T5 vs Metal Halide debate answered

[ibew]

you deffentily better catch up in some notes and I am getting upset in all of this knowledge that comes from were (another forum) I wanted a good link franker that was also BS and a light meter by the way if you even know how to use it is like not even 45% accurate your better off with like a lux meter

 

[reefeel]

Originally Posted by TX Reef
Right now!
About the last 6 months there has been an explosion of T5 users. Now that many have jumped on the T5 bandwagon and had success keeping SPS, they want to compare them to MH.
By the way, I am not saying T5s are crap, I just don't believe in them.
Guess I missed the bandwagon, I have HQI, VHO, PC, and maybe I'll run t-5s on my fuge

 

[ibew]

both commercial and industrial

 

[fanker]

wow ur a really negative person, even if u are an electricion, ur facts can still be wrong

 

[ibew]

no u didnt u would have gotten into p=E.I power is equal to voltage times resistance then you might have gotten into newtons laws also

 

[squishy]

I have to ask if I am reading this right . Someone said that heat affects lumens and that is why your bulb has a fan in it to make more lumens :thinking: . So if this is correct if I put a fan beside a candle I can have more than one measument of candle power. :thinking: Metal halides are better. there is my 2 cents.
Lumn is the standard unit for the luminous flux of a light source. It is an SI derived unit based on the candela. It can be defined as the luminous flux emitted into unit solid angle (1 sr) by an isotropic point source having a luminous intensity of 1 candela. The unit lumen is then equal to cd x sr. The abbreviation is lm and the symbol is Fv. In terms of radiant power (also called radiant flux) it can be expressed as:
Luminous flux in lumens = Radiant power (watts) x 683 lumens/watt x luminous efficacy
The luminous flux is the part of the power which is perceived as light by the human eye, and the figure 683 lumens/watt is based upon the sensitivity of the eye at 555 nm, the peak efficiency of the photopic (daylight) vision curve. The luminous efficacy is 1 at that frequency.
A typical 100 watt incandescent bulb has a luminous flux of about 1700 lumens.
Units for other quantities in photometry contain the lumen, such as the lux (lumens/meter2)
there is something to think about.

 

[ibew]

listen kid its one thing to to be right because of experienceing it I would let you rant all day but its another thing to think you know what you are talking about and explaining wrongly to other people that makes you ignorant

 

[ibew]

Originally Posted by Squishy
I have to ask if I am reading this right . Someone said that heat affects lumens and that is why your bulb has a fan in it to make more lumens :thinking: . So if this is correct if I put a fan beside a candle I can have more than one measument of candle power. :thinking: Metal halides are better. there is my 2 cents.
Lumn is the standard unit for the luminous flux of a light source. It is an SI derived unit based on the candela. It can be defined as the luminous flux emitted into unit solid angle (1 sr) by an isotropic point source having a luminous intensity of 1 candela. The unit lumen is then equal to cd x sr. The abbreviation is lm and the symbol is Fv. In terms of radiant power (also called radiant flux) it can be expressed as:
Luminous flux in lumens = Radiant power (watts) x 683 lumens/watt x luminous efficacy
The luminous flux is the part of the power which is perceived as light by the human eye, and the figure 683 lumens/watt is based upon the sensitivity of the eye at 555 nm, the peak efficiency of the photopic (daylight) vision curve. The luminous efficacy is 1 at that frequency.
A typical 100 watt incandescent bulb has a luminous flux of about 1700 lumens.
Units for other quantities in photometry contain the lumen, such as the lux (lumens/meter2)
there is something to think about.

exactlly

that is why you need a lux meter to measure it

 

[acrylic51]

You guys are wasting your time on IBEW....he will think what he wants to and the bottom line it was summed up on the 1st page of the thread and we all know it comes down to PAR.....It's not about being able to wire a ballast correctly which anyone can do.........Get off your high horse dude!!!!!!!!

 

[fanker]

Originally Posted by acrylic51
You guys are wasting your time on IBEW....he will think what he wants to and the bottom line it was summed up on the 1st page of the thread and we all know it comes down to PAR.....It's not about being able to wire a ballast correctly which anyone can do.........Get off your high horse dude!!!!!!!!

thanks ur right

 

[ibew]

this is how you provide info look at squishys threads and if you dont know or doubt your opoinon then do not post

 

[ibew]

yes I do applogize for loseing my temper just sick of hearing the same old talk normally just sit back which I just got fed up

 

[acrylic51]

Originally Posted by Ibew
this is how you provide info look at squishys threads and if you dont know or doubt your opoinon then do not post
Dude if you would take the time to get off the porch and read the lux meter doesn't mean squat.....I guess you know alittle more about lighting and such than Bob Goemans?????? Why don't you pick up Novembers issue of FAMA and read!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Lux i the intensity of light falling on a specific area..........How light gets from and to its target is something manufacturers canot perceive. So they don't generally include this parameter in their data sheets.
Lumens is the total amunt of light a lamp is capable of generating. This reference term for aquarium purposes is somewhat misleading because it is geared to what the human eye perceives which is more sensitive to midgrange colors in the visible spectrum (e.g. reen and yellow).
And of course the bottom line is PAR!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

PAR stands for Photosynthetically Active Radiation . Measures light intensity over the visible spectrum (400 to 700 nm), whch is somewhat different from lux that reports the intensity of those wavelengths to whch the human eye is most sensitive (largely the green wavelengths). It can be said that PAR is keyed to photosynthetic response whereas lumens is keyed to human eye response.
Therefore, as the PAR value increases, more useable light will penetate into the aquarium, resultingin improved photoynthesis rocesses. PAR is measured in inits called micro-Einsteins.
Is there a formula for micro-Eisteins that you can break down for us?

 

[baytran7]

I think Fanker is right on this one if you go by Sylvania's T5 HO specs, Sylvania says:
# Higher lumen output: from 1850 lm to 4900 lm
# Almost constant lumen maintenance throughout the entire life of the lamp due to Luxline Plus triphosphor technology
# High colour rendering (Ra85/Class1B)
# For electronic ballast operation only giving greater efficiency and advantages in improved starting and life performance
# Optimised ambient operating temperature at 35° C (max lumen output) allows compact luminaire designs
# Reduced storage volume and transportation costs
# Average rated life: up to 20000 hours
Max lumen output is at 95 degrees Fahrenheit (35 degrees C), so It boils down to you get max lumens at higher temps, but your lamp life is reduced if the fixture does not release heat well. Also, lamp life is reduced only 10% max if you leave your lamp til it dies (I need to find the data on this one but I will post later)
I was hoping this wouldn't turn out to be a flame b/c we all have people from different specializations here that could give some really valuable input.

 

[fishieness]

Originally Posted by Ibew
this is how you provide info look at squishys threads and if you dont know or doubt your opoinon then do not post
squishy is doing a fine job, it is you we are all wondering about. you know your stuff... fine... great... but you dont have to attack people and think you are all knowing.
please.... no one is trying to be offensive... we are just trying to all voice our opinions. you may disagree with someone, but after all the research they have done, they arent likely to just let all that go and admit you are right because you mention a few things that most high school physics classes would know.
with that said, i am denouncing my participation in this thread.
although i will check back to read what people ahve to say... assuming it still has to do with the topic at hand
Both types of lighting are good, but it really isnt worth getting so upset about is it?
good bye everyone :hi

 

[ibew]

your 100% right I was 100% wrong for my actions again I do appoligize to franker and anyone I did offend I did get out of hand

 

[fanker]

its alright this is what we are supposed to do on a "discussion site"
lol

 

[ibew]

Originally Posted by acrylic51
Dude if you would take the time to get off the porch and read the lux meter doesn't mean squat.....I guess you know alittle more about lighting and such than Bob Goemans?????? Why don't you pick up Novembers issue of FAMA and read!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Lux i the intensity of light falling on a specific area..........How light gets from and to its target is something manufacturers canot perceive. So they don't generally include this parameter in their data sheets.
Lumens is the total amunt of light a lamp is capable of generating. This reference term for aquarium purposes is somewhat misleading because it is geared to what the human eye perceives which is more sensitive to midgrange colors in the visible spectrum (e.g. reen and yellow).
And of course the bottom line is PAR!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

PAR stands for Photosynthetically Active Radiation . Measures light intensity over the visible spectrum (400 to 700 nm), whch is somewhat different from lux that reports the intensity of those wavelengths to whch the human eye is most sensitive (largely the green wavelengths). It can be said that PAR is keyed to photosynthetic response whereas lumens is keyed to human eye response.
Therefore, as the PAR value increases, more useable light will penetate into the aquarium, resultingin improved photoynthesis rocesses. PAR is measured in inits called micro-Einsteins.
Is there a formula for micro-Eisteins that you can break down for us?
I never said that it was accurate also micro-Eisteins I have never learned the formula for it so no I couldn't but Im sure I have books some were that has the break down on it

 

[ibew]

I never claimed to know everything but I could somehow find out just about anything from people I work with or from previous school books but also might be out dated by now if I don't know something I will tell you not make up something

 

[lubeck]

does anyone know if keeping MH lighting at "optimal" temp has effect on the Par. i would love to know, becuase my fixture did not come with fans, i was concerned.
so does anyone have facts keeping mh bulbs cool to get the best PAR?