The Sobering Facts

[jerthunter]

Originally Posted by Jovial
I found this sentence in a law guide. http://www.lectlaw.com/def2/m150.htm
To constitute a birth, so as to make the killing of a child murder, the whole body must be detached from that of the mother; but if it has come wholly forth, but is still connected by the umbilical chord, such killing will be murder.
So if the baby is killed 5 minutes prior to being born it is considered an abortion and is legal?
Well that sure sounds like what the law is saying. Is it right or wrong? I personally will choose to sidestep that debate since I have no interest in it.
One interesting thing I have seen is people can get charged with two counts of murder for killing a pregnant woman.

 

[darknes]

Originally Posted by Jerthunter
One interesting thing I have seen is people can get charged with two counts of murder for killing a pregnant woman.
I never thought of that. So, what our society is saying: It is considered murder to kill a fetus unless you have permission from the mother.

 

[clown boy]

Originally Posted by Jerthunter
One interesting thing I have seen is people can get charged with two counts of murder for killing a pregnant woman.
I wish that the law was at least consistent...

 

[clown boy]

Originally Posted by Darknes
I never thought of that. So, what our society is saying: It is considered murder to kill a fetus unless you have permission from the mother.
LOL well said

 

[jovial]

Originally Posted by Jerthunter
Well that sure sounds like what the law is saying. Is it right or wrong? I personally will choose to sidestep that debate since I have no interest in it.
One interesting thing I have seen is people can get charged with two counts of murder for killing a pregnant woman.
Yeah, I dont understand why this can be illegal and the other is not?

 

[clown boy]

My question is: Why do people call it a fetus??? It's an unborn child, not a fetus! It can move, it has it's own brain and heart... just because it lives off of it's mother does not make it part of her body.

 

[jovial]

I agree Clown boy. Maybe by calling a little baby a fetus somehow makes abortion easier to live with because the baby is not seen as a person but an object or an it. Hard for me to see my kids as it's. Science I suppose.

 

[darknes]

Originally Posted by Clown Boy
My question is: Why do people call it a fetus??? It's an unborn child, not a fetus! It can move, it has it's own brain and heart... just because it lives off of it's mother does not make it part of her body.
Because that's the technical name.

 

[jerthunter]

Originally Posted by Darknes
Because that's the technical name.
A name is a name. We call something a certain name because that is the name we give it.

 

[crimzy]

I think people are missing the point of the abortion issue. No one is pro-abortion. No one thinks it is a good thing or should be used as a birth control measure.
The real issue presented is really just a choice of the lesser of two evils. Aborting a fetus is not a good thing under any circumstances. However, forcing a woman to carry a child to term and give birth to an unwanted child is also not a good thing. Neither are back-alley, coat hanger abortions. And the reality is that anyone who believes that most people will remain abstinate until marriage is kidding him/herself.
It's called pro-choice not pro-abortion. I believe that a woman's right to choose what she will do with her body is greater than the right of a FIRST TRIMESTER embryo. JMO.

 

[jovial]

I always liked the bumper sticker, it's a child not a choice. 1st trimester 2nd, 3rd whats the difference?

 

[clown boy]

I wonder if the Fish called Jonah a fetus just because he was in the fish's body...

 

[clown boy]

Originally Posted by crimzy
I think people are missing the point of the abortion issue. No one is pro-abortion. No one thinks it is a good thing or should be used as a birth control measure.
The real issue presented is really just a choice of the lesser of two evils. Aborting a fetus is not a good thing under any circumstances. However, forcing a woman to carry a child to term and give birth to an unwanted child is also not a good thing. Neither are back-alley, coat hanger abortions. And the reality is that anyone who believes that most people will remain abstinate until marriage is kidding him/herself.
It's called pro-choice not pro-abortion. I believe that a woman's right to choose what she will do with her body is greater than the right of a FIRST TRIMESTER embryo. JMO.
Pro-Choice? That's a lie! Babies don't choose to die!
So your saying that it's better that a child be killed then have a hard life?
You all must face it... we are talking about a child here. Not a fetus. Not an embryo.
At 5 years old, is the child a human?
At 2 years old, is the child a human?
At 6 months old, is the child a human?
At 7 days old, is the child a human?
At 1 day old, is the child a human?
At 1 hour old, is the child a human?
At 5 minutes old, is the child a human?
At 1 hour before birth, is the child a human?
At 3 months before birth, is the child a human?

 

[jerthunter]

Originally Posted by Clown Boy
Pro-Choice? That's a lie! Babies don't choose to die!
So your saying that it's better that a child be killed then have a hard life?
You all must face it... we are talking about a child here. Not a fetus. Not an embryo.
At 5 years old, is the child a human?
At 2 years old, is the child a human?
At 6 months old, is the child a human?
At 7 days old, is the child a human?
At 1 day old, is the child a human?
At 1 hour old, is the child a human?
At 5 minutes old, is the child a human?
At 1 hour before birth, is the child a human?
At 3 months before birth, is the child a human?
Soooo, lets here it. The punishment for getting an abortion should be...

 

[jovial]

Life

 

[reefreak29]

Originally Posted by Jmick
Other then that, did these groups do anything else to help the mother or the baby or was it just a tatic to shame them?
lol, there not trying to shame them there makeing the woman more knowledgable before making a harsh decisionunlike planned parent hood . there educating them and make them understand the sicological pain they will suffer from aborting a human child. theres alway people out there that want to adopt

 

[crimzy]

Originally Posted by Clown Boy
Pro-Choice? That's a lie! Babies don't choose to die!
So your saying that it's better that a child be killed then have a hard life?
You all must face it... we are talking about a child here. Not a fetus. Not an embryo.
At 5 years old, is the child a human?
At 2 years old, is the child a human?
At 6 months old, is the child a human?
At 7 days old, is the child a human?
At 1 day old, is the child a human?
At 1 hour old, is the child a human?
At 5 minutes old, is the child a human?
At 1 hour before birth, is the child a human?
At 3 months before birth, is the child a human?
Sorry man but I don't agree that this is a child with all the same rights. A first trimester embryo is little more than a collection of genetic cells. It does not have a gender, is not self aware, does not have a developed brain, does not have any developed senses, etc. It's unfortunate that they are sometimes destroyed but I do think that's a lesser evil than the alternative.

 

[jovial]

Originally Posted by crimzy
Sorry man but I don't agree that this is a child with all the same rights. A first trimester embryo is little more than a collection of genetic cells. It does not have a gender, is not self aware, does not have a developed brain, does not have any developed senses, etc. It's unfortunate that they are sometimes destroyed but I do think that's a lesser evil than the alternative.
So at what point to you make the distinction?

 

[reefreak29]

Originally Posted by crimzy
Sorry man but I don't agree that this is a child with all the same rights. A first trimester embryo is little more than a collection of genetic cells. It does not have a gender, is not self aware, does not have a developed brain, does not have any developed senses, etc. It's unfortunate that they are sometimes destroyed but I do think that's a lesser evil than the alternative.
they do have a heartbeat

 

[darknes]

Originally Posted by crimzy
Sorry man but I don't agree that this is a child with all the same rights. A first trimester embryo is little more than a collection of genetic cells. It does not have a gender, is not self aware, does not have a developed brain, does not have any developed senses, etc. It's unfortunate that they are sometimes destroyed but I do think that's a lesser evil than the alternative.
Do you believe partial-birth abortions should be legal?