff http:///forum/thread/386373/same-sex-marriage-okayed-in-new-york-your-thoughts/100#post_3393507
One mess that will have to be sorted out is federal tax status. If a couple marries in New York and moves to a state that doesn't recognize gay marriage what happens to the tax treatment? Wouldn't be able to file as married in the new state so I assume couldn't on Federal either.
Does bring up an interesting point. I assume if you are legally married in New York, then your Federal Tax status would follow you no matter where you lived in the country. But then again, you'd have to read the entire New York resolution to see if it adresses Federal Tax status. As far as other states? They can move to Texas. We don't have a state income tax.
darthtang aw
Active Member
State law wont affect federal law...so federal taxation and so on will niot change.
reefraff
Active Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by Darthtang AW http:///forum/thread/386373/same-sex-marriage-okayed-in-new-york-your-thoughts/100#post_3393510
State law wont affect federal law...so federal taxation and so on will niot change.
Currently because the Defense of marriage act is the law gay couples can't file as married. Not sure that's a huge disadvantage unless there is an issue with tax credits or something.
Originally Posted by Darthtang AW http:///forum/thread/386373/same-sex-marriage-okayed-in-new-york-your-thoughts/100#post_3393510
State law wont affect federal law...so federal taxation and so on will niot change.
Currently because the Defense of marriage act is the law gay couples can't file as married. Not sure that's a huge disadvantage unless there is an issue with tax credits or something.
kiefers
Active Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by Darthtang AW http:///forum/thread/386373/same-sex-marriage-okayed-in-new-york-your-thoughts/100#post_3393503
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kiefers http:///forum/thread/386373/same-sex-marriage-okayed-in-new-york-your-thoughts/80#post_3393474
no... they would focus on something else rediculous. I understand your views and concerns regarding this issue Scott. Do I believe there should be gay marriage? Why not. Where is the harm in love, as for the topic of God..... god is all about love, love this love that....DO NOT JUDGE!! however, unfortunently opinions are like butt holes every one has one and some, some, want to push their beliefs, opinions, and of coarse take topics like this in other directions. Like Darth tang stated, it's about the laws and the laws are made by the law makers, gay or not. I work in the medical field and knew of a nurse that is gay. He was great to work with and was very trustworthy and lives his life just as "normal" as every body else. I mean come on people... Define NORMAL today this isn't Mayberry.So when I say it's of no concern of mine or I mean it. (unable to multi quote, sorry)
You need to reread the bible...your comments are wrong regarding it. I dislike when those not versed in it try to use it as their defense........
The only person that should be using god as a debate in this forum is flower.............the rest just manage to screw it up.
first and foremost, I don't believe I quoted any book, chapter or verse in my statement let alone use it as a reference of defense.
Originally Posted by Darthtang AW http:///forum/thread/386373/same-sex-marriage-okayed-in-new-york-your-thoughts/100#post_3393503
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kiefers http:///forum/thread/386373/same-sex-marriage-okayed-in-new-york-your-thoughts/80#post_3393474
no... they would focus on something else rediculous. I understand your views and concerns regarding this issue Scott. Do I believe there should be gay marriage? Why not. Where is the harm in love, as for the topic of God..... god is all about love, love this love that....DO NOT JUDGE!! however, unfortunently opinions are like butt holes every one has one and some, some, want to push their beliefs, opinions, and of coarse take topics like this in other directions. Like Darth tang stated, it's about the laws and the laws are made by the law makers, gay or not. I work in the medical field and knew of a nurse that is gay. He was great to work with and was very trustworthy and lives his life just as "normal" as every body else. I mean come on people... Define NORMAL today this isn't Mayberry.So when I say it's of no concern of mine or I mean it. (unable to multi quote, sorry)
You need to reread the bible...your comments are wrong regarding it. I dislike when those not versed in it try to use it as their defense........
The only person that should be using god as a debate in this forum is flower.............the rest just manage to screw it up.
first and foremost, I don't believe I quoted any book, chapter or verse in my statement let alone use it as a reference of defense.
darthtang aw
Active Member
first and foremost, I don't believe I quoted any book, chapter or verse in my statement let alone use it as a reference of defense.
Then where were you basing your statement about god from?
darthtang aw
Active Member
By the way, I love you title under your avatar...when mine were puppies we used to get asked if they were labs all the time.
flower
Well-Known Member
Quote:
Originally Posted by Old Hickory http:///forum/thread/386373/same-sex-marriage-okayed-in-new-york-your-thoughts/80#post_3393460
Apparently you're having trouble following this. He said, he wasn't, to paraphrase, an in-your-face homosexual. He clearly is, evidenced by his avatar. It is the defining characteristic of his that he wants to share with strangers. While we chose trivial avatars that are not offensive and impersonal, he intentionally chose an avatar that is inflammatory to great portion of the American population and very personal. He clearly is an in-your-face homosexual and I was simply pointing that fact out.
You have got to be kidding.....not shoving ones lifestyle in anothers face does not mean hide in a corner
Now professor ...Do you know what an avatar is? It is something that represents you, that is not shoving anything down anyones throat.
The only avatar I found disturbing.... well two......is the little moving stick figure cartoon where it flashes....good thing I don't have epilepsy, and Maxalmon's avatar on the thread..... Foamback project 101...
Originally Posted by Old Hickory http:///forum/thread/386373/same-sex-marriage-okayed-in-new-york-your-thoughts/80#post_3393460
Apparently you're having trouble following this. He said, he wasn't, to paraphrase, an in-your-face homosexual. He clearly is, evidenced by his avatar. It is the defining characteristic of his that he wants to share with strangers. While we chose trivial avatars that are not offensive and impersonal, he intentionally chose an avatar that is inflammatory to great portion of the American population and very personal. He clearly is an in-your-face homosexual and I was simply pointing that fact out.
You have got to be kidding.....not shoving ones lifestyle in anothers face does not mean hide in a corner
Now professor ...Do you know what an avatar is? It is something that represents you, that is not shoving anything down anyones throat.
The only avatar I found disturbing.... well two......is the little moving stick figure cartoon where it flashes....good thing I don't have epilepsy, and Maxalmon's avatar on the thread..... Foamback project 101...